how i saw a bantam C game

how i saw a bantam C game

Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 12:54 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 12:49 am #1

I am not from either team but watched a game between orillia and Toronto, I have never seen this bad of reffing in my life. This ref took a goal away from orillia 3 min after it was called a goal and it was also put on the game sheet. They scored with 32 seconds left in the second period to take the lead and then played the rest of the period, when they came out to start the 3rd the ref told the coaching staff they were taking the goal away for the players stick going through the crease. The coaching staff stopped the game and asked for someone higher up to come out and fix this problem, some guy (Rick Philips) came out and fixed nothing. What's the point of these guys if they don't fix problems.
Anyway, the goal was taken away. The coaches then called Toronto for illegal masks which they had on(ola rule) and once again they got screwed over by the ref and Rick Philips(vp of officiating for the ola). Toronto then got a power play and you could see the orillia boys just deflate. All I am saying is the boys don't determine the game anymore, if the refs want to they can an no one will step up and make the correct call.orillia got scored on when Toronto had the power play and you could see the game was over.
This ref should lose his card an Rick Philips should be removed from the ola board. These kind of people are killing the game.

The ola needs to step up a say there was a mistake and the orillia team was screwed over, these kinds of things is why we lose kids and parents.

Congrats to inisfil but your championship is tainted, you knew that you should of had to go through orillia to win but others made that choice for you.
I hope that the ola and Rick Philips do the right thing.

My thoughts from another zone 4 person. .
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Joined: Mon Jun 16, 2008 1:18 am

Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:46 am #2

The bias in this post is so thick you could cut it with a knife. Sure the recall of the goal after the period is a bad call, but the team still had a whole period to make it up, which good teams will do no problem. With regards to the masks, unless they were the flat cages they are not illegal.

Let's not make it personal either by bringing names into this case . I know for a fact Mr. Phillips would not intentionally do anything to "screw over" another team. Your proposition of removing him from the OLA board is ridiculous as he has done more for lacrosse than you could do in 4 lifetimes.
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Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2004 2:54 am

Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:49 am #3

I am not from either team but watched a game between orillia and Toronto, I have never seen this bad of reffing in my life. This ref took a goal away from orillia 3 min after it was called a goal and it was also put on the game sheet. They scored with 32 seconds left in the second period to take the lead and then played the rest of the period, when they came out to start the 3rd the ref told the coaching staff they were taking the goal away for the players stick going through the crease. The coaching staff stopped the game and asked for someone higher up to come out and fix this problem, some guy (Rick Philips) came out and fixed nothing. What's the point of these guys if they don't fix problems.
Anyway, the goal was taken away. The coaches then called Toronto for illegal masks which they had on(ola rule) and once again they got screwed over by the ref and Rick Philips(vp of officiating for the ola). Toronto then got a power play and you could see the orillia boys just deflate. All I am saying is the boys don't determine the game anymore, if the refs want to they can an no one will step up and make the correct call.orillia got scored on when Toronto had the power play and you could see the game was over.
This ref should lose his card an Rick Philips should be removed from the ola board. These kind of people are killing the game.

The ola needs to step up a say there was a mistake and the orillia team was screwed over, these kinds of things is why we lose kids and parents.

Congrats to inisfil but your championship is tainted, you knew that you should of had to go through orillia to win but others made that choice for you.
I hope that the ola and Rick Philips do the right thing.

My thoughts from another zone 4 person. .
Funny, I saw the same game, the one on floor officail actually awarded the goal and it was waved off by the other, after a discussion, the goal was disallowed. Period end of story. Not sure who decided to summon the "OLA Official" as they have no ability to honor or disallow goals, in fact in my 35 year history in lacrosse, I've never seen a OLA official be able to over turn an on floor call. Not sure what you wanted "Rick Phillips" to do or how he somehow tainted the Toronto victory, but then again you think you've see it all then you show up for provincials and something else comes along to blow that theory out the window.

Part II, as far as I know, the Gait mask was deemed legal by the Bantam RIC, once again, period end of story. So really what's your beef?

Like normal, an ill informed parent with a little knowledge is a very dangerous thing. Until you gather all the facts beyond naming names on a "unofficial" website, why don't you gather all of the critical data then go and shoot your mouth off.

