Powder torch . . . . .

Discussion about anything related to Mig, Stick, and/or Tig welding.

Powder torch . . . . .

Markopolo
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Markopolo
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07 Aug 2005, 21:55 #1

OK guys, edjukate me.......

I think I want one of these "powder torches".....

http://www.ramweldingsupply.com/product ... mcic?s=897

TELL ME ABOUT THEM.

Thanks, Marko.
"Any day above ground is a good one !"
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john pen
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08 Aug 2005, 02:19 #2

Marco, check the link, it went to a login window
Im just here for the beer and chips..

Is it beer oclock yet ?

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Arbo
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08 Aug 2005, 03:25 #3

I assume this is some sort of "build-up" type welding. What would it be used for?
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Franz©
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Franz©
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08 Aug 2005, 04:10 #4

Aw cripes Marko, save me about a million characters of typin and tell me what you think you can use a powder torch for.
They are a fairly specialized tool that unless you have work for them every day spend 99% of their life sitting in a box, and when the job finally comes along, you forgot you owned the dam thing and do the buildup another way.
Should I also mention it's a long learning curve, and unless you do buildups fairly regularly, you'll need to relearn the technique?
BTW, powdered metal torches were the second product I know of that was called Spray Welding.

This link may work
http://www.ramweldingsupply.com/product ... mcic?s=897
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moody
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08 Aug 2005, 05:33 #5

john pen @ Aug 8 2005, 02:19 AM wrote: Marco, check the link, it went to a login window
you dont have to sign in, theres a way around it

i think i just pushed sign in
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Wyoming
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08 Aug 2005, 05:41 #6

Franz or Marko,
What is this animal...a way to do case hardening with a torch in a bit simpler manner or is there another use?
Location: Gillette, WY
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Franz©
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08 Aug 2005, 06:15 #7

The short answer is NO.
Case hardening is done by heating steel in cyonide, or dipping the red hot steel into cyonide. I haven't done it in a number of years, partly because playing with cyonide doesn't appeal to fulfilling my wellness potential.

These torches are designed to deposit a thin layer of molten powdered metal onto a piece of metal that has been brought to welding temperature. One of the funniest things I ever saw was when somebody tried to build up a galled bearing surface of an electric motor shaft. The HAZ took care of any further repair potential.
You can also deposit a layer of hard surface a few thousanths thick, but you often get into warpage problems because of the amount of heat you pump into the piece.
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Wyoming
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08 Aug 2005, 06:24 #8

Franz,

The short answer works well for me here, but how about another quick and dirty one to tell me what the use or benefit from this torch is. If it isn't for case hardening or hard surfacing I'm totally clueless as to what the benefit would be.
Location: Gillette, WY
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Mountain Mike^^
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08 Aug 2005, 06:50 #9

Looks like all the cauldren of misfits are in this post................ :lol:

I've done a bit of powder spraying. Albeit, 30 some years ago. Franz is right, to a degree, you heat up the metal, and your torch acts kinda like a spray paint gun.

What you can spray, and what you can achieve, is the question, right?

From what I remember, I sprayed a case hardening compound on to an annealed crankshaft that had been turned (machined) undersize due to wear of the main and rod bearings. This was done to true up the out of round specs of the journals. Naturally, in my other life, I would have done whatever to make the engine "cherry." I think it was a 265 ci, Chevy in a 1956 Bel Aire body. The idea was to make the crank standard, and avoid use of undersize bearings, plus adding the case hardening of the original configuration. (if there was one). Some cranks are forged, some are cast and turned.
The forged were said to be the best............(for racing)

After spraying, the journals were honed to spec and smoothed with (no Cummer, 400 grit wet/dry). The oil holes were champhered with a hand drill and a fine coning stone. All finished by hand. And the result?

Franz knows, and I'll wait for him...........

:P


Mikey
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Franz©
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08 Aug 2005, 06:57 #10

Roy mine has been on loan in my buddy's shop for over 10 years, which sorta shows how beneficial owning the damn thing is to me.
Ideally, you can use it to build up, layer by layer and get a smoother deposit than you can get with stick or MIG, therefore less machining.
In my opinion, they are long on promise and short on delivery, other than possibly in a production situation.
As I recall, when I bought mine, it came with a supply of powsers including steel, hard surface, brass, zink and some convolution called aluminizing. If I recall correctly, it operates well in a flat position, and only so so verticle. Also, there is a problem with the powder caking from moisture in the air.
It might be good for hard surfacing small parts that you didn't want to TIG some Stoody wire onto. Frankly I don't ever recall being real impressed with it after I got it. In my opinion, the torch just puts too much heat into most weldments and the same task can be performed a lot easier other ways.
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Wyoming
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08 Aug 2005, 07:10 #11

Franzie,

Thanks for a bit longer answer...I had thought that the work performed by this torch was in the high button shoe range due to hard surface rod and wire, but it isn't anything I've done...so what do I know. Did a small bit of cyanide work back in high school, but it was only to learn how to do it. I think that even back then the days were numbered for gas hard surfacing on anything in the general fold. Truth be told, even back than using a gas welder for a job was not most peoples first choice.

Marko,

Did you have a specific use for this torch? I know from reading that you enjoy torch work...so is this just an extension of that or do you have a job that calls for this torch work?
Location: Gillette, WY
Show me those pictures now!!!!
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Markopolo
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08 Aug 2005, 23:08 #12

Well since you ask Wy......I DID have a little job that I needed to do some "build-up" on....not much mind you, maybe .040" or so.

I just thought this contraption would do a nicer job than laying bead and grinding. :huh:
"Any day above ground is a good one !"
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Markopolo
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08 Aug 2005, 23:12 #13

P.S........I finally just used the Heliarc to float some thin bead on the part, then finish ground.....It worked.......

But I thought this (powder torch) may be something useful to have around.
"Any day above ground is a good one !"
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Franz©
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09 Aug 2005, 02:10 #14

Markopolo @ Aug 8 2005, 06:12 PM wrote: P.S........I finally just used the Heliarc to float some thin bead on the part, then finish ground.....It worked.......

But I thought this (powder torch) may be something useful to have around.
Yup, sure is useful to have around. After you get thoroughly frustrated withthe damn thing, you box it up and put it on a shelf to be around. Then, if you get lucky, somebody with a higher desire for frustration comes along and borrows it, and 10 years later, you still remember youown it and who borrowed it.
They might be good in a production situation, but they ain't for shyt in a one off.
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Markopolo
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09 Aug 2005, 02:23 #15

OK Uncle Franz........I'll consider this thread "Answered" !

Guess I don't need one that bad after all........... :(

(although I DID read somewhere, that they are GREAT for cast-iron repair).......... :huh:
"Any day above ground is a good one !"
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