Standing " The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder, and cheek..

Standing " The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder, and cheek..

Joined: May 31st, 2011, 9:43 pm

June 11th, 2012, 8:37 pm #1

It's been brought to my attention that some shooters across the country, might be unknowingly shooting Offhand in an illegal position... ie.. using straps or thigh rests while shooting a standing shot. See "B" below: "Solely" being the key word. I think some of us, myself included, only noticed the part about "no rigid support from the ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed." ... and having seen thigh rests and straps being used by some shooters at matches, I assumed it was legal at AAFTA events as well and have so allowed it at our matches too.

Please be advised that, at the upcoming AAFTA Grand Prix event "Western States Championships" we will NOT allow any straps to the gun, or thigh rests to the hip, on Standing OFFHAND shots.

From the AAFTA 2012 rule book, page 13:

Shooting Position:
A. Any shooting position is allowed, but the range may be set up to
necessitate use of a forced position on some targets.
Regardless of any prescribed position, the shooter may opt to
shoot the target offhand (standing) instead. A sign declaring a
forced shooting position may be used at a shooting lane.

B. If shooting OFFHAND (Standing), no rigid support from the
ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed.
The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder, and
cheek.

C. KNEELING position definition: Buttocks clear of the ground, but
may rest on one foot. The bum bag or kneeling roll may be
placed under the instep of the supporting foot if desired. The
arm supporting the rifle may rest on the knee or leg. One knee
must be touching the ground. A cloth or THIN mat is allowed for
the knee on the ground. The gun is to be supported solely by the
hands, shoulder, and cheek.

D. Prone: The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder,
and cheek. The gun and forearm, from elbow to fingertips, must
be clear of any artificial or natural support. A mat may be used if
one is not provided. The body must be extended with the head
towards the target. The shooter's forward forearm must form an
angle of approximately 90 degrees.

Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
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Joined: May 14th, 2004, 4:11 pm

June 11th, 2012, 9:10 pm #2

E- "A single rifle sling is permitted that shall be attached to the rifle at a minimum of one point and maximum of two points when a shot is taken."

I assume slings are still allowed per the rules?

Jeff P

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Joined: November 4th, 2004, 2:28 am

June 11th, 2012, 10:00 pm #3

It's been brought to my attention that some shooters across the country, might be unknowingly shooting Offhand in an illegal position... ie.. using straps or thigh rests while shooting a standing shot. See "B" below: "Solely" being the key word. I think some of us, myself included, only noticed the part about "no rigid support from the ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed." ... and having seen thigh rests and straps being used by some shooters at matches, I assumed it was legal at AAFTA events as well and have so allowed it at our matches too.

Please be advised that, at the upcoming AAFTA Grand Prix event "Western States Championships" we will NOT allow any straps to the gun, or thigh rests to the hip, on Standing OFFHAND shots.

From the AAFTA 2012 rule book, page 13:

Shooting Position:
A. Any shooting position is allowed, but the range may be set up to
necessitate use of a forced position on some targets.
Regardless of any prescribed position, the shooter may opt to
shoot the target offhand (standing) instead. A sign declaring a
forced shooting position may be used at a shooting lane.

B. If shooting OFFHAND (Standing), no rigid support from the
ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed.
The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder, and
cheek.

C. KNEELING position definition: Buttocks clear of the ground, but
may rest on one foot. The bum bag or kneeling roll may be
placed under the instep of the supporting foot if desired. The
arm supporting the rifle may rest on the knee or leg. One knee
must be touching the ground. A cloth or THIN mat is allowed for
the knee on the ground. The gun is to be supported solely by the
hands, shoulder, and cheek.

D. Prone: The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder,
and cheek. The gun and forearm, from elbow to fingertips, must
be clear of any artificial or natural support. A mat may be used if
one is not provided. The body must be extended with the head
towards the target. The shooter's forward forearm must form an
angle of approximately 90 degrees.

Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
I'm afraid i don't interpret the rules your way. The rules don't prohibit the use of a flexible strap or make any mention of them. Furthermore the gun is still solely supported by the shooters hands, shoulder and cheek.

The straps have been allowed at EVERY National event going back to at least Texas and as such i believe them to be "grandfathered" in and or at least previously looked at by the BOG. (i dont remember much past then) I believe i saw Paul Cray and Harold Ruston and almost every other National Champion using some form of the strap.

Your sudden interpretation and publishing of the rule with less than 3 weeks to go till your match prohibits us from making the necessary changes to our shooting style. I do consider this to be unfair and view it as making up the rules as you go. In my own personal, example i will literally have like 1 day to retrain my muscles to shoot your way.

If you're going to push this on the Nats then i'd like to see the BOG make a ruling on this.

I hope that you'll reconsider your position.


Kevin

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Joined: May 9th, 2007, 8:05 pm

June 11th, 2012, 10:09 pm #4

It's been brought to my attention that some shooters across the country, might be unknowingly shooting Offhand in an illegal position... ie.. using straps or thigh rests while shooting a standing shot. See "B" below: "Solely" being the key word. I think some of us, myself included, only noticed the part about "no rigid support from the ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed." ... and having seen thigh rests and straps being used by some shooters at matches, I assumed it was legal at AAFTA events as well and have so allowed it at our matches too.

Please be advised that, at the upcoming AAFTA Grand Prix event "Western States Championships" we will NOT allow any straps to the gun, or thigh rests to the hip, on Standing OFFHAND shots.

From the AAFTA 2012 rule book, page 13:

Shooting Position:
A. Any shooting position is allowed, but the range may be set up to
necessitate use of a forced position on some targets.
Regardless of any prescribed position, the shooter may opt to
shoot the target offhand (standing) instead. A sign declaring a
forced shooting position may be used at a shooting lane.

