A Question: Heaven or Hell for me?

A Question: Heaven or Hell for me?

Joined: April 20th, 2010, 12:19 pm

May 14th, 2010, 6:22 pm #1

A question: (Again, lol) Well, a scenario really...

I am 36 years old. I have three kids, a wife who I have been married to for 13 years. I have always done alot of self sacrifice in order to provide for my kids and etc. (As an example, deploying overseas with the military in order to ensure the homestead was taken care of and food on the table, etc). I always treat people with fairness and kindness when I meet them... I always do all I can to help others when they are in need. While no person is perfect by any means, simple point is that I am faithful to my wife, do the best I can to raise my kids right, and lead a good, honorable life. And I tip well every time I go to restaurants. (grin)(I know that last one doesn't matter, lol)

Only one 'problem' as it were... I am not a believer in Christ, or heaven and hell. I think heaven and hell to be human contrived notions. I am very scientific minded, facts, not faith control my thoughts.

Second part of this scenario, an serial rapist and killer spends years absolutely destroying people's lives on earth. The survivors and family members are to this day still hurting and grieving. This horrible serial killer goes to prison, and upon arriving there, asks forgiveness of all his sins, and accepts jesus Christ into his life and is saved. Three days later, he dies of a heart attack lets say.

Now, the question: If I am wrong and heaven and hell really do exist... Would I go to heaven, or hell?

Where would this fellow who committed atrocities all his life but was saved go? Would he go to Heaven?

---------------------

Now I will assume based on what folks have taught me in the past I would go to the fiery pits of Hell, and the Axe murderer to Heaven.

If I have assumed right so far, then I ask my main question, how can an everloving God see me doing good deeds my entire life! And yet send me to the fiery pits of hell to burn in eternity! when my only misstep was not believing in something I could not see prior to my death because I am too analytical and cannot have 'faith' in a book that may, or may not be 100% fact?

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Joined: July 13th, 2009, 1:50 pm

May 14th, 2010, 7:34 pm #2

Come to my forum where it is more private.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/164107/

I'm not saying don't come here but it's just that here you won't get much in the way of TRUE ANSWERS. You'll just get a lot of opinions. If you think you'll find the best ice cream at Baskin-Robbins, you might find a favorite kind for you but it won't necessarily be the best, if you get the drift of what I'm saying.

As for your question based on your HONEST admittance of not being a believer, if a serial killer has truly REPENTED in the Biblical definition of REPENTANCE and has GENUINELY asked God to save him through FAITH in Christ alone, then that man is saved and will have eternal life.

Your other question was..

S> Now, the question: If I am wrong and heaven and hell really do exist... Would I go to heaven, or hell?

N> Heaven and hell do exist Super. However, not understanding those concepts is understandable IF you're seeking an answer. If you're adamant in demading a zap from God or a miraculous sign as some here demand you're likely on your way to hell.

You also asked...

S> how can an everloving God see me doing good deeds my entire life! And yet send me to the fiery pits of hell to burn in eternity! when my only misstep was not believing in something I could not see prior to my death because I am too analytical and cannot have 'faith' in a book that may, or may not be 100% fact?

N> Have you ever lied Super? Ever stolen? Ever said such harsh blasphemies as God damn this or God damn that? Ever looked at a woman that was not your wife either before marriage or after with lust?

If you've done just one of those you would be guilty of sin before God.

1. If you've lied Super, then that make you a liar doesn't it?

2. If you've EVER stolen anything that is not yours, are you not then a thief?

3. If you've ever used God's name in a profane manner, is that not a vain blasphemy?

4. If you've ever had any sexual act with anybody or anything OTHER than your own wife, would that not be adultery?

Just some food for thought Super. I'm there if you want the ABSOLUTE TRUTH.





"If I must choose between righteousness and peace, I choose RIGHTEOUSNESS"." ~ Theodore Roosevelt
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Joined: December 8th, 2003, 1:16 am

May 14th, 2010, 8:15 pm #3

Becoming a Christian is not about being a good person; it's about finding fault with yourself .... and others. Let the nit-picking begin!~

They say it's about becoming free but it's actually about getting yourself in bondage to ... the idolatry of the Bible.

It's not about using your mind but rather ... about LOSING your mind.

-Vince
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Joined: July 13th, 2009, 1:50 pm

May 14th, 2010, 8:41 pm #4

You continue to be deceived into thinking that being free is not being bound to what the Bible actually teaches. However the fact that you continually refuse to see in the darkness you choose to be in Vince, is the God's Word is truth and the truth sets you free.

John 17:17
17 "Sanctify them in the truth; Thy word is truth. (NAS)


John 8:31-32
31 Jesus therefore was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, "If you abide in My word, {then} you are truly disciples of Mine;
32 and you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."

