Lou's Forza Upgrade & Tuning Q & A

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Lou's Forza Upgrade & Tuning Q & A

justLou72
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January 21st, 2015, 9:31 pm #1

Lou's Forza Upgrading & Tuning Q & A

Updated: 29-FEB-2016

It's been a while since the last time I put one of these posts together. Since I am doing the FM5 (and soon to be FH2) Leader-board Challenge, which is setting a decent & clean time on every track in every class, I've been doing a lot of builds/tunes. A lot of those have been retunes and/or rebuilds of cars I previously built/tuned. I had to rebuild and/or retune them because they were too much one way or another. By that, I mean they were either too fast and did not handle, or they were on rails but cannot get out of it's own way.

Building Cars

Quick Q&A

What class do you normally build cars to?
I build cars for all classes, but my favorite classes are C, B, A, S, and R. P is also quite a bit of fun in race cars, but I really don't care for X except when running the Lotus F1 car. D-Class can be and is a BLAST on the right track in the right car.

For most modern performance cars, I typically won't go much higher that ~150 to ~200 PI points above stock PI. Some of my best builds are within the same class as the stock form of the car only using 20-50 PI points for the build. Really this all comes down to personal preference, but more often than not, once a build goes more than 2 classes over stock, the car is no longer competitive and can become more than a handful on a good day. That is a general rule, and there are most definitely exceptions.

Do you pick the cars you build/tune off of the top 100 leader-boards for each track to try and break into the top LB spots?
I NEVER do it intentionally, and I find it more challenging building and tuning cars that are NOT LB cars. I honestly do not care about my global LB rank. I love breaking into the to 1% with non-leaderboard cars, and it feels great to be in the top 1000; however, if I know I drove the wheels off the car and had a great run, then I'm ultimately satisfied with that time in that car. My philosophy is "build it, tune it, test it, paint it, race it, and if it's good then share it!" Most of all I have FUN. If I am not having fun, then why do it? It's a game right! :mrgreen:

What is your philosophy to building and tuning cars in Forza?
In Forza Motorsport, I work to three different types of builds (Grip, All Around, or Speed). There are subcategories for each of the three, and I've outlined those in my FM6 Charts & Lists Google Spreadsheetbased on Raceboy77's Choosing a Car for a Track video. The link to his video is in the the spreadsheet.

In Forza Horizon, I relax and have fun building/tuning cars. I see Horizon as me versus the game, so I have fun with it.

What order should you install parts?
That all depends on the car and how many PI points I have to play with.

I always throw on a Race Diff 1st. It's 0 PI and I do it first so I don't forget. If I only have 20 PI points to play with, I go with Race Brakes, Shocks, and ARB. I also go with at least a Sport Flywheel (engine revs faster) and then look at some weight reduction. Drive-shaft, rims, and/or actual weight reduction. I could also go with an exhaust upgrade if I need a little bit more top end. Remember that handling, acceleration, braking and launch (most of the time) increase when weight is reduced. The only thing not increased with weight reduction is Top Speed. Only Transmission tuning, HP and/or reduced drag can do that. I will break down my parts order in another section on this page.

What tire compound & sizes should I use?
Fist and foremost: are the stock tires adequate for the stock power and have I upgraded the tire compound already? This information is important because, it is very easy to oversize the tires for the power and performance of the vehicle. Since I've been building and tuning in FM for quite some time, I'm pretty good at choosing the right combo for the build. There is no easy formula that I know of for determining the optimal tire size/compound for a car based on power, torque and weight. Experience is the best teacher here.

With all of this said about tires, I follow a very simple method (once I know what type of build I am aiming for):
  1. Adjust Tire Width first to what makes sense. There are times that too much width will hurt.
  2. Install Lighter Rims - This helps but there is no difference between sprung and unsprung weight in Forza.
  3. Rim Diameter - There are times this is needed - I like to keep my tires at a 35-45 aspect ration. Why? Because that's what I like ;-)
  4. Tire Compound - usually last because of the impact. In lower classes (E, D, C and B) Race tires are overkill and aren't really needed. In R, P & X they are needed more often than not. In A & S it all depends on the target handling rating and the car itself.
Does the rim size make a different?
Simple answer is sort of. But it could be a negative difference. Race cars do not run low profile tires (typical race slicks sport a 55-45 ratio). Race compound tires have much stiffer side-walls when compared to street tires. While the build might work fine running 245-25/R20 Street compound tires, it might be a completely different story with Race Compound tires. I typically adjust my rim sizes so the tire side-wall ratio is no smaller than 35 at width. I say at width because the 35 number is a the ratio of side-wall to overall tread width. The wider the tire, the smaller that number will become. Lower profile tires also contain less air volume, which means they will heat up faster. It also means they can overheat easier, but will dissipate heat faster. I've had the best results setting rim size to gain a side-wall ratio of between 40-55 regardless of the PI change (positive or negative).

