Problem is we are in a bit of limbo at end of next week with no coach for next season. I suspect Moxon oversees player recruitment and retention in the main but a new coach may have an idea of whether he fancies any of our top order or not. I suspect an outsider may view them more highly than our average WRF poster though!
Lyth and Ballance played for England as recently as the last 13 months for both of them and as others point out both openers are in the top ten run scorers in the division. They don't become bad players overnight and to think of ditching any is foolish. All three could play for England within 12 months with a good following wind.
Leaning should be out on loan somewhere to get four day cricket. He has gone backwards this year and may have suffered in many ways including different formats and different places in the order. A good winter down under may see him return stronger.
We must have an overseas batsman in the top five who is available all summer. Stability is key. I'm ok with Lehmann junior and he can only get better with more matches in longer format.
Which leaves Gale. I think it's down to him to look at this season and decide what he wants to do. Can he work with the new coach? What is he going to do this winter to find form for next year? Is he considering retirement or giving up as skipper? Are his off field interests sufficient for him to pack it in?
I'd like him to try another year partly as he offers more than just batting. I don't see an obvious skipper in waiting despite Lees and Ballance doing it this summer. To lose the coach and captain at the same time leaves a huge hole and not sure Moxon can fill it.
Sadly I'm still against keeping Hodd as Bairstows back up despite those who say he is a good keeper. I can't believe there has been no one coming through the Yorkshire junior teams capable of stepping up . Gibson Hodgson both failed to kick on and before Johnny we had another outsider in Brophy. There is plenty of movement around the counties by wicketkeepers with Mustard Wheater Davies and possibly Duckett but all seem sorted already for next season. It seems odd to me that most of the player movement for next season has been concluded before the end of this season.
Moderator: Assistant Moderator
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- Joined: June 3rd, 2014, 8:54 pm
StuFletch: Not arguing with your judgements one way or another. Thought your language could have been a little more respectful, especially to Galey.Ridiculous to say our openers are on thin ice regarding there place in the side.
They have both got over thousand runs this season!!
Yes they could do with a bit if competition, but any county would take either of them
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- Joined: October 20th, 2013, 8:03 pm
Thanks to ECT and 3rdUmp for their comments. Made me feel better after the start of this thread.
Some of us are accused from time to time of wanting the forum to avoid criticism of the players. I don't think there's any poster of who that is true, but 'waste of an NI no. Get rid' is not a criticism it's an insult. If we did get rid of any of our batsmen, with one possible exception, they could choose from other offers.
The exception of course is poor Andrew Gale, but even this isn't a straightforward decision, as there aren't people knocking on the door either as batsmen or captains. I think I would now say it's time to move on, but the case is weakened by the enforced change at the top. I don't see an obvious alternative. Rafiq has some of the required qualities but recent frailties worry me and he is far from being an automatic choice. I'd probably go for Lees, but with concerns and I can see the case for another year of Gale.
As far as the batting is concerned, some write as if we were a rich football club who could just have a major clear out and buy in quality outsiders. We would argue about whether that's desirable. It's certainly not possible.
We're a good side, but we've underperformed a bit this year. We're still going into the final game with an outside chance of being champions. This isn't a crisis.
Some of us are accused from time to time of wanting the forum to avoid criticism of the players. I don't think there's any poster of who that is true, but 'waste of an NI no. Get rid' is not a criticism it's an insult. If we did get rid of any of our batsmen, with one possible exception, they could choose from other offers.
The exception of course is poor Andrew Gale, but even this isn't a straightforward decision, as there aren't people knocking on the door either as batsmen or captains. I think I would now say it's time to move on, but the case is weakened by the enforced change at the top. I don't see an obvious alternative. Rafiq has some of the required qualities but recent frailties worry me and he is far from being an automatic choice. I'd probably go for Lees, but with concerns and I can see the case for another year of Gale.
As far as the batting is concerned, some write as if we were a rich football club who could just have a major clear out and buy in quality outsiders. We would argue about whether that's desirable. It's certainly not possible.
We're a good side, but we've underperformed a bit this year. We're still going into the final game with an outside chance of being champions. This isn't a crisis.
