Baby Rattler

Baby Rattler

Joined: October 5th, 2007, 3:58 am

April 8th, 2017, 4:49 pm #1

Found the SOB in the entrance to the little junk barn as I was prepping to weed-whack this morning. Damn, they look like gopher snakes (whom we love) at first.

He was in a perfect little coil when found, didn't respond to cigarette ash at all, thought it was dead. NOT.



Bludgeoned to death with the rebar shown in the photo. Teaching moment for dogz and little girl.



14" or so.



Nice to note that where there's one, there's more... and a momma, somewhere.






Last edited by daveshoot on April 8th, 2017, 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: April 25th, 2011, 2:42 am

April 8th, 2017, 7:17 pm #2

What state? nt
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Joined: October 5th, 2007, 3:58 am

April 8th, 2017, 7:33 pm #3

Rural NE San Diego county, about 1500 feet in the foothills.
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Joined: October 11th, 2016, 2:27 pm

April 8th, 2017, 8:09 pm #4

Found the SOB in the entrance to the little junk barn as I was prepping to weed-whack this morning. Damn, they look like gopher snakes (whom we love) at first.

He was in a perfect little coil when found, didn't respond to cigarette ash at all, thought it was dead. NOT.



Bludgeoned to death with the rebar shown in the photo. Teaching moment for dogz and little girl.



14" or so.



Nice to note that where there's one, there's more... and a momma, somewhere.





So although they may not inject as much it's as bad as a monstrous dose from a large one.
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 11:16 pm

April 8th, 2017, 9:58 pm #5



8) Baby Venomous Snakes Are More Dangerous Than Adults

This myth is roughly two-thirds nonsense and one-third truth. I believe this myth was born out of the human fascination with irony. For some reason we like to think it’s the one we don’t see coming that always gets us. We like to root for the underdog, and we simply like the notion of the tiny one being the deadly one.



But the fact of the matter is that baby venomous snakes are not more venomous than their parents. In fact, quite the opposite is true in a great many snake species; adults have far more virulent venom than the young snakes. For example, both adult and juvenile timber rattlesnakes (Crotalus horridus) have venom that is “strongly hemolytic,” which means it causes the breakdown of red blood cells, in prey (Ernst 116). Yet venom studies in older adults demonstrate that the “activity level of some venom enzymes tends to increase with the size and age of the snake” (Ernst 116). So an older timber rattlesnake has venom more virulent than a younger one.



Similarly, an adult snake is capable of delivering a much larger venom dose than a smaller snake. Consider the eastern diamondback rattlesnake (Crotalus adamanteus). Juveniles of the species typically deliver less than 70 milligrams of venom, whereas a healthy adult specimen may deliver 492 to 666 milligrams of venom (Ernst 90). The known maximum is 848 milligrams in a single bite (Ernst 90). Roughly 100 milligrams of venom is considered a lethal dose for an adult human.



So if the venom toxicity of a young snake is not as potent as an adult, and the total venom yield of a juvenile is not nearly as great as an adult’s, what part of this myth is one-third true? The answer lies in the venomous snake’s experience level. Adults are veterans of life. They have successfully avoided or driven back predators and attackers, and they have full control over all muscular functions. Adults recognize the need to conserve their precious venom. It takes time to produce it, and a snake that empties its venom reserves in an attacker has nothing left to subdue prey. They have learned that a venomous snake without venom doesn’t eat.



It’s a different story for neonate venomous snakes. They generally are not as in control of their muscular functions as are adult snakes, and they are at their most vulnerable point in life. Defensive strikes are fast and thorough. When these snakes bite, they typically bite hard, pumping the attacker full of every last bit of venom. If a young venomous snake’s bite were to be more dangerous than an adult’s, this would be the only way.



I suppose there are far more myths about snakes than I can dispel in one article. Education is the key. Snakes are interesting and unusual animals, so it only seems natural that people have attributed to them unique or even supernatural properties and powers.



Sadly, too many of these untruths are passed down from one generation of reptile lovers to the next. I can only hope those kids I saw at that Alabama reptile expo so long ago come to figure out that juvenile copperheads are not more virulent than their adult counterparts. Because for every snake myth we bust, we get closer to allowing the truth behind these intriguing animals to prevail.



References

Ernst, Carl H. 1992. Venomous Reptiles of North America. Smithsonian Institution Press, Washington, D.C.

