I can't help it... more on what one can do with the electronics in a gun.

I can't help it... more on what one can do with the electronics in a gun.

Joined: December 25th, 2011, 9:31 am

March 19th, 2012, 3:36 am #1

How about installing a chronograph into the Airwolf so that it logs the pellet info, velocity, temperature and valve opening time? (MVT&MCT)

Over time, one can collect a good amount of data for statistical analysis.
For example, one can make a 3 dimensional plot with velocity on the Z-axis, pressure and temperature on the X and Y axis and see how the standard deviation in the velocity distribution changes with respect to tank pressure. This can be used to improve the factory preset of the valve opening time for that PARTICULAR gun.
After thousands of shots fired, the on-board computer can interpolate the average and standard deviation for the next shot, giving the competitive shooter more confidence in his rifle.
"The more your rifle is shot, the more accurate it becomes." would be the marketing motto

Cheers,
Yang
Last edited by fanofairguns on March 19th, 2012, 3:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: October 4th, 2009, 5:32 pm

March 19th, 2012, 10:20 am #2

You want a computer that shoots pellets.

Some of us just want a simple basic rifle.
All the feedback we need is in a consistent poi.

Later,
Dwight
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Joined: March 25th, 2011, 2:35 am

March 19th, 2012, 11:10 am #3

How about installing a chronograph into the Airwolf so that it logs the pellet info, velocity, temperature and valve opening time? (MVT&MCT)

Over time, one can collect a good amount of data for statistical analysis.
For example, one can make a 3 dimensional plot with velocity on the Z-axis, pressure and temperature on the X and Y axis and see how the standard deviation in the velocity distribution changes with respect to tank pressure. This can be used to improve the factory preset of the valve opening time for that PARTICULAR gun.
After thousands of shots fired, the on-board computer can interpolate the average and standard deviation for the next shot, giving the competitive shooter more confidence in his rifle.
"The more your rifle is shot, the more accurate it becomes." would be the marketing motto

Cheers,
Yang
an iPad .25 cal.
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Joined: January 31st, 2011, 3:27 am

March 19th, 2012, 1:17 pm #4

Don't forget slow-mo camera for IPad...nt
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Joined: September 22nd, 2000, 7:58 pm

March 19th, 2012, 1:25 pm #5

How about installing a chronograph into the Airwolf so that it logs the pellet info, velocity, temperature and valve opening time? (MVT&MCT)

Over time, one can collect a good amount of data for statistical analysis.
For example, one can make a 3 dimensional plot with velocity on the Z-axis, pressure and temperature on the X and Y axis and see how the standard deviation in the velocity distribution changes with respect to tank pressure. This can be used to improve the factory preset of the valve opening time for that PARTICULAR gun.
After thousands of shots fired, the on-board computer can interpolate the average and standard deviation for the next shot, giving the competitive shooter more confidence in his rifle.
"The more your rifle is shot, the more accurate it becomes." would be the marketing motto

Cheers,
Yang
I thought Daystate already had a chronograph in one of their guns.

David Enoch

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Joined: October 15th, 2008, 5:34 pm

March 19th, 2012, 1:35 pm #6

In their MVT versions I believe. nt
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Joined: October 24th, 2006, 11:26 pm

March 19th, 2012, 2:07 pm #7

I thought Daystate already had a chronograph in one of their guns.

David Enoch

you can set the velocity you want to shoot at anywhere between 500 and 1200 fps. when you change to a different pellet/weight it takes about 5 shots for the gun to dial in your fps setting and then it shoots within 5 or 10 fps until you change pellets again. the chrony readout is displayed each shot and it seems to be consitantly 10 fps lower then what i read with my chrony.


I noticed mine at least sometimes has to redial in after filling, i am gonna recheck that today, that would be a bad point. Really i prefer a good ole mechanical gun, but its cool.
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Joined: December 25th, 2011, 9:31 am

March 19th, 2012, 3:59 pm #8

How about installing a chronograph into the Airwolf so that it logs the pellet info, velocity, temperature and valve opening time? (MVT&MCT)

Over time, one can collect a good amount of data for statistical analysis.
For example, one can make a 3 dimensional plot with velocity on the Z-axis, pressure and temperature on the X and Y axis and see how the standard deviation in the velocity distribution changes with respect to tank pressure. This can be used to improve the factory preset of the valve opening time for that PARTICULAR gun.
After thousands of shots fired, the on-board computer can interpolate the average and standard deviation for the next shot, giving the competitive shooter more confidence in his rifle.
"The more your rifle is shot, the more accurate it becomes." would be the marketing motto

Cheers,
Yang
But if we are making electronics into guns, why not go all the way and perfect it?

The guns with a velocity sensor built in. If they operate by correcting the next shot based on the previous shot, the correction would always oscillate around the "true" value.

Let's say at 150 bar, the valve opens for 5 micro seconds and gives 810 fps instead of the desired 800. If one shoots enough, he will have a lot of shot velocities at 150 bar. From this a distribution can be plotted and the average value found. Say the average is 820 fps. This is the actual velocity the on board computer should use to correct the valve opening time with, not the individual velocity, the 810 fps.

Cheers,
Yang
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Joined: April 27th, 2009, 5:42 pm

March 19th, 2012, 4:43 pm #9

"The guns with a velocity sensor built in. If they operate by correcting the next shot based on the previous shot, the correction would always oscillate around the "true" value."

I'm sure there is digital programming that would take care of the potential problem of continuously over correcting for the desired value. "Hysteresis" is one method used to help with this issue, creating a sort of buffer-zone. If you were set at 810fps, for instance, no adjustments would be made if your next shot were to be anywhere from say 800-820.

Similar to how a thermostat in a home doesn't kick on the AC the second the temperature rises over the current setting. The temperature is allowed to fluctuate somewhat, creating a more efficient system. Otherwise the AC would turn on as soon as the temperature rises past the setting, then shut off a minute (or less) later only to continue to repeat the process. Instead, the AC kicks on and drops the temp a couple degrees before shutting off, and will not turn back on until it's heated back up a couple degrees.

While this is still an oscillation, atleast it's a long, smooth and subtle oscillation instead of abrupt, sudden and steep over-corrections.
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Joined: December 25th, 2011, 9:31 am

March 19th, 2012, 5:03 pm #10

I also wonder if the acceleration profile of the pellet down the barrel has an effect on the precision.
High pressure: high initial acceleration.
low pressure: longer time to accelerate.

Can one program the digital valve so that the pellet undergoes the same acceleration every time?

What's the best possible velocity spread one can achieve? within 5fps?



Cheers,
Yang
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