You have some very overworked officials working as hard as they possibly can to help "all invovled".

It's parents like you that drive good volunteers away, maybe you should step up and volunteer a few hours, but then again, when I read your post I think not. I would pull your kid and play baseball or soccer, it would be more suitable.
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Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2002 4:40 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:00 am #4

i haven't read a post as lame as this original poster in awhile, I actually chuckled out loud. Firstly to pretend you aren't involved with Orillia is lame, to be unaware of basic rules makes you look worse, and to think a convenor can tell the refs what to do is laughable, i'd never participate in a tourney where the guy checking game sheets had the power to award goals, gimme a break you sore loser, get over it.
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Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 3:41 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:01 am #5

I am not from either team but watched a game between orillia and Toronto, I have never seen this bad of reffing in my life. This ref took a goal away from orillia 3 min after it was called a goal and it was also put on the game sheet. They scored with 32 seconds left in the second period to take the lead and then played the rest of the period, when they came out to start the 3rd the ref told the coaching staff they were taking the goal away for the players stick going through the crease. The coaching staff stopped the game and asked for someone higher up to come out and fix this problem, some guy (Rick Philips) came out and fixed nothing. What's the point of these guys if they don't fix problems.
Anyway, the goal was taken away. The coaches then called Toronto for illegal masks which they had on(ola rule) and once again they got screwed over by the ref and Rick Philips(vp of officiating for the ola). Toronto then got a power play and you could see the orillia boys just deflate. All I am saying is the boys don't determine the game anymore, if the refs want to they can an no one will step up and make the correct call.orillia got scored on when Toronto had the power play and you could see the game was over.
This ref should lose his card an Rick Philips should be removed from the ola board. These kind of people are killing the game.

The ola needs to step up a say there was a mistake and the orillia team was screwed over, these kinds of things is why we lose kids and parents.

Congrats to inisfil but your championship is tainted, you knew that you should of had to go through orillia to win but others made that choice for you.
I hope that the ola and Rick Philips do the right thing.

My thoughts from another zone 4 person. .
Rick Phillips is the Head of Coaching for the OLA, not the head of officiating.
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Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 12:01 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:14 am #6

I am not from either team but watched a game between orillia and Toronto, I have never seen this bad of reffing in my life. This ref took a goal away from orillia 3 min after it was called a goal and it was also put on the game sheet. They scored with 32 seconds left in the second period to take the lead and then played the rest of the period, when they came out to start the 3rd the ref told the coaching staff they were taking the goal away for the players stick going through the crease. The coaching staff stopped the game and asked for someone higher up to come out and fix this problem, some guy (Rick Philips) came out and fixed nothing. What's the point of these guys if they don't fix problems.
Anyway, the goal was taken away. The coaches then called Toronto for illegal masks which they had on(ola rule) and once again they got screwed over by the ref and Rick Philips(vp of officiating for the ola). Toronto then got a power play and you could see the orillia boys just deflate. All I am saying is the boys don't determine the game anymore, if the refs want to they can an no one will step up and make the correct call.orillia got scored on when Toronto had the power play and you could see the game was over.
This ref should lose his card an Rick Philips should be removed from the ola board. These kind of people are killing the game.

The ola needs to step up a say there was a mistake and the orillia team was screwed over, these kinds of things is why we lose kids and parents.

Congrats to inisfil but your championship is tainted, you knew that you should of had to go through orillia to win but others made that choice for you.
I hope that the ola and Rick Philips do the right thing.

My thoughts from another zone 4 person. .
As you are not with either of the teams are you sure you got this right? I have never heard of a Referee taking away a goal after play resumed but I may be wrong. I certainly can't imagine it being for the reason you stated though. Rule 39(d) states that "The stick or other parts of the body except the feet may enter the goal crease in the act of shooting or faking, but may not make contact with the floor or the defending player/goalkeeper." If the Referee reported a goal to the scorekeeper and it was recorded on the game sheet that should be the end of it. Did they take it OFF the game sheet? Rick Phillips btw is the OLA V.P. of Coaching and Kevin MacPherson is the OLA V.P. of Officiating. Neither of them could over turn an on floor call by a Referee any way.

