Interesting link on Ferrarichat.......

Interesting link on Ferrarichat.......

Joined: March 14th, 2007, 1:56 am

July 10th, 2008, 9:14 am #1

that I found, might be interesting reading for some of you. My "recently old" X is a great car, and as most of you already know, our beloved X's are a wonderful fun car, and others think so!!

Check it out.......

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showth ... p?t=203782
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Duane K Estill (Corinth, Mississippi)
Duane K Estill (Corinth, Mississippi)

July 10th, 2008, 11:40 am #2

is how many current Ferrari owners used to own Fiats, specifically X1/9's. You don't see them doing the "Fix it..." thing.....they are serious enough about cars to see that the X1/9 is a substantial piece in it's own right.

On the other hand....there seem to be many who just don't get the difference between Italian cars, and 'everything else.' They actually have the ill-gotten opinion that Porsches and BMW's or Vettes are in the same category as Italian cars because of the performance factor. I believe this to be a serious conceptual error. If I were interested in German cars, I'm surely not going to dig deeper into Italian car culture to find out about German cars.

Why don't people understand these differences?
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Joined: March 14th, 2007, 1:56 am

July 10th, 2008, 4:35 pm #3

is that some owners are drivers and let's just say the others are not. Also, more Italian car owners seem to be willing to work on their car and have pride on what they are. My feeling is that once you really drive, and I mean drive, a Italian car, the more you understand the difference between a Italian car experience vs the rest. That is what got me hooked, and even though I have driven German cars, and they are fine, I would still prefer a Italian cars " soul" to anything else.
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Duane K Estill (Corinth, Mississippi)
Duane K Estill (Corinth, Mississippi)

July 10th, 2008, 4:52 pm #4

At the bottom of all this.....it really does boil down to one thing....driving the cars. That fundamental, quite apart from mystique, advertising, or hype, is going to differentiate on an individual level, the differences in the cars.

Second major difference in my view is the other side of the driving coin.....the makers cared about making the cars for the sake of making a great car for a driver to indulge fully, not the bottom line.

I think that's why the late 60's early 70's was such a golden era on all fronts, even American Muscle cars, for caring about making cars for people who loved to simply drive the cars.

An order of magnitude beyond this is the Italian factor, the particular mixture of metal and mentality that yields this ever elusive "soul" of a car. I don't think this is merely the driver's perception by fiat (I don't mean the car, I mean the term "to will, or desire to believe,") that a car has this or that intrinsice feature. It's derivative of the care and passion put into the car that that triggers those perceptual indexes within the driver.

Fiat sports cars surely had it, probably because of the designers of the Spider and X, (Pinin' and Bertone). Feraris have both the design excellence and the race breeding flowing clearly from a manufacturer that sold cars in order to race and not the other way around. It's also consonant with this that Ferraris are terrifically expensive which unfortunately introduces the snob factor. I know there are wealthy guys that understand the 'soul' factor just as much as a guy who can barely own an X but it gets obfuscated substantially when owners "pimp" the soul and spirit of automotive Italiana by merely pimping that into some exclusive club. I detest that attitude.

Even on this exact thread at F-chat, you've got scads of answers to the question..."What's a good 'warm-up' car to a 308 Ferrari" and they go...."ohh.....get a Z06 Vette or a Porsche 911." I don't think these people get it at all....they just see high performance and dollar signs, unable to differentiate Italian performance cars from the rest.

Not that I'm an expert by any means....but I do clearly see that Ferrari is the next step up from an X1/9.....a graduation ceremony I fully intend to participate in and come to it with a background that yields a more satisfying ownership quite beyond the pinache and snobbery.
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Joe F
Joe F

July 10th, 2008, 6:54 pm #5

is how many current Ferrari owners used to own Fiats, specifically X1/9's. You don't see them doing the "Fix it..." thing.....they are serious enough about cars to see that the X1/9 is a substantial piece in it's own right.

On the other hand....there seem to be many who just don't get the difference between Italian cars, and 'everything else.' They actually have the ill-gotten opinion that Porsches and BMW's or Vettes are in the same category as Italian cars because of the performance factor. I believe this to be a serious conceptual error. If I were interested in German cars, I'm surely not going to dig deeper into Italian car culture to find out about German cars.

Why don't people understand these differences?
If I may add to this modest, but very interesting discussion.

I agree with both Duane and Bob, it's all about the behind the wheel experience.

For many (30) years I have been a happy Fiat owner with asperations of "graduating" (no pun intended) to an Alfa and then on to a Ferrari.

No balony about the mystique of these cars, they are just cars I WANT to drive.

