Mary O
Old Newbie
Mary O
Old Newbie
Joined: February 2nd, 2014, 1:22 am

August 15th, 2014, 2:17 am #11

 
06-04-15

My apologies, but I've had to delete this information.

Haley25
Last edited by Mary O on June 5th, 2015, 1:05 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Smokie Treats
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Joined: December 31st, 2013, 12:03 am

August 15th, 2014, 4:00 am #12

Wait a second,

Isn't this the front of the Pines Card?





Just checking. I have a difficult time keeping things straight sometimes. Donna disappeared in October 1970. The Pines Card was sent in March 1971.

There is postage looking like it was stamped, and the handwriting looks a lot like Zodiac's handwriting. The lower case "d" above the crosshairs symbol. The checkmark "r".

Dang, look at the similarities to the other envelopes/ cards (compliments of the Eureka Card thread):





I think it is more likely that Zodiac sent the Pines Card than someone else because of Donna's disappearance, the timing, pasting of stuff like on the Halloween Card, and handwriting similarities.


Smokie

 
Last edited by Smokie Treats on August 15th, 2014, 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Tahoe27
DOJ
Joined: March 5th, 2007, 6:45 pm

August 15th, 2014, 4:36 am #13

I don't think the "Chronicle" written on the Pines card looks anything like the other "Chronicles".   Also, Zodiac never once made a capital "A" like that and he always incorrectly spelled victim as victom...not so on the Pines card.

Whoever created the Pines card was (badly) trying to mimic Zodiac, imo.   
"Sometimes the questions are complicated and the answers are simple". Dr. Suess   
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Smokie Treats
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Joined: December 31st, 2013, 12:03 am

August 15th, 2014, 2:18 pm #14

Tahoe:

The word "Chronicle" isn't entirely consistent among the seven samples. I would group the Eureka Card and Dragon Card together as being very similar, the Citizen Envelope and Examiner Letter together as being similar, the July 31 Envelope as being most unlike the others, and the Exorcist Envelope being somewhere in between the Exorcist Envelope and Citizen and Examiner samples.

After looking at some of the letters again, it appears that Zodiac had different writing styles. Some of the letters start with vertical handwriting but drift into handwriting that is slanted right, even on the same page.

The Pines Card:

C: Just a "C" and I don't see any distinguishing characteristics between any of them; I don't know.

h: Shaped similarly to the Citizen Envelope.

r: Almost exactly the same as Dragon, similar to Examiner and maybe Exorcist, and not shaped much like July 31.

o: Looks like a circle on all of them to me; I don't know.

n: Not much like any of the samples, except the right lower curl maybe like Citizen

i: Maybe similar to Eureka, except that there is a slight curl at the bottom

L: Maybe this is what you meant when you typed the letter "A"? Totally different from the others. Looking very closely... it looks almost like he started to write the letter "k," as if he was spelling "Chronickle" but then fixed it by writing a "L".

e: Very similar to July 31, and similar to Dragon.


:-)


Haley:

Seems as though the thread has gotten off track. I think that I started it by talking about the skeleton and Donna Lass. Sorry about that.

I think that... saying that someone who has worked very hard on the case and who is not around to defend himself should be done very carefully. All we do is speculate on the site anyway, and speculation is good. I think that it is fun because the Zodiac case is such an interesting mystery. But I think that if anyone is going to suggest that someone who has worked so much on the case has engaged in fraud, that person should at least do a fair amount of research and find a connecting nexus between multiple facts first to support  his or her theory. Sort of like how the government needs probable cause to arrest someone.

Otherwise we could all go around accusing each other of furthering our own interests instead of trying to work together to solve the case. That could stifle the teamwork atmosphere.

I also think that on one end of the spectrum, there are people who genuinely work really hard, selflessly and together with others without profit motive to solve the case. Like certain people with their own websites, for example. On the other end of the spectrum there are people who write books, have very little evidence, are totally full of it, and just trying to make money. The more I visit the site, the more I see the most knowledgeable investigators sort through the book writers and discuss where on the spectrum that they lie. There are a lot of different kinds of personalities too. The subculture of Zodiac hunters, to me, is almost as fascinating as the case itself!

I am just getting started with the case, and spend a lot of time with the 340. But I just think that at this point putting Paul Avery at the self interested end of the spectrum... is a bit premature. I wonder what other people think.


