Artillery of Persia?

Artillery of Persia?

Joined: July 29th, 2006, 11:24 am

August 26th, 2006, 12:49 pm #1

There is one more country about which army it is very poorly known. It is army of Persia. Here at a forum already there was an information about Persian tanks and armored cars. The information about aircraft too can be found.
But, I can not find the information on artillery of Persia at all.
I know, that on arms were available:
75mm mountain guns Bofors mod.30 - 120
105mm guns Bofors mod.27-????
75mm AA guns Bofors mod.30/37 - 20??
75mm mountain guns Skoda mod.39-
37mm ATG Skoda
?????
I know that in Czechoslovakia 350 guns have been bought.

There can be somebody has the information what types of guns and mortars were used in the Persian army in WW2

Best regards
Cyril

Last edited by nuyt on August 26th, 2006, 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: July 20th, 2004, 4:40 pm

August 26th, 2006, 1:38 pm #2

Can be found here:
http://www.network54.com/Forum/330333/t ... 111927699/

One request to all posters: please refer to "Persia" in this case.
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Cyril
Cyril

August 26th, 2006, 4:47 pm #3

I read, certainly about Persian armour.
In the very first photo from a museum, too it seemed to me, that behind in the distance to the left a Bofors 75mm mountain gun.
In the center undoubtedly 37mm ATG Skoda mod.34 (3.7 cm ÚV vz. 34). On it a photo I could not define the third gun precisely yet. It is possible to tell precisely that it is a gun in calibre from 47 up to 65 mm, created approximately from 1890 till 1910, most likely firms Skoda or Krupp

Regards
Cyril
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Susan Cross
Susan Cross

August 27th, 2006, 2:39 am #4

Dear Cyril

According to the article on the Persian Army, 1941, at orbat.comm, there were (assuming batteries of 4)

12 batteries 100mm Skoda M14 (=48 howitzers)
18 batteries 100mm Skoda M30 (=72 howitzers)
39 batteries 75mm Bofors M1934 mountain (so more than the first batch of 120 delivered)

6 1/2 batteries 75mm Scheider M1909 mountain (=26)
4 batteries Schneider 75mm M1909 mountain (=16)
2 batteries 75mm Russian Aboukoff (=8)
1 battery unknown British gun (18 pdr?) (=4)

11 1/2 batteries 75mm M1929 AA(several more guns not delivered after 1939)(towed by Marmon Herrington tractors)

also Skoda 105mm M35 towed by Praga tractors for coast defense on the Caspian (another source says "several" batteries which I interpret as at least three)

Somewhere I have figures for the number of Skoda 37mm AT delivered, but I will have to dig them out.

Hope this helps

Susan
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Cyril
Cyril

August 27th, 2006, 6:38 am #5

Dear Susan

I with pleasure would look that is written to the article on the Persian Army, 1941, at orbat.com, but I can not open http://orbat.com/site/data/iran/persia41.html

Thanks for the help

Best regards
Cyril
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Susan Cross
Susan Cross

August 27th, 2006, 7:09 am #6

I couldn't open it either, so I contacted the webmaster, Mr. Rikhye, and he sent me the file. I don't want to send the whole thing, as it is proprietary, but if you ask him he might send it to you. I summarized what it said about the Persian Mechanized Brigade elsewhere on this site, I can't remember the exact date.
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Susan Cross
Susan Cross

August 27th, 2006, 8:49 am #7

Dear Susan

I with pleasure would look that is written to the article on the Persian Army, 1941, at orbat.com, but I can not open http://orbat.com/site/data/iran/persia41.html

Thanks for the help

Best regards
Cyril
I had forgotten that I sent a letter to Mr. Rikhye; here is what I said about the Persian Army

I have obtained a copy of Richard A. Stewart's Sunrise at Abadan: the British and Soviet Invasion of Iran, 1941 (Praeger, 1988). It has information on the Persian Army on Aug 25, 1941 as follows:

1. Guards Infantry Div (Teheran, Baghe Shah Barracks) B/G Karim Aga Buzarjehehri
2. Guards Infantry Div (Teheran) M/G Naghdi
3. Infantry Div (Tabriz) Gen Matbooi (had 8500 men incl an engineer bn)
4. Infantry Div (Rezeiyeh) M/G Ali Moini
5. Infantry Div (Kurdistan) M/G Hassan Moggadam
6.Infantry Div (Ahvaz) cdr? (Khorramshar, Abadan, Khuzistan, Bandur-i-Shahpur) included 1000 sailors at Khorramshar under Adm. Bayandor, a brigade of the 6. Div incl 45. Infantry Rgt, elms. of 1,2,30 Infantry Regiments, 8 medium tanks, 8 light tanks, 10 armored cars