As for Innisfil's championship being "tainted", who are you kidding? They played who ever showed up and beat them all in the championship rounds. Don't try to take anything away from them. They earned their championship fair and square.

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Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 2:18 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 11:03 am #7

I am not from either team but watched a game between orillia and Toronto, I have never seen this bad of reffing in my life. This ref took a goal away from orillia 3 min after it was called a goal and it was also put on the game sheet. They scored with 32 seconds left in the second period to take the lead and then played the rest of the period, when they came out to start the 3rd the ref told the coaching staff they were taking the goal away for the players stick going through the crease. The coaching staff stopped the game and asked for someone higher up to come out and fix this problem, some guy (Rick Philips) came out and fixed nothing. What's the point of these guys if they don't fix problems.
Anyway, the goal was taken away. The coaches then called Toronto for illegal masks which they had on(ola rule) and once again they got screwed over by the ref and Rick Philips(vp of officiating for the ola). Toronto then got a power play and you could see the orillia boys just deflate. All I am saying is the boys don't determine the game anymore, if the refs want to they can an no one will step up and make the correct call.orillia got scored on when Toronto had the power play and you could see the game was over.
This ref should lose his card an Rick Philips should be removed from the ola board. These kind of people are killing the game.

The ola needs to step up a say there was a mistake and the orillia team was screwed over, these kinds of things is why we lose kids and parents.

Congrats to inisfil but your championship is tainted, you knew that you should of had to go through orillia to win but others made that choice for you.
I hope that the ola and Rick Philips do the right thing.

My thoughts from another zone 4 person. .
Orillia has been calling other teams for illegal equipment all year....specifically the gait mask.....which isnt illegal.....and the coaching staff has hurt their players chances at winning several times because of this....boys....the cage ain't illegal.....get over it and play the games
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Joined: Sat May 31, 2003 2:18 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 11:31 am #8

i haven't read a post as lame as this original poster in awhile, I actually chuckled out loud. Firstly to pretend you aren't involved with Orillia is lame, to be unaware of basic rules makes you look worse, and to think a convenor can tell the refs what to do is laughable, i'd never participate in a tourney where the guy checking game sheets had the power to award goals, gimme a break you sore loser, get over it.
I never saw this game but your info is wrong . The VP of officiating for the OLA is Kevin Macphearson. I think maybe your mistaking a tournament RIC for the VP.
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Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2009 2:51 pm

Tue Aug 04, 2009 12:33 pm #9

I am not from either team but watched a game between orillia and Toronto, I have never seen this bad of reffing in my life. This ref took a goal away from orillia 3 min after it was called a goal and it was also put on the game sheet. They scored with 32 seconds left in the second period to take the lead and then played the rest of the period, when they came out to start the 3rd the ref told the coaching staff they were taking the goal away for the players stick going through the crease. The coaching staff stopped the game and asked for someone higher up to come out and fix this problem, some guy (Rick Philips) came out and fixed nothing. What's the point of these guys if they don't fix problems.
Anyway, the goal was taken away. The coaches then called Toronto for illegal masks which they had on(ola rule) and once again they got screwed over by the ref and Rick Philips(vp of officiating for the ola). Toronto then got a power play and you could see the orillia boys just deflate. All I am saying is the boys don't determine the game anymore, if the refs want to they can an no one will step up and make the correct call.orillia got scored on when Toronto had the power play and you could see the game was over.
This ref should lose his card an Rick Philips should be removed from the ola board. These kind of people are killing the game.

The ola needs to step up a say there was a mistake and the orillia team was screwed over, these kinds of things is why we lose kids and parents.

Congrats to inisfil but your championship is tainted, you knew that you should of had to go through orillia to win but others made that choice for you.
I hope that the ola and Rick Philips do the right thing.

My thoughts from another zone 4 person. .
I love how you say your from either team but yet care so much to try and remember what happend in the game and throw peoples names around the forum. I would suggest you get you facts straight, obviously you have no idea what your talking about because trying to get these refs removed will never happen, because of a bad call or two, and trying to get one of the most enthusiastic, and one of the biggest people too push the sport in lacrosse, and volunteers to teach other people how to coach in this sport removed, will never happen, just because you angry how your team lost, and your son probably road the pine's in the tournament, and you had so much time to put you nose were it shouldn't be isn't our issue, so honestly, i wouldn't throw names around.

and by the way your thoughts should stay your thoughts.