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- Joined: August 21st, 2013, 7:47 pm
The initial post is without doubt crass and needlessly insulting. Its conclusions questionable and in case of the openers, Ballance, Rhodes and Gale probably written by someone whose never set foot inside Headingley.
I've know wish to debate beyond this with someone using such a tone.
I've know wish to debate beyond this with someone using such a tone.
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- Joined: February 13th, 2014, 9:14 pm
Think some of the earlier comments are out of frustration.
No way can Lyth be called "on thin ice"
The basis for a good batting line up is there ekth the openers. The major issues have been the less of a quality and regular overseas player and the best County batsman in the competition in Bairstow.
Most of us could see his value and how many times he has saved us over the last few years.
What we need is a genuine number 3. Balance has never been that and I personally see him as a 4 or 5.
We urgently need a keeper batsman. Our balance with Hodd at 8 is all wrong.
Lyth
Lees
Overseas?
Ballance
Leaning Needs a long run. He will come good
Davies wk From Surrey
No way can Lyth be called "on thin ice"
The basis for a good batting line up is there ekth the openers. The major issues have been the less of a quality and regular overseas player and the best County batsman in the competition in Bairstow.
Most of us could see his value and how many times he has saved us over the last few years.
What we need is a genuine number 3. Balance has never been that and I personally see him as a 4 or 5.
We urgently need a keeper batsman. Our balance with Hodd at 8 is all wrong.
Lyth
Lees
Overseas?
Ballance
Leaning Needs a long run. He will come good
Davies wk From Surrey
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- Joined: April 22nd, 2014, 6:08 pm
Davies would be a good signing as he is also a useful one day player, turned down a 2 year contract at Surrey so he is off somewhere hopefully to us
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- Joined: April 2nd, 2014, 9:31 am
Davies is going to Somerset.
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- Joined: May 24th, 2016, 9:00 pm
I don't personally see a way back for Hodd. I'm hoping Gale retires then we can all wish him well for the future.Think some of the earlier comments are out of frustration.
No way can Lyth be called "on thin ice"
The basis for a good batting line up is there ekth the openers. The major issues have been the less of a quality and regular overseas player and the best County batsman in the competition in Bairstow.
Most of us could see his value and how many times he has saved us over the last few years.
What we need is a genuine number 3. Balance has never been that and I personally see him as a 4 or 5.
We urgently need a keeper batsman. Our balance with Hodd at 8 is all wrong.
Lyth
Lees
Overseas?
Ballance
Leaning Needs a long run. He will come good
Davies wk From Surrey
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- Joined: August 7th, 2014, 4:58 pm
Hodd is recently capped and under contract. I doubt he's going anywhere. Who would replace him? Duckett wants to stay at Northants, Wheater has signed for Essex, Davies is reputedly going to Somerset. Who else is available? Mustard? No thanks.
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- Joined: July 31st, 2016, 5:54 pm
I think Gale should step down as captain but remain available as a batsman, as I still think he can prove to be a good batsman on his dayI don't personally see a way back for Hodd. I'm hoping Gale retires then we can all wish him well for the future.
Lyth and Lees currently look safe and hopefully no England call-ups will affect them
Our problem, compared with most other counties, is the constant questions about who will and won't be available. It impedes much chance for momentum and makes planning difficult
If not playing for England Ballance should definitely bat at 3 and in fairness the top three have been pretty good since Ballance came back in
But positions 4-7 are big questions. Gale, Leaning, Rhodes, Bresnan, Rashid, Hodd could all bat there but haven't proven consistent enough hence our struggling. In an ideal world we could recruit one or two batsmen to bat there. If Leehman was available for a long period that would be great because he's been good since coming in. Maybe there's someone from the academy?
However I feel problems have perhaps been exaggerated a little, because as I've said with Lees, Lyth and Ballance we've got a terrific top 3, our bowling attack is still one of the best in county cricket and should remain so for quite a few more years (even if Siddy retired soon it would still be very good), and we just need to find a middle order balance which is unlikely to be affected by England call-ups
