Gas Electric Car Color

corlissbs
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Joined: May 26th, 2003, 4:53 am

September 12th, 2018, 1:33 pm #1

What was the color of the NHRHTA Brill doodlebugs? There was a color pic in a calendar and the car sure looks to be black. And the old trailor that sat in Boston at Dover Street was black. Anyone know for sure?
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jkasey
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jkasey
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Joined: July 6th, 2017, 10:31 am

September 13th, 2018, 9:45 am #2

Brad,

The only photo I could find in the calendars was a photo of the 9106 with the 9001 in the August 1983 calendar. That years' calendar was a B & W  one anyway. Personally, I have never seen a color photo of either. A calculated guess would be that both were some shade of Pullman green but who knows. Do you know which calendar that color shot was in?

John Kasey
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corlissbs
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Joined: May 26th, 2003, 4:53 am

September 13th, 2018, 10:35 am #3

I was incorrect. The color photo is in one of my books, but it is also on line. I will post it here if someone can tell me how to include a pic in a message.
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rsullivan
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Joined: December 14th, 2016, 3:36 pm

September 13th, 2018, 11:45 am #4

Mr. Corlissbs. I downloaded the picture below from https://i.pinimg.com/736x/27/ff/f8/27ff ... 424026.jpg. I then enlarged the image on my screen and laid the pages from the NHRHTA’s New Haven Color Guide (1998) against the image.  I only checked for NH Serial #13, common name – Pullman Green on page 2 and NH Serial #212, common name – Hunter Green on page 4 with the image. On my screen the Pullman Green was both too light and just different when the edge of the page crossed the image midway on the front. On my screen the Hunter Green was almost dark enough and there was a slight green tint visible in the image. However, it did not appear to be the same tint of the Hunter Green paint chip.
NH RR Brill pic 1.jpg
New Haven Brill gas-electric motorcars on a sunny day
New Haven Brill gas-electric motorcars on a sunny day


Now I understand the image’s colors can be affected by the type of film and speed the slide was taken with. The sunlight at the time it was taken will also impact the colors. The age and possible decomposition of the slide film. If it as the original slide or copies made on different quality of film. If it was a print made from the slide. Plus a host of other variables.
Using the dates for service of the Brill gas-electrics provided in Mr. J.W. Swanberg’s New Haven Power 1836 – 1968 (1988) some were in operation starting in 1924 and the last four as trailers leaving the rails in 1952. If they were painted as cars between 1930 and 1948 the Hunter Green could be correct. If they were painted as locomotives between 1945 and 1948 the Hunter Green could be correct. Hunter Green has also been mentioned as looking black on images of the locomotives painted Warm Orange and Hunter Green, and that appearance being attributed to the factors I mentioned above. So, my speculation using the New Haven Color Guide (1998) and New Haven Power 1836 – 1968 (1988) there is a possibility that the color of the cars could be Hunter Green. However, I say this with the caveat that I have never seen them in person and maybe totally wrong.
Richard #3967
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corlissbs
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Joined: May 26th, 2003, 4:53 am

September 13th, 2018, 1:41 pm #5

Richard:

That is the photo I was referring to. When you enlarge the car front, it sure looks all black. There should be a painting diagram for gas electric cars.

How did you insert the photo in your post? I wasn’t to post my photo of the trailer car.

Brad
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rsullivan
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Joined: December 14th, 2016, 3:36 pm

September 13th, 2018, 2:23 pm #6

     Mr. Corlissbs. I go to the webpage for that picture, but this time it didn't go to the specific page, but a Pinerest page showing all kinds of New Haven Railroad publication covers and posters. So I went back and viewed the image and it gave me the web address of the picture. I saved the web address to a blank Word page, then downloaded the picture to my computer. After I completed the reply on Word, I copied it and placed in in the Tapatalk reply box. Then I clicked to the "Full Editor & Preview." Once I had made the titles correct by italics or underlining, I made the space open with a few "return" key strokes. I centered the cursor where I wanted the picture, then clicked on the "add file" button below it, scrolled through my picture files until I found the one I had saved, then clicked on it. I then typed in the caption I wanted and clicked on the "place in line" button.
     I agree that the color of the car does look black and may have been. When I placed the color chip from the page against the screen, I made sure it was flat so there should be any color reflection from the page. It was darker than the color chip, but appeared to have a greenish cast to it. It was definately too dark for the Pullman Green color chip though. Since they were all out of service by 1952, I don't think black was an accepted color for locomotives or passenger equipment yet since that would have occurred in 1955. But again, I have never seen the real thing so I can't say for certain. Hope this helps in downloading pictures and placing them on a post.
Richard #3967
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jkasey
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jkasey
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Joined: July 6th, 2017, 10:31 am

September 13th, 2018, 2:42 pm #7

Brad, Try this as well.
Type your response; go to Full Editor & Preview. Go to "Add Files'. Pop-up window labeled "Open" will appear. Locate the photo on your computer, single click on desired photo & click Open. You will be asked if you want to place in-line. Hit place inline & photo should post. Then hit submit at bottom. This should work with photos that you have stored on your computer. (Photo posted only for instructional purpose. Don't alert the Forum Police & report thread drift!)  John Kasey NH 17504.jpg
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corlissbs
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Joined: May 26th, 2003, 4:53 am

September 13th, 2018, 3:58 pm #8

Here is my contribution to the question. I believe that this is a carbody from one of the later Brill cars, 9101-9111, from the window arrangement. The plugged radiator louver openings can easily be seen at the front of the car, if one enlarges the photo. It was used as a storage shed in Boston and lettered W-145. Note the green, wood, boxcars in front of it. There should be some documents that tell about work equipment. It is clearly black, not green. I remember looking this car over very well and it was black. Somebody told me it's lineage in 1962, when the photo was taken. So, does black mean anything on the car? Just how much money would the NH put into a shed? Equipment cars were not black, the wreck train wasn't black. This thing had to date from the early 1950's. Even cars used as storage at stations were not black. Circumstantial evidence at best. Could the cars always have been painted by the locomotive department in the steam days, black? And the cars were never repainted? The Hunter Green on the warm orange and green diesels lightened with time, not darkened, although they weren't that old in 1952 and wouldn't be as faded as my slides taken in the 1960s of the Hunter Green and Warm orange engines. The photo of it operating, probably was taken around 1952 or a little earlier, before the cars were taken out of service.

I always believed the cars were green, but that was put into my mind by the trading card of the NH EMC/ St. Louis Car gas electric, which never existed anyway in real life on the NH. It's a mystery. I guess I am going to call it black, unless someone finds more information. Thank you, for putting time into this. Sure wish we had an answer.

Brad Smith W 145.JPG
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rsullivan
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Joined: December 14th, 2016, 3:36 pm

September 13th, 2018, 4:36 pm #9

Mr. Smith. According to Standing Data NHRTI 7.10 (1972) NYNH&H RR Non-Revenure Equipment - "W" Series Cars Renumbered from Passenger Cars, the W-145 had old car number 9103, present use was blank, body type was gas-electric, built in 1926. The location was blank.
Richard #3967
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Statkowski
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Joined: March 5th, 2003, 4:39 am

September 13th, 2018, 11:52 pm #10

Judging from the photograph of W-145, it's certainly plausible that the MOW people painted it black.  The "W-145" doesn't appear to be a patch job.  If used in actual work train use, it could well have ended up some variation of red/orange, but it wasn't, so it didn't..
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