9. Infantry Div (Meshed)cdr? two infantry, two cavalry rgt (Meshed), one cavalry regiment (Bojnora), 28. Infantry Rgt (Torbat), three batteries each of 75mm and 105mm howitzers

10. Infantry Div (Gorgan) Col. Mutazedi (acting)
11. Infantry Div (Rasht) cdr? (included 36. Infantry Rgt under L/C Iranpur)
12. Infantry Div( Kermanshah) B/G Puria
15. Infantry Div (Ardabil) Gen Gaderi (included two infantry regt incl 11., had 20 light and 15 heavy trucks)
17. Infantry Div (Khvoy) cdr?

Non-divisional units included the Mechanized Brigade (Teheran)

Regiments included in the above divisions were the 1. Pahlavi, 2., 11., 17., 28., 30., 36., 39., 43., and 45.

The only cavalry regiment identified by number was the 23., at Gonbad-i-Kavuz under Col. Hanjanus

It looks like a safe bet all the infantry and cavalry regiments were numbered consecutively, 1-45 and 1-25

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Susan Cross
Susan Cross

August 28th, 2006, 4:20 am #8

I read, certainly about Persian armour.
In the very first photo from a museum, too it seemed to me, that behind in the distance to the left a Bofors 75mm mountain gun.
In the center undoubtedly 37mm ATG Skoda mod.34 (3.7 cm ÚV vz. 34). On it a photo I could not define the third gun precisely yet. It is possible to tell precisely that it is a gun in calibre from 47 up to 65 mm, created approximately from 1890 till 1910, most likely firms Skoda or Krupp

Regards
Cyril
I have checked my notes, and what I have is that a Persian Army infantry regiment had 6 x 81mm mortars and 6 x 37mm Skoda AT--this would require a minimum of 270 mortars and 270 AT guns to fully equip the army's forty-five infantry regiments. The actual number was bound to be less because the army was caught in the middle of an expansion program in 1939.

I also found a note that the 105mm coastal guns were to be in two groups "roving" the Caspian coastline, so this could mean two, four or more batteries.

The number of undelivered Bofors 75mm AA guns was at least twenty--that's how many ex-Persian guns the Swedish Army took over in 1939.
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Cyril
Cyril

August 28th, 2006, 9:23 am #9

Thanks Susan!
You again have helped me. I hope I can sometime help you too.

Ïî ïîâîäó øâåäñêèõ ïóøåê, íà ñàéòå
http://www.mtek.chalmers.se/~m95perm/va ... ex.en.html
íàïèñàíî ñëåäóþùåå:
"There is a 7,5 cm lvkan m/30-37, which roughly speaking is a m/30 gun mounted on a m/37 carriage. The m/30-37s had been ordered by Persia (Iran), but were confiscated by the Swedish government in late 1939."

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Joined: July 30th, 2008, 9:40 am

August 1st, 2008, 12:59 pm #10

There is one more country about which army it is very poorly known. It is army of Persia. Here at a forum already there was an information about Persian tanks and armored cars. The information about aircraft too can be found.
But, I can not find the information on artillery of Persia at all.
I know, that on arms were available:
75mm mountain guns Bofors mod.30 - 120
105mm guns Bofors mod.27-????
75mm AA guns Bofors mod.30/37 - 20??
75mm mountain guns Skoda mod.39-
37mm ATG Skoda
?????
I know that in Czechoslovakia 350 guns have been bought.

There can be somebody has the information what types of guns and mortars were used in the Persian army in WW2

Best regards
Cyril
In Tehran military museum one can see these artillery pieces:

In the middle I can ID a Bofors 75mm Mountain gun without shield.


To the left a smaller calibre AA gun (possibly Naval?). What model/manufacturer is this? Has anyone data, drawings or other photos of this type?


In the background (plus a front photo with a water mine) an AA gun of larger calibre. I guess it's Bofors, but researching the various Bofors models, none resembled this version. Note that it has numerous "ribs" around the barrel. Again more information welcome. According to the sources Persia had various Bofors AA guns, with the latest 75mm M30/37 scheduled for 1941 never being delivered by Sweden.

More puzzling: what is this myterious object on the far right of the top picture? Is it an ammunition storage or some kind of launcher? Never seen anything like that.


Finally inside the museum is a model of a field gun with Limber. Looks like something from Krupp or again Bofors/Skoda? Anyone recognize it?



Cheers
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