When do you do an aspiration upgrade?
This one is really builder preference. Some love adding boost to an NA engine early, and some only add it when the desired PI cannot be achieved with a fully upgraded stock NA engine. I am the latter. I usually only apply Forced Induction when I need to to reach a particular PI or I need to add torque to a low TQ high HP engine.

When do you do an engine swap?
When I cannot achieve the desired PI by fully upgrading the stock engine (including boost), or when the swapped engine is far better than stock. Some love to swap the engine out first, and I will do that when I know that I am jumping 2 or more classes above stock. I know from experience that I will need it to get from a stock D-class to A-class or a stock c-class to s-class. That is a general rule and there are some exception. Most of the exceptions are cars that come with engines that are used as FM5 upgrades (like the Subaru 2.5L flat 4 or the Hemi in the cuda). I usually like to keep the stock engine installed and use that to define the class(es) the car will be built to run.

When should I do a drive-train swap?
This is really personal preference. I will convert a FWD car to RWD or AWD for racing in A-Class and up, and those are some really fun cars. I will also take some AWD cars and make them RWD, but that was more an FM4 thing since AWD was so handicapped in FM4. In FM5/6, I find AWD cars are a lot more competitive. I usually leave RWD cars alone unless I am working on a fun builds in FH. One positive to a drive train swap is that the swap installs a very fast dual clutch gearbox in FM5/6.

Build Order

This is just my default preference for builds (for competitive circuit builds). There are several factors that come into play here. The most restrictive is how many PI points I have to play with. For FH, I am less strict on my builds, since it's FAR less competitive compared to FM. Different tracks in FM6 require different build types. Raceboy77 put together a great video on this in Jan-2016, and I have incorporated that information into my FM6 Charts & Lists Google Spreadsheet. Before I start building, I need to have a target HANDLING rating I want to achieve and whether or not I might want Race Aero (if I'm pretty sure I want race aero on a speed build I install it FIRST).

Once I know what my targets are, I pretty much build in the following order:
  1. Race Differential Costs ZERO PI and ZERO weight. Why wouldn't I install this part? It's essential to EVERY build!
  2. Brakes: Essential to faster lap times. Properly tuned brakes are a godsend! Go with Sport if you don't have the PI or if you don't care to mess with balance and pressure adjustments. Go with Race if you have the PI room and you don't mind adjusting the brakes. Race brakes can be worse than Sport brakes if not adjusted properly!
  3. Race Shocks: This is a must in FM5 in order to get the most out of the car. The right tune can represent 50 additional PI on other builds.
  4. Race FR/R Anti-Roll Bars: Go along with the Race Shocks, and, like the Shocks, can have a much larger pay-off than the PI cost represents with the right tune!
  5. Chassis Reinforcement: Essential for some cars. Not needed on others. Most are somewhere in between. Sometimes the Race Roll Cage doesn't benefit until fully upgraded engine, tires, suspension, weight reduction, etc. are present. It can always be added later in the build to reduce PI if needed.
  6. Weight Reduction: Makes the car stop faster, handle better and accelerate quicker. For ultralight cars with lots of power, removing too much weight can adversely affect performance despite what the PI change states
  7. Tire Width & Compound: Install depending on need. The widest tire is not always the best choice. Sometimes keeping the stock compound (or only going up one) and increasing the width is the way to go. It really depends on the target handling you want for the car, but always adjust compound AFTER width!
  8. Rims: BLING! Actually they make a huge difference. Reducing unsprung mass (Brakes, Wheels & Tires) makes huge improvements in handling and overall vehicle dynamics.
  9. Rim Size: I like to have the side-wall ratio at 35 to 45 for Sport and Race compound tires. For street and stock tires, I usually keep the rims stock as well.
  10. Transmission: While on most cars, upgrading the transmission cost a lot of PI points, and those PI points are usually better spent on power or handling parts. That said, ALWAYS check the PI cost for transmission upgrades. On some cars, there is little to no PI cost to install the Sport and/or race transmission (on some there is a PI gain going to Sport). On older cars, installing the Street transmission parts is HIGHLY recommended because it usually unlocks quite a bit of top end and an extra gear or two. I will spend PI on the transmission (if I am upgrading it) BEFORE installing engine parts.
  11. Cam Shaft: This is the best way to add top end to a car. Some like to use forced induction first. I prefer to cam it first and blow it second!
  12. Engine Parts Round 1: Ignition, Fuel System (but not race carb), Cams, Displacement + Street Air filter & Sport Intake (all parts that do not impact vehicle weight to maximize power)
  13. Engine Parts Round 2: Valves, Pistons, & forced induction (if needed)
  14. Engine Parts Round 3: Forces Induction upgrades, remaining Intake & Air Filter parts, Exhaust System.
  15. Clutch: Since I do not use Manual w/ Clutch (I find it cumbersome and annoying personally), there are time I want faster shifts with Manual. upgrading the clutch is a lower PI cost option to get those faster shifts, but I still have to be careful not to spend too much PI here.
  16. Fine Adjustments: Finish off PI with fine parts adjustments (usually in drive shaft, Rims and roll cage)
  17. Race Aero and Other Cosmetic Parts: This might be last on the list, but there is a reason for this. When I start a build I usually end up with two versions to test. One with Race Aero and one without. I'm always surprised by the results! I HIGHLY recommend doing some testing with and without aero bits and see which one actually works better.

