VRM- how it should NOT be =====>

Vintage Rolex Discussion

VRM- how it should NOT be =====>

Joined: December 19th, 2006, 11:47 pm

February 5th, 2012, 2:23 pm #1

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael



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Joined: January 10th, 2009, 12:52 pm

February 5th, 2012, 2:44 pm #2

You know I agree with you 100% Michael!!

Sad state of affairs and mine was from a supposed 'good guy' who still gets +ve refs on here.

Leaves a bitter taste but got just to swallow it and move on mate, life is too short.

A worthwhile thread though as a reminder!
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Joined: October 12th, 2006, 4:29 pm

February 5th, 2012, 2:45 pm #3

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


You have made very valid points
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steboe
steboe

February 5th, 2012, 3:17 pm #4

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


with rough methods.Currency affairs and doubtious behaviour spoil the fun!
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Joined: August 8th, 2008, 12:55 pm

February 5th, 2012, 3:51 pm #5

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


Isn't possible to see the real condition from the dial on the pics and it's not correct if the seller said 9/10.
I hope that you will get your complete money with this post.

Best regards Roy
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Joined: July 25th, 2011, 1:09 pm

February 5th, 2012, 4:13 pm #6

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


I've always suspected that some ( or maybe more than some) of the watches for sale on the internet are not what they seem.Too many angled photos, over/under exposed etc.
Let's face it you wouldn't have bought that watch if you could have held it in your hand before parting with your money.
I am after a Milgauss 1019 and there are quite a few for sale in the EU, but I am restricting my search to the UK, so I can physically see and handle the watch before parting with my money.
This is obviously making my search more difficult but at least I am reducing
the stress/risks.
I am pleased to hear that you got most of your money back,although you deseved to get all of it back.

Victor
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Joined: July 15th, 2009, 12:46 pm

February 5th, 2012, 4:14 pm #7

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


Like you, a similar issue situation happened to me (Not on this forum.) So, I feel your pain. I hope you find another piece that will better fit you. Best of luck.
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Joined: January 24th, 2009, 3:32 pm

February 5th, 2012, 4:27 pm #8

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


Seller clearly photographed the dial with intent to hide the texture. nt
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Joined: April 2nd, 2006, 3:51 am

February 5th, 2012, 4:28 pm #9

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


I have had a similar experience with a grossly overstated dial that the buyer admitted was grossly overrated once he saw the pictures I took. But just like your deal, the seller refused to refund the shipping costs and required me to pay for the insured return shipping.

It is an unfortunate cost of doing business with sellers that are not experienced.

Trustworthy sellers, who have years of experience tend to accurately describe the quality of the watch as opposed to over state the quality because we never want the buyer to be disappointed.

You often pay a small premium buying a watch or part from an experienced and trustworthy seller but in my experience that premium is well worth the cost.

Frank

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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

February 5th, 2012, 4:36 pm #10

Caveat emptor and buy the seller are two most important sentences for everyone buying vintage watches using the Internet.

Due to Richard`s and the mods`efforts VRM is a very safe place to trade with vintage stuff. Never saw such a self-regulating market place like here.

Along with common sense you should be able to buy the desired watch or part w/o any hazzle.

Being not a newbie I avoid any ads with sentences like Refund w/o shipping costs when misrepresented as I have the feeling that shipping costs should definitely be refunded if the seller makes any mistake in his description or pictures but to each his own....

So I felt quite comfortable with a seller who seems to be one of the good when entering the market with that watch:

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Good looking, rare dial, correct serial for the dial and the seller offered a full refund in case of.....

[/IMG]

I contacted the seller asking him where the watch is located and made him an offer.
The answer was that the watch is in Europe (great) and we agreed on a price in Euro plus shipping.

One day before the seller confirmed in VRF that he can either be paid in USD or Euro but I was fine with Euro....

[/IMG]

So, just to end my due dilligence I simply asked a question:

[/IMG]

and got this answer:

[/IMG]

Fine, a dial with 9,9/10 means 99%- that is what I wanted to have....

Then I got a mail that the watch must be paid in USD (despite the fact that the seller takes both Euro and USD) but he asked the right amount with the actual daily exchange rate, so it was ok with me.

After a while the watch arrived and here is what I got....

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

Besides the fact that we can discuss what is very few spots -this dial is never 99% - on a 99% dial I expect/tolerate some 5-10 of these spots at maximum and not a complete face of Spongebob. That dial would be in my description as 55-60% not more- but hey, we all have to learn to deal with overstated descriptions..... from my point of view a clearly misrepresented watch.

Ok, I immediately decided to return the watch and notified the seller. He agreed and I returned the watch. Telling him that I want exactly the Euros back I sent him (just converted in USD) I got the answer that he will return exact the amount in USD that I sent him.

In the mean time however the Dollar lost value and I ended up with a loss of more than 250 Euros just due to exchange rate, not to mention two Fedex freights with insurance that come to 120 Euros each and the seller does not want to make good.....

In my world- if I do a mistake, I cover the costs- simple as that: I would also ask if I should initiate the watch`s return from my side or I would take the freight but no word- this seems what I have to understand from the words FULL REFUND

I can live eating the freights but we agreed on a price in Euro and it was not the amount I sent. I am pretty sure that I will not receive the money anymore but even if I would get it- it is the price for this thread...

Be careful guys, there are sellers whose reputation and honour can be bought with a bit more than 250 Euros...... knowing that you better walk away.

And last but not least:

If you read a sentence like EVERYTHING IS MATCHING in an ad, ad another point to your due dilligence and ask the seller WHY everything is matching:

1. Everything original
2. Craftmanship from a watchmaker

[/IMG]

Just check the hands of the bespoken watch and you know why I am writing this...I could have lived with that issue but not with that dial.

Summary: I lost 500 Euros and have no watch but another dealer on my black-list. That is not what VRM should be.

Thank you for your time and take care....

Michael


...is this to complain about the VRM? Or to publicly embarrass your seller? One wonders why you didn't settle these details prior to the sale.

.
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