WALDO


TUGGY GBNF 41
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Joined: Mon Aug 16, 2004 1:33 am

Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:05 pm #10

Orillia has been calling other teams for illegal equipment all year....specifically the gait mask.....which isnt illegal.....and the coaching staff has hurt their players chances at winning several times because of this....boys....the cage ain't illegal.....get over it and play the games
Gait Mask rule as explained at the SAGM Equipment Module that I attended, they explained that you cant remove the ear flaps or original chin strap from the helmet, then when you attach the Gait Mask it has to hinge with strap attached to the actual face mask (original Gait Masks didnt have straps which didnt allow them to hinge) and it has to have the chin cup that comes with the mask attached. It was explained that the straight Gait mask to be legal had to have the original helmet chin strap plus the Gait chin cup / strap and straps attached to the mask.

I wanted to make sure because we got a 2 minute penalty in Bantam Provincials last year for not having the original helmet chin strap on and the player missed a half a period until the helmet was fixed. Im not sure why this rule changes from year to year and even in the same year, seems simple to me.

This is taken from the Ontario Lacrosse Referees Association Site from a memo the CLA issued, who govern the OLA I believe, and if you read rule 12.5.1.1.1. below I think that it would prove that any helmet without the original chin strap does not meet requirements below, and would seem to indicate that without the chin strap would be illegal

CLA Operations Manual Issued June 2008
12. SECTION 12: Safety and Equipment
12.4. Helmets
12.4.1. For Box and Men's Field Lacrosse, all players are required to wear a helmet which must meet either of the following standards:
12.4.1.1. A helmet with facial protector approved as a complete unit by National Organizing Committee for Safety in Athletic Equipment (NOCSAE) for lacrosse.
12.4.1.2. A helmet that is Canadian Standards Association (CSA) approved for Ice Hockey. An approved facemask as stated under Facial Protection in this Section must be attached.
12.4.1.2.1. These standards establish certain mandatory requirements for helmets in the following areas
12.4.1.2.1.1. materials used in fabrication;
12.4.1.2.1.2. assembly, design and finish;
12.4.1.2.1.3. helmet size and area of head coverage;
12.4.1.2.1.4. impact resistance;
12.4.1.2.1.5. penetration resistance;
12.4.1.2.1.6. strength and durability;
12.4.1.2.1.7. labels, tags and markings;
12.4.1.2.1.8. chin strap that can be properly fastened
12.4.1.3. Lacrosse is a sport with intrinsic hazards and participation in the sport implies the acceptance of some risk of injury. When used as intended for lacrosse and in accordance with the manufacturers fitting instructions, the use of the helmet certified under these standards is intended to reduce the frequency and severity of head injuries.

12.5. Facial Protection
12.5.1. For Box Lacrosse and Mens Field Lacrosse, all players are required to wear a facemask firmly affixed to the helmet which must meet all of the following guidelines:
12.5.1.1. The facemask must be approved under the CSA standard for Ice Hockey or under the NOCSAE standard for Lacrosse.
12.5.1.1.1. A NOCSAE approved facemask can be used with a CSA approved helmet provided attaching the facemask to the helmet does not alter the helmet in anyway which would void the CSA approval
12.5.1.2. The facemask shall be designed to cover the wearers entire face to the lower line of the jaw, and prevent the ball or the head of the stick from touching the face of the wearer.
12.5.1.3. The facemask must be finished so that it does not create a risk of injury to the wearer or another person when it is used as it is intended.
12.5.1.4. These standards establish mandatory requirements for facemasks in the following areas:
12.5.1.4.1. Identification that states the model number;
12.5.1.4.2. CSA or NOCSAE Approval on the mask;
12.5.1.4.3. A chin cup protector (that protects the chin);
12.5.1.4.4. A two or four point strap configuration that would allow the user to fasten the mask to the helmet;
12.5.1.4.5. Name of Manufacturer;
12.5.1.4.6. Year or date of manufacture;
12.5.1.4.7. Junior or Senior mask;
12.5.1.4.8. To be approved, a label must be attached to the mask and remain attached. The information must be easily visible to officials at all times.

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