Tuning

Once you have your car build to class in Forza, you are going to need to tune it. Tuning works the same in FH2 as it does in FM5 (except for off-road tuning which I Will cover in another post). You want to focus on a getting a good base tune (see the tools below) and then fine tune from there. I have several tricks and setting I use based on my experiences tuning, so I can get my base tune and fine tunes pretty close without ever needing to test drive. That said, I still test drive EVERY tune. The time I don't test drive, is the time I have a bad tune. There is always something left to adjust or a lot of times something I just totally forgot to set! Spend the time testing and adjusting your tune (in the testing session). It will pay off!

In-Game Descriptions

Believe it or not, but the descriptions for each tuning category in FM6 do a pretty good job off explaining what adjusting each item "should" do to the car. I highly recommend reading them very carefully the next time you are fine tuning a car.

Rapid-Racer Tuning Principles

http://www.rapid-racer.com/suspension-tuning.php
This is one of the best tuning guides I've read, and it's a great starting point for understanding the different aspects of tuning. It's not specific to Forza, but it really explains each of the tuning areas.

U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator

http://bg55.com/u2scforzatuner.php
This is our web-based Forza tuning calculator (FM5/FH2/FM6). It provides one of the best base tunes you can get out of a calculator. As with all calculators, there will be more fine tuning needed for some cars than others. We are continuously developing this, and I recommend using the Beta version (unless it's broken ;-) ).

ForzaTune5 (FT5) & ForzaTune6 (FT6)

http://forzatune.com/
Available for iOS and Android devices and they provide a good base tune BASE tune for suspension, alignment and gearbox. Not a bad option if you don't want to mess with the U2SC Turner on a mobile device.

Testing & Fine-Tuning

With several options available to generate decent base tunes for cars, fine tuning is where good cars become GREAT! Anyone can generate a tune from a calculator, but that's not going to make the best that build can be. That's where testing and fine-tuning come in.

