Since we're discussing it, my problem with "enthusiastic" descriptions on the VRM...

Vintage Rolex Discussion

Since we're discussing it, my problem with "enthusiastic" descriptions on the VRM...

Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

September 6th, 2011, 5:38 pm #1

We work incredibly hard to keep our Market one of, if not the best and safest places to trade vintage Rolex on the internet. We take it very seriously and do everything we can but it is not perfect.

Let me address the strange "attacks" we've gotten the last few weeks in which relatively new people complain about how the VRM is run. We try to keep the VRF as open as we possible can, if there is any secret to our success it is that fact, you can come here and have your say limited only by your own common sense or lack thereof.

We have been allowing these mostly baseless attacks to stand because that's who we are, we take the bitter with the sweet and we respect freedom of speech but it is apparent there is perhaps more to these attacks than meet the eye. Moving forward, if you have a complaint about the VRM contact a mod for a resolution. In every case of these complaints there was an explanation of policy that could have resolved it but none of these individuals had ever made any attempt to contact a moderator.

Now, about over describing an item. We have been made aware some of our sellers are using the strong reputation that we have built over the years to take advantage of new collectors. They use their good reputation and the good reputation of the VRF to dump an average watch at an above average price because the noob doesn't know enough to know the difference. If you can overcharge by 1000 dollars and you do that 10 times a month the temptation must be strong. Personally, I think it's a despicable abuse of trust. Wild descriptions are a part of that process. A new collector sees a watch described as "like new" by a known seller and assumes it is indeed like new when in fact it is overpolished with visible corrosion. It's well and good to say buyer beware but we have a responsibility to our members and visitors to provide them with as honest deals as is humanly possible. What makes my blood boil is these sellers are abusing the VRF's reputation in their sleazy dealings. What's truly sad are the deals done off the VRF by these sellers where a trusting new collector has no protection at all.

This is why we are trying to get sellers to be realistic in their descriptions. One has to wonder why a seller over describes a watch when the majority of our members know the watch is less that the description, it's almost as if it's bait for a trusting noob. We have warned about this many times and sellers, take great care in your descriptions or we will be in touch.





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Joined: December 18th, 2010, 11:30 pm

September 6th, 2011, 6:44 pm #2

What a good post - that's what "integrity" is all about. As one of the newbies it gives me a lot of comfort to read your views, Richard.
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Joined: May 11th, 2009, 6:57 pm

September 6th, 2011, 8:23 pm #3

We work incredibly hard to keep our Market one of, if not the best and safest places to trade vintage Rolex on the internet. We take it very seriously and do everything we can but it is not perfect.

Let me address the strange "attacks" we've gotten the last few weeks in which relatively new people complain about how the VRM is run. We try to keep the VRF as open as we possible can, if there is any secret to our success it is that fact, you can come here and have your say limited only by your own common sense or lack thereof.

We have been allowing these mostly baseless attacks to stand because that's who we are, we take the bitter with the sweet and we respect freedom of speech but it is apparent there is perhaps more to these attacks than meet the eye. Moving forward, if you have a complaint about the VRM contact a mod for a resolution. In every case of these complaints there was an explanation of policy that could have resolved it but none of these individuals had ever made any attempt to contact a moderator.

Now, about over describing an item. We have been made aware some of our sellers are using the strong reputation that we have built over the years to take advantage of new collectors. They use their good reputation and the good reputation of the VRF to dump an average watch at an above average price because the noob doesn't know enough to know the difference. If you can overcharge by 1000 dollars and you do that 10 times a month the temptation must be strong. Personally, I think it's a despicable abuse of trust. Wild descriptions are a part of that process. A new collector sees a watch described as "like new" by a known seller and assumes it is indeed like new when in fact it is overpolished with visible corrosion. It's well and good to say buyer beware but we have a responsibility to our members and visitors to provide them with as honest deals as is humanly possible. What makes my blood boil is these sellers are abusing the VRF's reputation in their sleazy dealings. What's truly sad are the deals done off the VRF by these sellers where a trusting new collector has no protection at all.

This is why we are trying to get sellers to be realistic in their descriptions. One has to wonder why a seller over describes a watch when the majority of our members know the watch is less that the description, it's almost as if it's bait for a trusting noob. We have warned about this many times and sellers, take great care in your descriptions or we will be in touch.





.
I agree with all your words, Richard.
Sometimes there are guys that abuse of trust that in VRF we have.
I beg your pardon for my english...
Regards,
Stefano
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Joined: May 2nd, 2010, 9:11 pm

September 6th, 2011, 8:47 pm #4

We work incredibly hard to keep our Market one of, if not the best and safest places to trade vintage Rolex on the internet. We take it very seriously and do everything we can but it is not perfect.

Let me address the strange "attacks" we've gotten the last few weeks in which relatively new people complain about how the VRM is run. We try to keep the VRF as open as we possible can, if there is any secret to our success it is that fact, you can come here and have your say limited only by your own common sense or lack thereof.

