An honest question about OLA tournament rules

An honest question about OLA tournament rules

Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2002 2:30 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:52 am #1

I received an email two days prior to attending an OLA sanctioned minor lacrosse tournament, and the following exact verbage was rule # 7:

"Although it is understood that errors may be made during the course of any lacrosse game, all decisions rendered by the referees are final and can not be protested."

My question - is this not a violation of the OLA rules to not allow or have an appeal / protest procedure at a sanctioned event?

There was an on floor incident involving a goaltender a) leaving his crease during a fight, and b) becoming the third man in the fight. The goaltender (the only one the opponent had by the way), was initially given a 2 minute minor for roughing. When I questioned the call, and stated he clearly left his crease, and threw punches at a player already engaged (3rd man in) the refs conferred, and the call was then changed to a 5 minute major for roughing (with only 1:47 left in the game). Of course we tried to appeal / protest after the game and were pointed back to the rule above.

The sad irony is that tournament officials that were present stated afterwards that yes indeed the goalie left his crease, and yes indeed he became the third man in, and in their opinion yes indeed he should have been ejected from the game. But that could not happen.

So I honestly want to know if such a rule is valid.

My second question is about the integrity of such a tournament rule coming out, two days before the 1st game, long after my team's money has already been received. Honestly, had I known this rule existed, I might have thought twice about entering. Kind of hard to accept if you get a ref that makes a poor decision, with other off floor officials there to see it.

Maybe this is an item for the OLA annual or semi-annual discussion, to force tournament organizers to post home made rules in advance of taking payments. I feel a little duped.
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:00 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 3:06 pm #2

Gary, surprised you did not know that rule...it is also in place at provincials, where even more is on the line.
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Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 2:19 am

Sun Jun 27, 2010 3:16 pm #3

2 years ago we protested a fight between us and halton hills and we won and thre suspension was changed from 3 games which would of been the rest of the provincials to a 2 game suspension... but last year we tried to protest and we were unable too...
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Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2002 2:30 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 3:26 pm #4

I know that many times decisions do not get changed, but am I to believe that tournaments do not even have to entertain an appeal?

If that is the case, then yes I did not know that.
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:00 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 3:41 pm #5

2 years ago we protested a fight between us and halton hills and we won and thre suspension was changed from 3 games which would of been the rest of the provincials to a 2 game suspension... but last year we tried to protest and we were unable too...
but appealing a suspension is different then appealing a refs call. Refs only deteremine the call they do not determine the length of a suspension.
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Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:22 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 4:23 pm #6

I received an email two days prior to attending an OLA sanctioned minor lacrosse tournament, and the following exact verbage was rule # 7:

"Although it is understood that errors may be made during the course of any lacrosse game, all decisions rendered by the referees are final and can not be protested."

My question - is this not a violation of the OLA rules to not allow or have an appeal / protest procedure at a sanctioned event?

There was an on floor incident involving a goaltender a) leaving his crease during a fight, and b) becoming the third man in the fight. The goaltender (the only one the opponent had by the way), was initially given a 2 minute minor for roughing. When I questioned the call, and stated he clearly left his crease, and threw punches at a player already engaged (3rd man in) the refs conferred, and the call was then changed to a 5 minute major for roughing (with only 1:47 left in the game). Of course we tried to appeal / protest after the game and were pointed back to the rule above.

The sad irony is that tournament officials that were present stated afterwards that yes indeed the goalie left his crease, and yes indeed he became the third man in, and in their opinion yes indeed he should have been ejected from the game. But that could not happen.

So I honestly want to know if such a rule is valid.

My second question is about the integrity of such a tournament rule coming out, two days before the 1st game, long after my team's money has already been received. Honestly, had I known this rule existed, I might have thought twice about entering. Kind of hard to accept if you get a ref that makes a poor decision, with other off floor officials there to see it.

Maybe this is an item for the OLA annual or semi-annual discussion, to force tournament organizers to post home made rules in advance of taking payments. I feel a little duped.
Please tell us what you would like them to do?
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Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2007 10:17 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:14 pm #7

I received an email two days prior to attending an OLA sanctioned minor lacrosse tournament, and the following exact verbage was rule # 7:

"Although it is understood that errors may be made during the course of any lacrosse game, all decisions rendered by the referees are final and can not be protested."

My question - is this not a violation of the OLA rules to not allow or have an appeal / protest procedure at a sanctioned event?

There was an on floor incident involving a goaltender a) leaving his crease during a fight, and b) becoming the third man in the fight. The goaltender (the only one the opponent had by the way), was initially given a 2 minute minor for roughing. When I questioned the call, and stated he clearly left his crease, and threw punches at a player already engaged (3rd man in) the refs conferred, and the call was then changed to a 5 minute major for roughing (with only 1:47 left in the game). Of course we tried to appeal / protest after the game and were pointed back to the rule above.

The sad irony is that tournament officials that were present stated afterwards that yes indeed the goalie left his crease, and yes indeed he became the third man in, and in their opinion yes indeed he should have been ejected from the game. But that could not happen.

So I honestly want to know if such a rule is valid.