B. If shooting OFFHAND (Standing), no rigid support from the
ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed.
The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder, and
cheek.

C. KNEELING position definition: Buttocks clear of the ground, but
may rest on one foot. The bum bag or kneeling roll may be
placed under the instep of the supporting foot if desired. The
arm supporting the rifle may rest on the knee or leg. One knee
must be touching the ground. A cloth or THIN mat is allowed for
the knee on the ground. The gun is to be supported solely by the
hands, shoulder, and cheek.

D. Prone: The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder,
and cheek. The gun and forearm, from elbow to fingertips, must
be clear of any artificial or natural support. A mat may be used if
one is not provided. The body must be extended with the head
towards the target. The shooter's forward forearm must form an
angle of approximately 90 degrees.

Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
Are Slings OK in offhand?
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Joined: August 14th, 2004, 2:44 am

June 12th, 2012, 1:06 am #5

It's been brought to my attention that some shooters across the country, might be unknowingly shooting Offhand in an illegal position... ie.. using straps or thigh rests while shooting a standing shot. See "B" below: "Solely" being the key word. I think some of us, myself included, only noticed the part about "no rigid support from the ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed." ... and having seen thigh rests and straps being used by some shooters at matches, I assumed it was legal at AAFTA events as well and have so allowed it at our matches too.

Please be advised that, at the upcoming AAFTA Grand Prix event "Western States Championships" we will NOT allow any straps to the gun, or thigh rests to the hip, on Standing OFFHAND shots.

From the AAFTA 2012 rule book, page 13:

Shooting Position:
A. Any shooting position is allowed, but the range may be set up to
necessitate use of a forced position on some targets.
Regardless of any prescribed position, the shooter may opt to
shoot the target offhand (standing) instead. A sign declaring a
forced shooting position may be used at a shooting lane.

B. If shooting OFFHAND (Standing), no rigid support from the
ground to the rifle or the hand/arm supporting the rifle is allowed.
The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder, and
cheek.

C. KNEELING position definition: Buttocks clear of the ground, but
may rest on one foot. The bum bag or kneeling roll may be
placed under the instep of the supporting foot if desired. The
arm supporting the rifle may rest on the knee or leg. One knee
must be touching the ground. A cloth or THIN mat is allowed for
the knee on the ground. The gun is to be supported solely by the
hands, shoulder, and cheek.

D. Prone: The gun is to be supported solely by the hands, shoulder,
and cheek. The gun and forearm, from elbow to fingertips, must
be clear of any artificial or natural support. A mat may be used if
one is not provided. The body must be extended with the head
towards the target. The shooter's forward forearm must form an
angle of approximately 90 degrees.

Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
I'm guessing not a sling but something else?

Pics?


Seems a bit late to be changing the rules.


BS
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Joined: May 31st, 2011, 9:43 pm

June 12th, 2012, 1:10 am #6

I'm afraid i don't interpret the rules your way. The rules don't prohibit the use of a flexible strap or make any mention of them. Furthermore the gun is still solely supported by the shooters hands, shoulder and cheek.

The straps have been allowed at EVERY National event going back to at least Texas and as such i believe them to be "grandfathered" in and or at least previously looked at by the BOG. (i dont remember much past then) I believe i saw Paul Cray and Harold Ruston and almost every other National Champion using some form of the strap.

Your sudden interpretation and publishing of the rule with less than 3 weeks to go till your match prohibits us from making the necessary changes to our shooting style. I do consider this to be unfair and view it as making up the rules as you go. In my own personal, example i will literally have like 1 day to retrain my muscles to shoot your way.

If you're going to push this on the Nats then i'd like to see the BOG make a ruling on this.

I hope that you'll reconsider your position.


Kevin

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http://www.diablofieldtarget.org
I'm, of course writing the BOG tonight for clarification. I was told that this was discussed at Roz's... and you and I and other's I believe, are shooting illegally, OFFHAND for AAFTA events, according to what I heard today.

I hope we can settle this ASAP.. many of us would really not have time to learn a new way of shooting offhand...

Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
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Joined: May 31st, 2011, 9:43 pm

June 12th, 2012, 1:14 am #7

I'm guessing not a sling but something else?

Pics?


Seems a bit late to be changing the rules.


BS
I personally have seen.


This is kind of like a formal protest in advance of the event.. I'm composing my question to the BOG after dinner:-).. I'm hoping their cooking too:-)

Wacky Wayne
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Joined: May 31st, 2011, 9:43 pm

June 12th, 2012, 1:27 am #8

E- "A single rifle sling is permitted that shall be attached to the rifle at a minimum of one point and maximum of two points when a shot is taken."

I assume slings are still allowed per the rules?

Jeff P
Jeff, for sitting shots slings and thigh rests are not a problem.. just standing..
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Joined: November 4th, 2004, 2:28 am

June 12th, 2012, 2:45 am #9

I'm, of course writing the BOG tonight for clarification. I was told that this was discussed at Roz's... and you and I and other's I believe, are shooting illegally, OFFHAND for AAFTA events, according to what I heard today.

I hope we can settle this ASAP.. many of us would really not have time to learn a new way of shooting offhand...

Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
NOT in the middle of the year. A change at this juncture would create a 2 tier system for matches pre and post rule change in regards to the Grand Prix. And be very unfair to those of us who have trained the year through shooting one way only to have the rules change mid stream.

We have done it like this for a number of years and we have set a precedent. This reeks of the age old problem with FT...

If you can't beat em, change the rules on them.

kevin

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Joined: November 4th, 2004, 2:28 am

June 12th, 2012, 3:26 am #10

Not that i follow the Brits but its legal else where why would we doing something different?

k

Here's a link to the British FT rules.
http://thebfta.net/forum/index.php/topic,323.0.html





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