A question of barrels...

A question of barrels...

Doc Nickel
Doc Nickel

September 27th, 2011, 8:48 pm #1

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
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Tom Sparkman
Tom Sparkman

September 27th, 2011, 9:21 pm #2

The people in my group that have high-end (read high cost) guns usually use the stock barrel. I like the barrels on my Egos and I usually don't need to change the backs. My pumps all have aftermarket barrels and I can tell the difference (probably because they limit rollouts). I even found the barrel kit for my Sterling on Ebay - I think they only made it for a few months. The .68 Special has the stock barrel and the Prolite has a long SS barrel. My old Mag has 3 aftermarket and the stock Crownpoint - I haven't played with it in a long time but I take it out now and then and make sure it purrs. The PTX is ridiculous at .70 or more, but I don't think there are any small bore ones available.

So did everyone have to buy an aftermarket barrel because the stock barrels were crap or was it all marketing (and ignorance)? I'd say it was both (yeah, weasel out, Tom). On my older guns I could tell the difference between a stock and aftermarket, but there was SP's "water balloon" claims.

Of mine, I'd say 75% have aftermarket, but that's only because I have bunch of old guns. It would be higher but I've sold off a lot in the last year.

Tom
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sniper1rfa
sniper1rfa

September 27th, 2011, 9:23 pm #3

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
All my open bolt guns use the stocker (or whatever tube was available or looked nice). If the stocker is unusually tiny bore I would switch it to something with a very large bore.

All my closed bolt guns use freak inserts, for no other reason than to match paint sizes to prevent rollouts.
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Silcas
Silcas

September 27th, 2011, 11:20 pm #4

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
I've noticed that my Tippmann's seem to do a bit better with aftermarket barrels, and I've thought about getting a barrel kit for the '09 PMR too just to see if it'll improve the accuracy a tad. But the two Phantoms I'm running both shoot beautifully with the stock barrel, as well as the TM-7. I would like to put an Apex-2 on the TM-7 for giggles though.
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ta2maki
ta2maki

September 27th, 2011, 11:52 pm #5

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
I run aftermarket barrels on most of my guns mainly due to length. I have a hard time aiming and longer barrels help me shoot more accurately. Each gun has it's 'beauty' barrel. One that matches the gun. But for playing, I have 4 barrel 'kits' which cover most of what I shoot.

My group, which are primarily pumpers, run mostly aftermarket barrel kits to deal with the problem of rollouts.
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Jim
Jim

September 28th, 2011, 12:41 am #6

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
I use stock on my phantom when I play stock class
I think I have a stock barrel for one of my 2 loaner spiders so 1 stock 1 not (never got into tippys)
The only other stock barrel I can think that I've ever used (since my original spider) was the splashed mag that I had a matching barrel for, I've got a few barrel sets (freak and J&J) and most my mags have AC barrel threads (ULE bodies), and everything else is pump converted AC's so they get the barrel kits too.

the group I play with only about 10% use stock barrels but I think thats due to the fact that most of us got our main playing guns about 10-12 years ago when not using stock barrels was big.

but most of the rest of the crowd uses stock (both tourney and recballers) I'd say percentage wise its anywhere from 80-90% stock.

Central FL
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jwigum
jwigum

September 28th, 2011, 12:44 am #7

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
Then again, the only markers I have with removable barrels right now are pumps.

My typhoon has a double ported barrel, but not for accuracy.
I use barrels with porting because I think they're quieter, and removable barrels to size(limiting roll outs on closed bolt guns).

I've come to the conclusion accuracy is dependent on a combination of the marker and paint consistency(read: same energy/distance each time from the marker, and no paint oddities causing a weird flight path).
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Tohri
Tohri

September 28th, 2011, 1:25 am #8

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
I only use high dollar, brand name aftermarket performance barrels made at least ten years ago.

Aftermarket barrel quality has plummeted in recent years, as evidenced by the minimal improvements to range, accuracy, consistency, efficiency and potency that a modern aftermarket barrel brings to the table compared to a modern stock barrel.
Compare that figure to the marked superiority of a late 1990's Boomstick or All American to a stock barrel of the day, and it's plain as day; Barrel Making is a lost art.

Today's barrel has porting that imparts no spin, an anodized coating that rarely bears any traces of teflon or other such materials, and I dare you point out any Modern barrels made with Stiff Arbor Honing, or from Titanium. It does nothing for the range of the gun, nor for it's accuracy.

The barrel of Today is rubbish, a mere polished tube with holes that do not more than slightly muffle the fired shot. The barrels of Yesteryear were technological marvels, ripe and full with Rifling (Straight and spiral in near equal measure) Teardrop porting, non-linear axes (Oh the venerable Flatline) and even Asymmetrical ports!

Truly, these were the tools of titans, forged by our captains of industry, in a bygone, Golden age.
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Pneuman
Pneuman

September 28th, 2011, 4:05 am #9

lmffao!!!
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dr. j.
dr. j.

September 28th, 2011, 4:22 am #10

Going with the post about an "upgraded" SL-68II below, one of the things I was thinking about, to 'explain' why Tippmann didn't upgrade the gun to a modern barrel thread (as opposed to the SL-only slip-in style) is just how many people actually swap barrels in the first place?

Yes, I know that the aftermarket barrel biz is huge. I have several hundred barrels myself, and I've made or modded thousands more.

But, I also note that a fair number of players, both rec and tourney, run the stock barrel.

Locally, the Model 98 and A5 are still the main toy of choice, and I'd guess that only maybe a third of players are using anything but the stock barrel. Even of the local tourney guys (and girls) I'd guess about half stick with the factory barrel- especially if it's color-matched to the gun:







As far as my SL goes- the one I modded to stock class over 15 years ago- the stock barrel was actually pretty accurate. I eventually cut down an old DYE stainless Automag barrel to fit it, and I remember being disappointed that it really didn't improve anything. The gun shot about the same with either one.

So I guess as a quick out-of-curiosity question, what do you think is the percentage of stock vs. aftermarket barrel users in your local group? Is it different for the tourney and rec guys?

And, what's your own percentage? As in, if you own two guns, do you have aftermarket barrels for both of them? Do you have five guns but only one barrel kit that fits all five? Do you have just the one gun and find the stock barrel shoots just fine?

Doc.
I run barrel kits on everything. It seems to me that a LOT of paint that I buy at fields fits best with my .683 back on the pipe kit, which is the smallest. Heck, sometimes even that seems to big!! I also have a freak kit and i find myself most commonly using the .679 and .682 inserts.

whether or not bore matching actually helps my accuracy/consistency, I couldn't tell you, as i've never done any sort of scientific test as such.

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^^this is me running a triple-ion ( "trion" ) that I built. You'll notice that two of the three sub-guns have pipe kits and one has a freak. That's how anal I am about bore matching
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