(NAS)

How's the chains Vince?





"If I must choose between righteousness and peace, I choose RIGHTEOUSNESS"." ~ Theodore Roosevelt
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Iceman
Iceman

May 14th, 2010, 9:25 pm #5

A question: (Again, lol) Well, a scenario really...

I am 36 years old. I have three kids, a wife who I have been married to for 13 years. I have always done alot of self sacrifice in order to provide for my kids and etc. (As an example, deploying overseas with the military in order to ensure the homestead was taken care of and food on the table, etc). I always treat people with fairness and kindness when I meet them... I always do all I can to help others when they are in need. While no person is perfect by any means, simple point is that I am faithful to my wife, do the best I can to raise my kids right, and lead a good, honorable life. And I tip well every time I go to restaurants. (grin)(I know that last one doesn't matter, lol)

Only one 'problem' as it were... I am not a believer in Christ, or heaven and hell. I think heaven and hell to be human contrived notions. I am very scientific minded, facts, not faith control my thoughts.

Second part of this scenario, an serial rapist and killer spends years absolutely destroying people's lives on earth. The survivors and family members are to this day still hurting and grieving. This horrible serial killer goes to prison, and upon arriving there, asks forgiveness of all his sins, and accepts jesus Christ into his life and is saved. Three days later, he dies of a heart attack lets say.

Now, the question: If I am wrong and heaven and hell really do exist... Would I go to heaven, or hell?

Where would this fellow who committed atrocities all his life but was saved go? Would he go to Heaven?

---------------------

Now I will assume based on what folks have taught me in the past I would go to the fiery pits of Hell, and the Axe murderer to Heaven.

If I have assumed right so far, then I ask my main question, how can an everloving God see me doing good deeds my entire life! And yet send me to the fiery pits of hell to burn in eternity! when my only misstep was not believing in something I could not see prior to my death because I am too analytical and cannot have 'faith' in a book that may, or may not be 100% fact?

Sounds like your a fine person. So why worry? If you do research on rapist and serial killers you will find they are generally devout christians and were raised in a strict religious environment. That's mostly what screwed them up to begin with.

Your responsible and apparantly have a great deal of love in your heart. The path of humanity is through the road and not through any diety. Love your earth and all its creatures, be good kind and generious and it will be returned.

As humans we shall never be free of some strife or discomfort. You deal with it day to day.

If you believe Bible text can be helpful then I suggest Luke 12:22 thru 12:34.


The concept of Heaven, or Hell is just a pathetic religious attempt at blackmail.
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Joined: April 30th, 2005, 4:27 am

May 14th, 2010, 10:47 pm #6

A question: (Again, lol) Well, a scenario really...

I am 36 years old. I have three kids, a wife who I have been married to for 13 years. I have always done alot of self sacrifice in order to provide for my kids and etc. (As an example, deploying overseas with the military in order to ensure the homestead was taken care of and food on the table, etc). I always treat people with fairness and kindness when I meet them... I always do all I can to help others when they are in need. While no person is perfect by any means, simple point is that I am faithful to my wife, do the best I can to raise my kids right, and lead a good, honorable life. And I tip well every time I go to restaurants. (grin)(I know that last one doesn't matter, lol)

Only one 'problem' as it were... I am not a believer in Christ, or heaven and hell. I think heaven and hell to be human contrived notions. I am very scientific minded, facts, not faith control my thoughts.

Second part of this scenario, an serial rapist and killer spends years absolutely destroying people's lives on earth. The survivors and family members are to this day still hurting and grieving. This horrible serial killer goes to prison, and upon arriving there, asks forgiveness of all his sins, and accepts jesus Christ into his life and is saved. Three days later, he dies of a heart attack lets say.

Now, the question: If I am wrong and heaven and hell really do exist... Would I go to heaven, or hell?

Where would this fellow who committed atrocities all his life but was saved go? Would he go to Heaven?

---------------------

Now I will assume based on what folks have taught me in the past I would go to the fiery pits of Hell, and the Axe murderer to Heaven.

If I have assumed right so far, then I ask my main question, how can an everloving God see me doing good deeds my entire life! And yet send me to the fiery pits of hell to burn in eternity! when my only misstep was not believing in something I could not see prior to my death because I am too analytical and cannot have 'faith' in a book that may, or may not be 100% fact?

Ones that lead you away from God, and

Ones that lead you towards God.

The world is full of evil, and

The world is full of love.

Somethings destroy the soul, and

Somethings create the soul.

God placed us here so we could gain a SOUL that enables him to be NEAR his creation.

