Rapido EP-5 "Jet"

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John Sheridan
Member
Joined: 23 Feb 2009, 20:07

03 Oct 2017, 13:34 #11

Answers!

"Why have the GCT sound mode on the FL-9 for pickup shoes that don't drop."

Because the costs of having the shoes raise & lower would make the model more expensive than leaving them up? In order to do this, we would need to add hardware to pivot the shoes. This would make the shoes & the attach points way over scale as they need to be reasonably assembled by someone. 

"How many who will purchase the Jet are actually modeling overhead wire? "
" The pans may as well be modeled in the retracted position.  "

The pans need to be raised / lowered regardless of whether you have overhead wire or not.  Why ? Because it is far easier to make the pans go up & down than the 3rd rail shoes. 

"Many purchasers may not even have layouts?"

Who cares ? Not having a layout shouldn't hinder anyone from purchasing the model. 

"If potential damage while running it with extended shoes is the concern, the model could be offered with two different sets of pickup shoes to be installed by the owner, similar the 8600 passenger car stirrups."

This is flat out silly. You can't make a feature like this for "some" models & not others. I'll stand corrected - you could do this but it would raise the costs of both types for such a minor feature. 


"The pickup shoes are extended on every brass model of every electric model that had them because the shoes were a significant feature of electric motors."

Then buy the brass models. If you notice all the used brass models, a vast majority of them have the shoes bent upwards. Why ? because they snag on everything in the way. 

"I liked Bill's ruse that the shoes should be designed to change position with micro motors actuated from a DCC function key,  Now that would be cool!"

Again, can it be done ? Possibly. Would it raise the cost of the model significantly ? Absolutely. 

SO leeme ask the question: "How much are you willing to pay more for a model with this added feature ?"
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nhhe52
Member
Joined: 26 Mar 2004, 05:19

03 Oct 2017, 14:13 #12

John:

The EP-5 will be a great model regardless of the third rail shoe detail and I intend to purchase a few of them.

My point about many purchasers not having overhead wire or layouts at all is not to suggest they don't purchase the model but the exact opposite.  If they are going to only display the model they may want it displayed with the third rail shoes being a more significant detail.  This is done by many manufactures of both locomotives and freight cars that provide both functional couplers and non-functioning scale couplers for display. Accurail freight cars often come with three coupler versions.  The cost to Accurail must be insignificant or they wouldn't do it. The initial run of the BLI GG-1 came with functioning and scale non-functioning couplers.

At least the shoes were painted red on the FL-9 along with the beams.  You won't even know they are there in the up position and dark colored on the EP-5.

The added feature of providing two different pairs of plastic shoes that are attached by the purchaser for those that want them displayed down would cost next to nothing in the overall cost of the model.

I have many brass electric models with third rail shoes and of the ones I run none have bent shoes.  Providing proper track clearances is part of modeling.

How much time and money was spent developing the FL-9 GCT mode sound, that no one uses, or the separate GCT pantographs to be added by the purchaser?  How much extra did it cost to provide the 8600 coach stirrups to be added by the purchaser?  Obviously Rapido does things when it believes it prudent to add it separately post shipping and/or for the enjoyment of the modeler.

I wasn't suggesting the third rail shoes be operable by DCC control.  I was paraphrasing a joke (ruse) made by Bill Schneider in an email response.  But that would be cool!  :)

The third rail shoes are a significant visual detail that can be enjoyed in the down position.  If we are only getting them flat up against the beams, so be it.  It will just be a lost opportunity in my opinion.

Ed
Last edited by nhhe52 on 03 Oct 2017, 15:14, edited 2 times in total.
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nhhe52
Member
Joined: 26 Mar 2004, 05:19

03 Oct 2017, 14:47 #13

In the spirit of full disclosure, I purchased a pair of OMI FL-9's on eBay many years ago and upon opening the boxes I discovered that the previous owner had clipped off the third rail pickup shoes along one side of the each locomotive.  The "mutilated" pickup shoes were not apparent in the eBay posted images, (buyer beware).  The idiot apparently decided it was more cost effective to clip off the shoes of an expensive brass model rather than correct the obstruction on the layout that they were hitting against along one side of the track.  Amazing!

I contacted Brian Marsh at OMI who miraculously had two pairs of extra FL-9 pickup shoe beams in his parts bin and graciously sent them to me.

The third rail pickup shoes on all the other brass models I have are neither bent, mutilated or missing and I run a number of them and with added sound decoders.  I was sure to closely examine the posted dealer images of subsequent purchases and have never seen this again.  So, I find the comment that the vast majority of brass models have bent pickup shoes unfounded.  The majority of brass models are displayed.  Some never leave their boxes.