Testing

I use three main tracks to test my builds. Which track I use depends on what type of build it is. Once a track or tracks are chosen, go to the Time Attack rivals leaderboards for the different classes and write down the leaderboard time for the best car that is not a leaderboard car (i.e. not the Alpha 33, BAC Mono, X-Boz or any other dominant LB car). This will provide a benchmark for how well the build/tune is doing on said track. I will actually go down in the 100-200 ranks to find a time. While I'm probably not going to bust into the top 500 in most tracks, I do have my moments! ;-)
  • For builds that center around Grip and/or momentum, I usually use Brands Hatch. It has some of the most difficult corners and transitions in the game and is a great judge of a grip build's tune ability to maintain speed and change direction. A few other good Grip tracks are Sonoma and Spa (if you need some speed with your grip).
  • For Power or Speed builds, I usually test at Monza or Daytona 24-hour. Those are two really good power tracks, and they will also test handling at different speeds. Although these are power/speed builds, they still need to handle well enough. Too little handling and the lap times will begin to suffer. Power is no good if it cannot be used ;-)
  • For All-Around builds, I love running COTA. Why? Because I love COTA and it's a challenging track with every type of corner and some of the most vicious rumble strips & curbs in the game. I'll also use Silverstone and Indy GP
What I like to do is...
  • Build the car, then load up all of the critical data points into the U2SC Forza Tuner, but I don't calculate the tune.
  • I then go into Testing (hitting Y in the upgrade interface) and immediately pause and tune setup. If I'm tuning the gearbox too, I will bring up telemetry to record the redline RPM and do a high gear pull down the straight to see where peak torque and power hit (I really do this every time). On some cars power peaks VERY early, and I may adjust what I enter for redline RPM as a result (the rally engine swap is a good example of this).
  • I will then finish entering all of the data into the U2SC FTC, calculate and apply the base tune.
  • Now it's time for a test and I run one full lap, then bring up telemetry to check tire pressure (while on a straight to make sure the temps are within +/- 0.5 PSI of 32PSI).
  • If it felt like the car was bottoming out, I will switch to the suspension (springs) screen and watch what happens when cornering, braking, acceleration and combinations of the three. If the suspension is bottoming out, I will race the ride eight by .2 in the front and rear w/o recalculating the tune. Then test again. Repeat... You can also add spring rate if need be (use the % adjuster in the U2SC FTC).
  • The last thing I do is test the brakes. I love my brake pressure between 130% and 150% depending on the car and tires, but balance is key. I run down a straight in chase view looking at the side of the car and slowly squeeze the brakes until they lock up. What I am looking for is for the fronts and rears to lock up together or the front just a hair before the rear. Too much front brake will cause excessive locking and too much rear brake will case excessive locking and stability when turning and braking together.
Cheers!
justLou72 (a.k.a. BiggLou55)
---| U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator | Twitch | YouTube | Twitter | XBox Live |---
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Maxximilllion
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January 22nd, 2015, 11:36 am #2

Great stuff Lou, thanks!


When tuning, aside from aero adjustments, where is the best place to start when trying to reel in a car with oversteer?
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justLou72
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January 22nd, 2015, 2:19 pm #3

Maxximilllion wrote:Great stuff Lou, thanks!


When tuning, aside from aero adjustments, where is the best place to start when trying to reel in a car with oversteer?
It all depends on what kind of oversteer. Just remember that most suspension tuning is connected. If you reduce one thing, you will have to increase something else. Also, all of this assumes that you have a good base tune on the car (not the default tune from FM5/FH2 which is VERY stiff and not well balanced). Non environmental oversteer (not weather or surface related) can be triggered in two ways. By throttle (on or off) and by balance/alignment.

Throttle Oversteer

On Throttle Oversteer (the car oversteers more than it should coming out of a corner): Start with the Differential's Acceleration setting. I usually set this rather low in FM5/FH2, especially for more powerful RWD cars. For a car with over 400 torque, I will usually have the acceleration setting around 30. As a rule of thumb I set my deceleration to at least 6 points below my acceleration setting. (Warning: If you go too low with the acceleration setting, you will have an open diff issue coming out of corners.) If you are still having throttle oversteer problems, then look at your suspension. If weight is not transferring to the rear of the car under acceleration, then try lowering the rear spring rate (you will also need to increase the rear ARB stiffness as a result - one tenth for every 10 to 20 lbs/in of spring rate.) If weight is transferring to the rear, then leave the spring rate alone and stiffen the rear ARB and lighten the front ARB by the same amount.

Throttle Lift Oversteer (the car oversteers when you lift the throttle while turning): Again start with the differential, and make sure your deceleration setting is not too high. I never have it set above 30 on a circuit car (offroad tuning is different). Next check your spring rate in the front. if it's too low, too much weight will transfer forward and the rear will lose traction. Next look at the ride height. If too high, weight transfer will be an issue, especially in lighter cars like the atom and caterham.

Car Balance and Alignment

Roll Stiffness: Next take a look at the rear ARB. If it's too stiff, the weight might not be transitioning properly to the rear or from side to side. Lighten the rear ARB and stiffen the front by the same amount.