Mehrtens, John M. 1987. Living Snakes of the World in Color. Sterling Press, New York, New York.
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Joined: April 13th, 2016, 3:50 pm

April 8th, 2017, 10:41 pm #6

Found the SOB in the entrance to the little junk barn as I was prepping to weed-whack this morning. Damn, they look like gopher snakes (whom we love) at first.

He was in a perfect little coil when found, didn't respond to cigarette ash at all, thought it was dead. NOT.



Bludgeoned to death with the rebar shown in the photo. Teaching moment for dogz and little girl.



14" or so.



Nice to note that where there's one, there's more... and a momma, somewhere.





Have you considered having your dog snake trained? Had a guy we used to fish with that was a vet in Nebraska, once a year they would catch two or three rattlers, defang them and stitch their mouth for good measure. He would plan it for the spring time and make a whole day or two depending on how many folks wanted this. Training goes quick and dog remember the lesson forever. Then they would turn the snakes loose, stitches dissolve, new fangs drop.
Last edited by Jimbud on April 8th, 2017, 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: October 5th, 2007, 3:58 am

April 8th, 2017, 10:47 pm #7

So although they may not inject as much it's as bad as a monstrous dose from a large one.
...because they don't regulate the amount of venom they inject. I don't know whether that's true or not. I decided to control for the uncertainty by killing every last one I find, regardless of size.

Anything that injects poison on my property, sucks.
Baby ones grow into large ones. Next door neighbor kilt a 6 footer about 20 yards from my fence, last year. It started as a baby.

I find other snakes intriguing and useful and do not kill them. This little bastard: Dead Right There.

I still have to weed whack the barnyard and I am not thrilled about tip-toeing through his relatives.

If anyone thinks this is a shame, I will be happy to box them up and send them, you pay shipping.

But they will be dead MFers when they arrive. Nice for hat bands and stuff.
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Joined: April 22nd, 2011, 1:38 am

April 8th, 2017, 11:19 pm #8

I have certainly done my share.
I have had pet snakes, I don't have anything against snakes but I don't want venomous types around my house..

Good job on making it a learning experience..your girl will be better off because of it...
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 11:16 pm

April 9th, 2017, 1:04 am #9

Have you considered having your dog snake trained? Had a guy we used to fish with that was a vet in Nebraska, once a year they would catch two or three rattlers, defang them and stitch their mouth for good measure. He would plan it for the spring time and make a whole day or two depending on how many folks wanted this. Training goes quick and dog remember the lesson forever. Then they would turn the snakes loose, stitches dissolve, new fangs drop.
I worked in the forest industry as a timber felling contractor. There was one particular year that it seemed we had a thief amongst us as something came up missing a few times a week over a period of a few weeks. Timber fallers are known to have two and three of everything as insurance that he would get a full day of work in as we only made money when the sawdust flew.

There had been an active rattle snake den in the area and one day I caught a rattle snake and placed it alive into my tool box that laid across the bed of my pickup. I was undecided what to do with this guy, eat it, have it freeze dried, use the skin for a hat ban or turn it loose. Well by the next day I had forgotten about this guy but by the end of the day the word was out that I had a rattle snake patrolling my tool box, the funning thing I hadn’t told anyone. So by tracking down the story brought me to our thief, one of the kids from the landing crew. Only took a few words and the threat of placing the snake in his vehicle the next time he felt the need to take something not belonging to him. The rest of the year was very peaceful without incident, fact of the matter that story followed me for a few years and no one wanted to go through my tool box even with permission.

Yep, training dogs with rattle snakes is a great idea also works on people in particular incidents!! Cheers
Last edited by Houlihan54 on April 9th, 2017, 1:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: January 14th, 2011, 9:42 pm

April 9th, 2017, 1:05 am #10

Found the SOB in the entrance to the little junk barn as I was prepping to weed-whack this morning. Damn, they look like gopher snakes (whom we love) at first.

He was in a perfect little coil when found, didn't respond to cigarette ash at all, thought it was dead. NOT.



Bludgeoned to death with the rebar shown in the photo. Teaching moment for dogz and little girl.



14" or so.



Nice to note that where there's one, there's more... and a momma, somewhere.





... in my backyard here in Indiana over the last few years. They are a protected species so I relocate them well away from the house and across a couple creeks.

My neighbor told me I was obviously misidentifying them so I left one in a bucket on his front porch.
Last edited by Rescue912 on April 9th, 2017, 1:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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