Two stories I wish to relate: Back in 1972 I had an 124 Sport Coupe. Not much of a looker, but as anyone who has driven one can confirm, a great drivers car. My buddy was a devout British car nut. He had a BRG Triumph TR-4 and an MGB. He laughed at my car when I started to expound on its virtues during a heated discussion on sports cars. To make a long story short, I tossed him the keys...he has owned Italian cars ever since.

Second story: As I pulled up to my mechanic's shop a few years ago (Cambridge, MA) there was a red 308 parked in front and when I got out of my X, this guy says " Are you here to test drive my car?" Now, my mother may have raised ugly kids, but not stupid ones, so I said "sure". Big mistake! Driving that Ferrari was like taking all facets of the X-1/9 experience and multiplying by 100. It has ruined me for anything else. I must own one.

I was not in the postion to buy that car (I think I could have had it for 35K) at that time, but I have not yet stopped thinking about it.

Anyway, I wish to thank you gentlemen for this escape from my daily routine and the indulgence in the Ferrari blog and your discussion.

I beleive this type of thing is what has been called the 'soul' of our cars.

caio

Joe F
87 Bert
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Duane K Estill (Corinth, Mississippi)
Duane K Estill (Corinth, Mississippi)

July 10th, 2008, 9:07 pm #6

.......................
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Joined: July 5th, 2005, 4:45 am

July 11th, 2008, 1:28 pm #7

that I found, might be interesting reading for some of you. My "recently old" X is a great car, and as most of you already know, our beloved X's are a wonderful fun car, and others think so!!

Check it out.......

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showth ... p?t=203782
...that there are a few knobs even within the Ferrari community. Heh.

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Joined: October 15th, 2007, 3:50 am

July 11th, 2008, 4:42 pm #8

If I may add to this modest, but very interesting discussion.

I agree with both Duane and Bob, it's all about the behind the wheel experience.

For many (30) years I have been a happy Fiat owner with asperations of "graduating" (no pun intended) to an Alfa and then on to a Ferrari.

No balony about the mystique of these cars, they are just cars I WANT to drive.

Two stories I wish to relate: Back in 1972 I had an 124 Sport Coupe. Not much of a looker, but as anyone who has driven one can confirm, a great drivers car. My buddy was a devout British car nut. He had a BRG Triumph TR-4 and an MGB. He laughed at my car when I started to expound on its virtues during a heated discussion on sports cars. To make a long story short, I tossed him the keys...he has owned Italian cars ever since.

Second story: As I pulled up to my mechanic's shop a few years ago (Cambridge, MA) there was a red 308 parked in front and when I got out of my X, this guy says " Are you here to test drive my car?" Now, my mother may have raised ugly kids, but not stupid ones, so I said "sure". Big mistake! Driving that Ferrari was like taking all facets of the X-1/9 experience and multiplying by 100. It has ruined me for anything else. I must own one.

I was not in the postion to buy that car (I think I could have had it for 35K) at that time, but I have not yet stopped thinking about it.

Anyway, I wish to thank you gentlemen for this escape from my daily routine and the indulgence in the Ferrari blog and your discussion.

I beleive this type of thing is what has been called the 'soul' of our cars.

caio

Joe F
87 Bert
Ferrari's and many other Exotics by Osmosis, these cars embody much of what the Italian expression of what rolling car art might be. I have many, many very sweet memories with these cars. Even the way these cars are built are so Italian in every way. They are more like art sculpture than just a mechanical, technological object. I do believe it is the passion and artistic understanding that those involved with the design, production and testing that results in cars like this. Faults, they have many, are there any great works of art flawless?

The only cars that come close to Italian cars for charm are French cars and a some English cars. German cars tend to be technical and rather dry with stiff German discipline.

After you become an Ferrari or other Italian exotic car owner, come back to the X and you might discover there is far more similarities than differences in their Italian personality. This is one of the reasons why I never became a Ferrari owner, the X is just more FUN for the money and one can do far more with them. Modify a Ferrari and it becomes a disowned orphan along with it's market value. Modify an X, and one can end up with a personalized version of their Italian dream. Kind of like making your own Gelato.
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Joe F
Joe F

July 11th, 2008, 5:14 pm #9

And I couldn't agree with you more.

If I am ever fortunate enough to own a Ferrari, I would treat it with the respect a work of art deserves, but I would never give up the Fiat.

To paraphrase what you said, my X-1/9 is MY work of art, a work in progerss. A statement that I make to the automotive world whenever I display my art, where it belongs, on the street.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Joe F
87 Bert of art
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