Smokie
Last edited by Smokie Treats on August 15th, 2014, 2:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Tahoe27
DOJ
Joined: March 5th, 2007, 6:45 pm

August 15th, 2014, 4:17 pm #15

Hi Smokie--

Your concerns about accusing someone of fraud are completely understandable, but I think the content in which it's being brought up is ok. No one is accusing him of a federal offense...just possibly drawing attention to himself in regards to the Zodiac case. I wouldn't doubt if he had people say this to him back in 1970. It's not unheard of....people faking things to draw attention to themselves. Toschi did it. Not referring to faking Zodiac letters, but the Maupin missives.

I am not saying Avery wrote that card and I don't think Haley is either. Just observations...looking at possibilities.
"Sometimes the questions are complicated and the answers are simple". Dr. Suess   
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Mary O
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Mary O
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Joined: February 2nd, 2014, 1:22 am

August 15th, 2014, 6:53 pm #16

Smokie Treats wrote:
The subculture of Zodiac hunters, to me, is almost as fascinating as the case itself!

 
Lol!  How true!
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Mary O
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Mary O
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Joined: February 2nd, 2014, 1:22 am

August 15th, 2014, 6:55 pm #17

Tahoe27 wrote:
Hi Smokie--

Your concerns about accusing someone of fraud are completely understandable, but I think the content in which it's being brought up is ok. No one is accusing him of a federal offense...just possibly drawing attention to himself in regards to the Zodiac case. I wouldn't doubt if he had people say this to him back in 1970. It's not unheard of....people faking things to draw attention to themselves. Toschi did it. Not referring to faking Zodiac letters, but the Maupin missives.

I am not saying Avery wrote that card and I don't think Haley is either. Just observations...looking at possibilities.
Thank you Tahoe.  Very well said.
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Smokie Treats
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Joined: December 31st, 2013, 12:03 am

August 16th, 2014, 1:10 am #18

Haley,

I think that your intentions are good and I make no negative judgement.

Hey I found another thread that is related to the Halloween Card that you might find interesting. We were talking about Donna Lass and the Pines Card a little bit, and there just happens to be a Paradice Motel (yeah it's really spelled that way) in South Lake Tahoe:

http://zodiackiller.fr.yuku.com/topic/2 ... -6r9_ldV1Y

The thread didn't get much attention, but the other side of the Halloween Card had that same word on it with the same spelling. Check it out!




In the meantime, I'll read a little more about Donna.

Zodiac liked to copy stuff from other sources. Maybe he went to Tahoe to hunt for a victim, and stayed at The Paradice Motel during his stay.


Smokie
Last edited by Smokie Treats on August 16th, 2014, 1:17 am, edited 3 times in total.
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ratman
DOJ
Joined: February 24th, 2007, 11:52 pm

August 16th, 2014, 9:30 am #19

Don't forget Kathleen Johns claimed to receive one also. And sent it to Avery and now it's missing Hmmm...
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morf13
DOJ
Joined: November 26th, 2013, 5:29 pm

August 16th, 2014, 11:47 am #20

There are only a couple 'PAUL''s mentioned in the unredacted police reports:

1) Stephen PAUL Haeberle- I think he was turned in by a co-worker of his. I have to check my notes, but I think he worked at Sears in SF, and he was a 1959 graduate of George Washington HS in SF. The report mentions he strongly resembles the sketch, I found a photo of him, and thought he looked more like the Berryessa sketch.

2)PAUL Eugene Corkrean- An anonymous tipster called Vallejo PD and told them that there was a Gary Corkrean living at 109 Sycamore Ct, and he resmbled the Berryessa sketch. Police called Mr Corkrean at home, and Paul Corkrean answered, and told them that he was PAUL CORKREAN and there was no Gary that lived there. Police asked him to come to the station, which he did in October, 1969. They report that he had long hair, sideburns, and a moustache and looked nothing like the sketch. Maybe this was somebody playing a joke on Paul, or maybe Z himself had a beef with him or was a neighbor and wanted to watch police knock on his door???

3)PAUL James Lesko- A group of men were standing around a horse stable when a black male told them that he knew who Zodiac was, and he told them that Zodiac was a Guy named John Zrelak. PAUL LESKO was a witness to the black male making this statement, and Lesko appears in the report as a witness. This next part is odd, and I will have to go back and see if I can find more details, but Paul Lesko, is related to a Willaim John Lesko, and I had found Paul Lesko elsewhere in my travels thru the reports. William J Lesko, resigned from his job on 4/15/74, and moved out of town....I will see if I can find more info.

Those are the only mentions of Paul that I found in the reports
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