We have been allowing these mostly baseless attacks to stand because that's who we are, we take the bitter with the sweet and we respect freedom of speech but it is apparent there is perhaps more to these attacks than meet the eye. Moving forward, if you have a complaint about the VRM contact a mod for a resolution. In every case of these complaints there was an explanation of policy that could have resolved it but none of these individuals had ever made any attempt to contact a moderator.

Now, about over describing an item. We have been made aware some of our sellers are using the strong reputation that we have built over the years to take advantage of new collectors. They use their good reputation and the good reputation of the VRF to dump an average watch at an above average price because the noob doesn't know enough to know the difference. If you can overcharge by 1000 dollars and you do that 10 times a month the temptation must be strong. Personally, I think it's a despicable abuse of trust. Wild descriptions are a part of that process. A new collector sees a watch described as "like new" by a known seller and assumes it is indeed like new when in fact it is overpolished with visible corrosion. It's well and good to say buyer beware but we have a responsibility to our members and visitors to provide them with as honest deals as is humanly possible. What makes my blood boil is these sellers are abusing the VRF's reputation in their sleazy dealings. What's truly sad are the deals done off the VRF by these sellers where a trusting new collector has no protection at all.

This is why we are trying to get sellers to be realistic in their descriptions. One has to wonder why a seller over describes a watch when the majority of our members know the watch is less that the description, it's almost as if it's bait for a trusting noob. We have warned about this many times and sellers, take great care in your descriptions or we will be in touch.





.
Agree Richard, well said.
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Joined: April 2nd, 2006, 3:51 am

September 6th, 2011, 9:05 pm #5

We work incredibly hard to keep our Market one of, if not the best and safest places to trade vintage Rolex on the internet. We take it very seriously and do everything we can but it is not perfect.

Let me address the strange "attacks" we've gotten the last few weeks in which relatively new people complain about how the VRM is run. We try to keep the VRF as open as we possible can, if there is any secret to our success it is that fact, you can come here and have your say limited only by your own common sense or lack thereof.

We have been allowing these mostly baseless attacks to stand because that's who we are, we take the bitter with the sweet and we respect freedom of speech but it is apparent there is perhaps more to these attacks than meet the eye. Moving forward, if you have a complaint about the VRM contact a mod for a resolution. In every case of these complaints there was an explanation of policy that could have resolved it but none of these individuals had ever made any attempt to contact a moderator.

Now, about over describing an item. We have been made aware some of our sellers are using the strong reputation that we have built over the years to take advantage of new collectors. They use their good reputation and the good reputation of the VRF to dump an average watch at an above average price because the noob doesn't know enough to know the difference. If you can overcharge by 1000 dollars and you do that 10 times a month the temptation must be strong. Personally, I think it's a despicable abuse of trust. Wild descriptions are a part of that process. A new collector sees a watch described as "like new" by a known seller and assumes it is indeed like new when in fact it is overpolished with visible corrosion. It's well and good to say buyer beware but we have a responsibility to our members and visitors to provide them with as honest deals as is humanly possible. What makes my blood boil is these sellers are abusing the VRF's reputation in their sleazy dealings. What's truly sad are the deals done off the VRF by these sellers where a trusting new collector has no protection at all.

This is why we are trying to get sellers to be realistic in their descriptions. One has to wonder why a seller over describes a watch when the majority of our members know the watch is less that the description, it's almost as if it's bait for a trusting noob. We have warned about this many times and sellers, take great care in your descriptions or we will be in touch.





.
Well said!
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Joined: July 25th, 2010, 6:16 am

September 6th, 2011, 11:54 pm #6

We work incredibly hard to keep our Market one of, if not the best and safest places to trade vintage Rolex on the internet. We take it very seriously and do everything we can but it is not perfect.

Let me address the strange "attacks" we've gotten the last few weeks in which relatively new people complain about how the VRM is run. We try to keep the VRF as open as we possible can, if there is any secret to our success it is that fact, you can come here and have your say limited only by your own common sense or lack thereof.

We have been allowing these mostly baseless attacks to stand because that's who we are, we take the bitter with the sweet and we respect freedom of speech but it is apparent there is perhaps more to these attacks than meet the eye. Moving forward, if you have a complaint about the VRM contact a mod for a resolution. In every case of these complaints there was an explanation of policy that could have resolved it but none of these individuals had ever made any attempt to contact a moderator.

Now, about over describing an item. We have been made aware some of our sellers are using the strong reputation that we have built over the years to take advantage of new collectors. They use their good reputation and the good reputation of the VRF to dump an average watch at an above average price because the noob doesn't know enough to know the difference. If you can overcharge by 1000 dollars and you do that 10 times a month the temptation must be strong. Personally, I think it's a despicable abuse of trust. Wild descriptions are a part of that process. A new collector sees a watch described as "like new" by a known seller and assumes it is indeed like new when in fact it is overpolished with visible corrosion. It's well and good to say buyer beware but we have a responsibility to our members and visitors to provide them with as honest deals as is humanly possible. What makes my blood boil is these sellers are abusing the VRF's reputation in their sleazy dealings. What's truly sad are the deals done off the VRF by these sellers where a trusting new collector has no protection at all.