My second question is about the integrity of such a tournament rule coming out, two days before the 1st game, long after my team's money has already been received. Honestly, had I known this rule existed, I might have thought twice about entering. Kind of hard to accept if you get a ref that makes a poor decision, with other off floor officials there to see it.

Maybe this is an item for the OLA annual or semi-annual discussion, to force tournament organizers to post home made rules in advance of taking payments. I feel a little duped.
have had some version of this rule in place for a long time. I always assumed it was to prevent getting bogged down in clashes of the jailhouse lawyers which are inevitable. If anyone truly believes a tournament outcome comes down to the effect of one bad call, well welcome to the 'jailhouse lawyer' moniker.
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Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2002 2:30 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:47 pm #8

Please tell us what you would like them to do?
in an era of paying $450 - $550 to enter into a tournmaent, plus travel / accomodation / food costs, I guess I thought there would be an opportunity to challenge a call that yes could have ultimatley cost a team advancing in a tournament.

I totally understand what the appeal process could turn in to, however to state that the call is the call too bad so sad, when other off floor officials in the same tournament see what happened just seems wrong.

If there is an opportunity for another non biased set of eyes to correct something I do not understand why their voice(s) should not be heard.

I guess I am wrong on this one, no biggie, and life goes on. I guess I never really knew of the rule until it happened to my team.

Gary
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Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:35 pm

Sun Jun 27, 2010 7:50 pm #9

I received an email two days prior to attending an OLA sanctioned minor lacrosse tournament, and the following exact verbage was rule # 7:

"Although it is understood that errors may be made during the course of any lacrosse game, all decisions rendered by the referees are final and can not be protested."

My question - is this not a violation of the OLA rules to not allow or have an appeal / protest procedure at a sanctioned event?

There was an on floor incident involving a goaltender a) leaving his crease during a fight, and b) becoming the third man in the fight. The goaltender (the only one the opponent had by the way), was initially given a 2 minute minor for roughing. When I questioned the call, and stated he clearly left his crease, and threw punches at a player already engaged (3rd man in) the refs conferred, and the call was then changed to a 5 minute major for roughing (with only 1:47 left in the game). Of course we tried to appeal / protest after the game and were pointed back to the rule above.

The sad irony is that tournament officials that were present stated afterwards that yes indeed the goalie left his crease, and yes indeed he became the third man in, and in their opinion yes indeed he should have been ejected from the game. But that could not happen.

So I honestly want to know if such a rule is valid.

My second question is about the integrity of such a tournament rule coming out, two days before the 1st game, long after my team's money has already been received. Honestly, had I known this rule existed, I might have thought twice about entering. Kind of hard to accept if you get a ref that makes a poor decision, with other off floor officials there to see it.

Maybe this is an item for the OLA annual or semi-annual discussion, to force tournament organizers to post home made rules in advance of taking payments. I feel a little duped.
Here's another question. Does Tyke now have the 10 second rule for getting over half when short handed? I had a Tyke parent tell me this was called consistantly in one of their tournaments. Has this rule changed or did the tournament bring this in on their own, or perhaps it was a referee forgetting it was Tyke.
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Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2002 2:30 pm

Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:49 am #10

I received an email two days prior to attending an OLA sanctioned minor lacrosse tournament, and the following exact verbage was rule # 7:

"Although it is understood that errors may be made during the course of any lacrosse game, all decisions rendered by the referees are final and can not be protested."

My question - is this not a violation of the OLA rules to not allow or have an appeal / protest procedure at a sanctioned event?

There was an on floor incident involving a goaltender a) leaving his crease during a fight, and b) becoming the third man in the fight. The goaltender (the only one the opponent had by the way), was initially given a 2 minute minor for roughing. When I questioned the call, and stated he clearly left his crease, and threw punches at a player already engaged (3rd man in) the refs conferred, and the call was then changed to a 5 minute major for roughing (with only 1:47 left in the game). Of course we tried to appeal / protest after the game and were pointed back to the rule above.

The sad irony is that tournament officials that were present stated afterwards that yes indeed the goalie left his crease, and yes indeed he became the third man in, and in their opinion yes indeed he should have been ejected from the game. But that could not happen.

So I honestly want to know if such a rule is valid.

My second question is about the integrity of such a tournament rule coming out, two days before the 1st game, long after my team's money has already been received. Honestly, had I known this rule existed, I might have thought twice about entering. Kind of hard to accept if you get a ref that makes a poor decision, with other off floor officials there to see it.

Maybe this is an item for the OLA annual or semi-annual discussion, to force tournament organizers to post home made rules in advance of taking payments. I feel a little duped.
My post up above has negatively impacted at least a couple individuals and I have apologized to them for it.

The post points to a potential flaw in the system, when in actual fact, that was only the last straw in a day that was quite possibly the worst one I've had in my lacrosse Coaching days.

I have apologized personally to these people and after explaining the events of the day, I hope they understand it is sincere.

I am still quite angry at the root cause of my vent, but will not get into that on here.

I've always been told that sometimes it is better to just bite your tongue, I wish I had.

Gary Mark
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