Spring Rate and Dampening: For RWD cars, you want your rear springs to be lower than your front springs. this will allow the car to "squat" and shift weight to the rear on acceleration. Too much squat and the rear will bottom out and become unstable. You will also have to tune out deceleration "dive" by stiffening the front

For FWD cars, you want the rear of the car to be stiffer and the "rake" of the car to transition weight to the front. Adjust the rake by increasing the rear ride eight and/or lowering the front. If you go too far, the car will become unbalanced.

Alignment: Check the rear toe. too much negative toe in the rear might cause the car to oversteer. Incrementally reduce rear negative toe to see if it helps. It's usually not a good idea to go positive on rear toe. Check your camber as well.
Cheers!
justLou72 (a.k.a. BiggLou55)
---| U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator | Twitch | YouTube | Twitter | XBox Live |---
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F2_cali
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January 22nd, 2015, 9:20 pm #4

I'm still really trying to learn the tuning aspect... I understand the basics of what does what (for the most part) but, how do you know when to stop tuning somewhere and start looking elsewhere? For instance, say I'm having a lot of oversteer... I can correct all sorts of things for this (Tire pressure, suspension, differential, etc.) say I start suspension and got it adjusted a fair amount... At what point do I move on from the suspension to start looking at tire pressure, differential, etc.?


Hope that makes sense! Thanks for doing this for us Lou!
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justLou72
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January 22nd, 2015, 10:27 pm #5

F2_cali wrote:I'm still really trying to learn the tuning aspect... I understand the basics of what does what (for the most part) but, how do you know when to stop tuning somewhere and start looking elsewhere? For instance, say I'm having a lot of oversteer... I can correct all sorts of things for this (Tire pressure, suspension, differential, etc.) say I start suspension and got it adjusted a fair amount... At what point do I move on from the suspension to start looking at tire pressure, differential, etc.?


Hope that makes sense! Thanks for doing this for us Lou!
My pleasure Cali...

Knowing where when to stop is really knowing where to start, as well as when what your are tweaking isn't helping. This is why I use ForzaTune 5 to apply a quick base tune (much quicker than I can do manually). Using the app, I know the spring rates, dampening rates (bump/rebound) and ARB settings are balanced with the actual weight of the car and the weight distribution (weight % front and rear). Having neutral balance is an important starting point. Check out this post for more info: post15.html#p15

Do I tune without using an app? Absolutly, and Some of my best tunes are 100% tuned by me. Using apps like ForzaTune 5 and Slave Monkey's FMTC (excel spread sheets) actually helped me become a better tuner. It just takes time to learn where and when to move on. Things like Aero and Spring rates are things I go to as a last resort.

Let me go into more detail

(sorry ahead of time for the ramblings)

With oversteer, I start with the Differential, which usually helps TREMENDOUSLY for Throttle oversteer (both on throttle and lift). A lot of times on more powerful cars (heavy torque), there is no way to eliminate all of the on-throttle oversteer, so you just have to use your personal traction control (your right foot).

If it's lift oversteer (like the Atom and Caterham have), dropping the ride height, stiffening the front, loosening the rear and playing with dampening is needed (they are VERY difficult cars to tune in FM5). Some of the lighter weight cars rear ends will slowly "drift" out when cornering (especially long sweepers) requiring corrective measures by the driver. This is due loss of rear grip and is more pronounced when less than full throttle is applied. Adding stiffness to the front end is a good place to start followed by loosening up the rear (start with ARB, then dampening, springs last). Applying rear aero will solve the problem a lot of the times too.

Solving these issues for RWD, FWD and AWD cars is different too.

For RWD cars, lowering the rear and raising the front ride height slightly will rake the car more to the rear making the front to rear weight transition faster and slowing down the rear to front. This can help to cure lift oversteer and on throttle oversteer.

For FWD cars, you want to keep the weight to the front while accelerating and braking but allow some weight to transfer rearward while cornering. This can be done Stiffening the rear ARB, adding a little more rear spring and rebound, but dropping the rear bump. Bump dampens the springs when compressing, and a lower bump will allow the spring to compress faster. Having a stiffer ARB and a lower bump means that the springs can compress faster, but it will be more uniform (across both sides).

For AWD cars, it really depends on how your center differential is setup and if there is a lot of understeer. For AWD cars that have a lot of power directed rearward, you'll want to treat it more like a RWD car when tuning. I usually find that 60% to 75% power to the rear works the best for AWD cars. there are exceptions though.