This is why we are trying to get sellers to be realistic in their descriptions. One has to wonder why a seller over describes a watch when the majority of our members know the watch is less that the description, it's almost as if it's bait for a trusting noob. We have warned about this many times and sellers, take great care in your descriptions or we will be in touch.





.
In all these to..ing and fro..ing, the most important opinion is yours, Richard! In fact, as Owner, your opinion is not mere opinion, but POLICY!. Thank You for the clarification; now everyone is clear on this issue, will modify their conduct if necessary, and we can get on to being friends and buddies bonded by a common interest.

I have also seen the posts by Jed and the other Mods, where they seem to take the view that the Mods are taking the brunt of the attacks for perceived shortcomings.I think this is not at all the case. Most of the "attacks" are not aimed at the Mods, but more directly at the "deviators". Some exchanges may have been motivated by personal agenda between parties; so NO, ....

1] The exchanges are not aimed at the Mods, who need to work with a light touch, in line with the "openess" tone of this Forum, a policy decision set by you (RC), which I support 110%,

2] No, it is not Mods who have the primary responsibility on the issue. That lies with the members of this Forum, buyers , sellers, or just bloggers. Self restraint is the mark of a gentleman, and gentle people are the foundation of a civilised community.

3] There is no conspiracy to "do in" this Forum..by scurillous attacks. Many comments come from new enthusiastic (and unconnected) members, whose main shortcomings may be an excess of naivete and knowledge, but I see no evil anywhere. Most comments are, in my view, expressions of concern in a genuine way.

4] No the End is not near for VRF because of the vigourous discourse over the last few days; it is precisely these that make VRF so successful. Open, democratic, energetic, informative, intellectual, unboring, vibrant, funny, fun ... there is no end to the any number of adjectives I can use. NO,VRF has become stronger ,not weaker. So no need for all the angst..NO.

Thanks again, Richard, and Team, for the pleasure, honour and ...etc..
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Joined: May 2nd, 2010, 9:11 pm

September 7th, 2011, 12:27 am #7

Without sounding like a sycophant, you, too,make make very salient points MC
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Joined: November 8th, 2009, 10:32 pm

September 7th, 2011, 1:38 am #8

& I enjoy reading your post as it alway presents as a "glass half full" approach to life.....


Cheers from Melbourne....
Mark
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Joined: August 7th, 2009, 5:12 am

September 7th, 2011, 1:55 am #9

We work incredibly hard to keep our Market one of, if not the best and safest places to trade vintage Rolex on the internet. We take it very seriously and do everything we can but it is not perfect.

Let me address the strange "attacks" we've gotten the last few weeks in which relatively new people complain about how the VRM is run. We try to keep the VRF as open as we possible can, if there is any secret to our success it is that fact, you can come here and have your say limited only by your own common sense or lack thereof.

We have been allowing these mostly baseless attacks to stand because that's who we are, we take the bitter with the sweet and we respect freedom of speech but it is apparent there is perhaps more to these attacks than meet the eye. Moving forward, if you have a complaint about the VRM contact a mod for a resolution. In every case of these complaints there was an explanation of policy that could have resolved it but none of these individuals had ever made any attempt to contact a moderator.

Now, about over describing an item. We have been made aware some of our sellers are using the strong reputation that we have built over the years to take advantage of new collectors. They use their good reputation and the good reputation of the VRF to dump an average watch at an above average price because the noob doesn't know enough to know the difference. If you can overcharge by 1000 dollars and you do that 10 times a month the temptation must be strong. Personally, I think it's a despicable abuse of trust. Wild descriptions are a part of that process. A new collector sees a watch described as "like new" by a known seller and assumes it is indeed like new when in fact it is overpolished with visible corrosion. It's well and good to say buyer beware but we have a responsibility to our members and visitors to provide them with as honest deals as is humanly possible. What makes my blood boil is these sellers are abusing the VRF's reputation in their sleazy dealings. What's truly sad are the deals done off the VRF by these sellers where a trusting new collector has no protection at all.

This is why we are trying to get sellers to be realistic in their descriptions. One has to wonder why a seller over describes a watch when the majority of our members know the watch is less that the description, it's almost as if it's bait for a trusting noob. We have warned about this many times and sellers, take great care in your descriptions or we will be in touch.





.
bravo, well said
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Joined: May 2nd, 2010, 9:11 pm

September 7th, 2011, 2:12 am #10

& I enjoy reading your post as it alway presents as a "glass half full" approach to life.....


Cheers from Melbourne....
Mark
Thanks Mate!
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