There is no heaven and hell outside of man,

they are places within and hell burns the dross

from the soul so that it can bear the fulness of God. JB
Last edited by daat on May 14th, 2010, 11:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: July 1st, 2008, 11:52 pm

May 15th, 2010, 12:02 am #7

the fullness of God


when my spirit was taken to the other side to be made one with Christ, I was divided so that not all of me would leave here from the consciousness of the earth (body/mind)

my subconscious was made conscious in the wilderness and corrected here where consciousness had NEVER GONE BEFORE....here is the chastening/correction/tikkun that comes from above where my spirit and GODS SPIRIT where now joined as ONE


now the work from above was to correct the other parts of my consciousness, i.e. a new heaven (heart-motivation) and a new earth (conscious ability to FOCUS on what is real (good) and resist what is not real (evil)


my motivation was cleared up a lot quicker than my ability to FOCUS on what I truly INTEND, truly WILL with all my heart soul and strength

which would become my NEW MIND when finished....when I could TRUST what IS INVISIBLE To the five senses more than what is visible to them:


there are more that are with us than there are against us

and........HE IS GREATER THAT IS WITHIN US than he that is in the world


this ability to FOCUS on the truth under all seeming evidence, all doubt in the true reality which MOVES the manifestation instead of the other way around, comes at a great price to us; we have to trust against all appearances and perception of the carnal senses


in truth reality is invisible and moves the manifestation

manifestation does not move reality but instead, something can manifest now and be gone tomorrow or in five minutes from now

what to trust.........its not as easy as it sounds


and that is why the CHURCH is waiting for Jesus to come and take us out of this world.......but do they know what they are really waiting for?

do they understand that they have to WANT IT MORE THAN THEY WANT TO STAY IN THE WORLD???
every day is a new day to die to the old and live to the newness of life
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Joined: July 13th, 2009, 1:50 pm

May 17th, 2010, 7:45 pm #8

Ones that lead you away from God, and

Ones that lead you towards God.

The world is full of evil, and

The world is full of love.

Somethings destroy the soul, and

Somethings create the soul.

God placed us here so we could gain a SOUL that enables him to be NEAR his creation.

There is no heaven and hell outside of man,

they are places within and hell burns the dross

from the soul so that it can bear the fulness of God. JB
How could a THING create a soul? Such absurdity

"If I must choose between righteousness and peace, I choose RIGHTEOUSNESS"." ~ Theodore Roosevelt
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QUITTNER
QUITTNER

May 18th, 2010, 6:49 pm #9

A question: (Again, lol) Well, a scenario really...

I am 36 years old. I have three kids, a wife who I have been married to for 13 years. I have always done alot of self sacrifice in order to provide for my kids and etc. (As an example, deploying overseas with the military in order to ensure the homestead was taken care of and food on the table, etc). I always treat people with fairness and kindness when I meet them... I always do all I can to help others when they are in need. While no person is perfect by any means, simple point is that I am faithful to my wife, do the best I can to raise my kids right, and lead a good, honorable life. And I tip well every time I go to restaurants. (grin)(I know that last one doesn't matter, lol)

Only one 'problem' as it were... I am not a believer in Christ, or heaven and hell. I think heaven and hell to be human contrived notions. I am very scientific minded, facts, not faith control my thoughts.

Second part of this scenario, an serial rapist and killer spends years absolutely destroying people's lives on earth. The survivors and family members are to this day still hurting and grieving. This horrible serial killer goes to prison, and upon arriving there, asks forgiveness of all his sins, and accepts jesus Christ into his life and is saved. Three days later, he dies of a heart attack lets say.

Now, the question: If I am wrong and heaven and hell really do exist... Would I go to heaven, or hell?

Where would this fellow who committed atrocities all his life but was saved go? Would he go to Heaven?

---------------------

Now I will assume based on what folks have taught me in the past I would go to the fiery pits of Hell, and the Axe murderer to Heaven.

If I have assumed right so far, then I ask my main question, how can an everloving God see me doing good deeds my entire life! And yet send me to the fiery pits of hell to burn in eternity! when my only misstep was not believing in something I could not see prior to my death because I am too analytical and cannot have 'faith' in a book that may, or may not be 100% fact?

As long as you believe in Heaven and hell you will go to one of these after you died. If you don't believe they exist, then you won't.
..... You can't bribe God by doing what the clergy tell you, or by going to one of many places where they collect your money under false pretenses.
..... Good people are likely to have God or some other spirits help them if asked; you should look for coincidences [such as having a sudden urge to look at a clock or watch at "special times" (1:11, or 12:34, etc.)] in your favor as possibly originated by God or one or more of the other spirits, and give thanks every time. Maybe some of "your" thoughts are actually communications from God or from one or more of the other spirits as advice/suggestion, not as compulsion.
..... I've read somewhere that we are partly credited with the good things GOOD people do after we helped them, and that we are blamed, in part, for all the bad things that BAD people do after we helped them. Help only GOOD people! Good luck!
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