The Interconnection

Tuning suspension tuning is difficult because it's an interconnected network. If you change one thing, it effects another. For example: when you stiffen the front ARB lateral forces are not eliminated, they are redirected. Excessive Body roll (the manifestation of lateral forces without adequate ARBs) is really just the redirection of lateral forces (lateral G's) down to the tire and road, so as you eliminate roll, you do no eliminate later force. You still have to transfer that force to tire and road. By reducing roll, you distribute that force to all four corners, but you will never be able to eliminate roll completely. As you reduce roll by increasing ARB stiffness, you will also be able to reduce the spring rate because you are not transferring as much weight down.

Dampening (Bump and Rebound):

Bump is the the dampening of the spring while under compression. The higher the bump, the slower the spring will compress.

Rebound is the dampening of the spring while returning from compression. The higher the rebound, the slower the spring will return

There is a lot of energy stored in a spring. Without dampening the car would simply bounce around and be completely uncontrollable (try it some time - reduce bump and rebound to the minimum settings and go for a drive). Bump and rebound dampen the forces applied to the spring. Rebound should ALWAYS be higher than bump. If bump is set higher than rebound, the car will bounce.

Bottom line is sticking to the tried and true method. Tune, test, save, tweak, test, save (new)... and so one until you find the right balance or realize you are barking up the wrong tree. There is also a state of mind. Once I got over the whole "it has to be perfect" idea, I started turning out much better tunes. Before I accepted that, I would see the same car I was tuning in the top 100 of the leaderboards and wonder what the hell I was doing wrong. Once I realized that LB tunes are actually shitty tunes build for twitch gamers using shortcuts and completely unrealistic driving methods (more stunt driving than racing - you should try them sometime, they are horrible and you have to drive totally different - power over grip most of the time), I was able to be comfortable with a top 1% to top 5% time. Spending hours on one tune ended in frustration more than it ended in pleasure. I'd rather have 100 nicely tuned cars in my garage as opposed to 10 near perfectly tuned cars.
Cheers!
justLou72 (a.k.a. BiggLou55)
---| U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator | Twitch | YouTube | Twitter | XBox Live |---
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F2_cali
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January 23rd, 2015, 5:35 am #6

That actually helps a ton! Thank you so much! I know what my problem is just based off that response... I'm not knowing when to move on because I'm doing what you did when you first started tuning as well... I'm trying to perfect 1 thing... I'll spend time fixing springs, then I'll touch ARB's and then I go back to springs because they didn't feel perfect... Obviously a beginners mistake on my part! I did purchase the app you mentioned a few weeks ago and it truly is a wonderful helper! At least now I know not to keep going in circles on these tunes!


Thanks again for taking the time to do this! I've already learned a lot from the first few posts.
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Maxximilllion
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January 23rd, 2015, 12:10 pm #7

F2_cali wrote:That actually helps a ton! Thank you so much!
Thanks again for taking the time to do this! I've already learned a lot from the first few posts.

Thanks Lou!
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justLou72
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January 23rd, 2015, 10:51 pm #8

You are welcome!

This has also motivated me to finish my tuning calculator. I'm hoping to have it done this weekend. It will look very basic, but it should spit out pretty good tunes! I also put together a nice little flow and some formulas prepping for completing my tuner. It might help you to understand tuning a bit more. Please note that the final Lou-ne-tuner will contain a modified version of the Xtreme Skills forumla. I still have to finalize some things, but when I do, I will update the flow chart below!

IMAGE REMOVED - Head on over to the new and imporved U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator!!! http://www.bg55.com/u2scforzatuner.php
Cheers!
justLou72 (a.k.a. BiggLou55)
---| U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator | Twitch | YouTube | Twitter | XBox Live |---
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justLou72
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July 29th, 2015, 10:26 pm #9

OP updated today.
Cheers!
justLou72 (a.k.a. BiggLou55)
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justLou72
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February 29th, 2016, 10:26 pm #10

I spent some time and updated the OP with more current information. Please let me know if you have any new questions or comments, and remember, there are no stupid questions. ;-)
Cheers!
justLou72 (a.k.a. BiggLou55)
---| U2SC Forza Tuning Calculator | Twitch | YouTube | Twitter | XBox Live |---
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