Ed
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Derek Thompson
Member
Joined: 13 Jun 2003, 20:27

03 Oct 2017, 16:25 #14

I never realized this until just now. The "Yellow Jet" would have been a natural for the East Wind consist. Yes, I know the EW cars were no longer in the yellow livery when the Jets were introduced, but just imagine if......

Derek Thompson
Toronto, Ontario

NHRHTA Member # 0668

 
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nhhe52
Member
Joined: 26 Mar 2004, 05:19

03 Oct 2017, 16:55 #15

Derek:

That is an intriguing "Not New Haven" concept.

Ed
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Statkowski
Member
Joined: 05 Mar 2003, 09:39

03 Oct 2017, 17:23 #16

The red noses and sides were bad enough when it came to weathering, road grime, car knockers pounding on the nose and the sun's ultraviolet radiation beating down on it.  I strongly suspect a yellow instead of red would have fared much, much worse.
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DBrion
Member
Joined: 21 Jun 2006, 05:52

03 Oct 2017, 22:31 #17

nhhe52 wrote: In the spirit of full disclosure, I purchased a pair of OMI FL-9's on eBay many years ago and upon opening the boxes I discovered that the previous owner had clipped off the third rail pickup shoes along one side of the each locomotive.  The "mutilated" pickup shoes were not apparent in the eBay posted images, (buyer beware).  The idiot apparently decided it was more cost effective to clip off the shoes of an expensive brass model rather than correct the obstruction on the layout that they were hitting against along one side of the track.  Amazing!

I contacted Brian Marsh at OMI who miraculously had two pairs of extra FL-9 pickup shoe beams in his parts bin and graciously sent them to me.

The third rail pickup shoes on all the other brass models I have are neither bent, mutilated or missing and I run a number of them and with added sound decoders.  I was sure to closely examine the posted dealer images of subsequent purchases and have never seen this again.  So, I find the comment that the vast majority of brass models have bent pickup shoes unfounded.  The majority of brass models are displayed.  Some never leave their boxes.

Ed
Interesting suggestion Ed.  The NHRR did allow that to occur at various places along the ROW with "knock-off blocks" to snap off 3rd rail shoes in advance of entering a certain section.  Saw several 3rd rail shoes lying next to one of these blocks in Wilton, CT.  🙂
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nhhe52
Member
Joined: 26 Mar 2004, 05:19

03 Oct 2017, 23:45 #18

DBrion wrote:
nhhe52 wrote: In the spirit of full disclosure, I purchased a pair of OMI FL-9's on eBay many years ago and upon opening the boxes I discovered that the previous owner had clipped off the third rail pickup shoes along one side of the each locomotive.  The "mutilated" pickup shoes were not apparent in the eBay posted images, (buyer beware).  The idiot apparently decided it was more cost effective to clip off the shoes of an expensive brass model rather than correct the obstruction on the layout that they were hitting against along one side of the track.  Amazing!

I contacted Brian Marsh at OMI who miraculously had two pairs of extra FL-9 pickup shoe beams in his parts bin and graciously sent them to me.

The third rail pickup shoes on all the other brass models I have are neither bent, mutilated or missing and I run a number of them and with added sound decoders.  I was sure to closely examine the posted dealer images of subsequent purchases and have never seen this again.  So, I find the comment that the vast majority of brass models have bent pickup shoes unfounded.  The majority of brass models are displayed.  Some never leave their boxes.

Ed
Interesting suggestion Ed.  The NHRR did allow that to occur at various places along the ROW with "knock-off blocks" to snap off 3rd rail shoes in advance of entering a certain section.  Saw several 3rd rail shoes lying next to one of these blocks in Wilton, CT.  🙂
Well there you have it: Rapido should design the shoes to break away to mimic the actual practice.😀

Thanks Dick,

Ed
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frn1963
Member
Joined: 29 Aug 2003, 20:15

04 Oct 2017, 13:17 #19

Image

By coincidence, this picture was posted yesterday on the Unofficial Metro-North Facebook page - how the weathering problem was solved! But someone's claiming that the coaches are also leftover NH eqpt, which I don't see - they don't look like anything I've ever seen. If they are NH coaches, what were they originally?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Richard Abramson
Member
Joined: 04 Aug 2017, 21:23

04 Oct 2017, 13:55 #20

Those are definitely not NH cars. They can't be "Bomb" cars since they require HEP. Possibly ex-NYC?
Train is also operating left-handed on trk-1; location is JO also known as Woodlawn. What is interesting too is the train is coming off the Harlem. Never knew Jets ran on the Harlem.
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