First Black Belt in AK

First Black Belt in AK

Joined: October 14th, 2005, 5:16 am

July 10th, 2008, 1:49 am #1

I was over to Martial Talk and noticed this thread about the first Black Belt. Some difference of opinions.

Anyone here care to add to it?

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64334

The same battle it seems AK says one thing and Tracy's says another or I should say Doc mentions it.

It is an interesting arguement just by the very way it is divided I would think. Hmmm

Gary
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Joined: June 13th, 2005, 7:25 pm

July 10th, 2008, 1:07 pm #2

According to Chuck Sullivan it was Charles Beeder shortly followed by James Ibrao.

Master's Magazine had a great article and interview with Chuck Sullivan on the provided DVD.
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Joined: October 14th, 2005, 5:16 am

July 10th, 2008, 3:32 pm #3

Quite a bit of the discussion goes over and around the simple (in a courtroom looking at the evidence) obviousness of it all. Many claim BB and never got a certificate.

If it was placed into evidence rather than hearsay and all sitting around talking about it... Who got the first diploma? The brass ring of Kenpo it seems.

Gary
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Joined: November 24th, 2004, 9:07 pm

July 10th, 2008, 7:55 pm #4

According to Chuck Sullivan it was Charles Beeder shortly followed by James Ibrao.

Master's Magazine had a great article and interview with Chuck Sullivan on the provided DVD.
>According to Chuck Sullivan it was Charles Beeder shortly followed by James Ibrao.<

Beginning in 2000 when the Journey was being written, I've had many conversations with Chuck Sullivan about the subject of Mr. Parker's first black belt. According to these firsthand conversations, including one that included Jimmy Ibrao being physically present, Chuck strongly believes that (Mr. Beeder aside) Rich Montgomery was Mr. Parker's first black belt (in California). And as many know, Chuck was physically active in kenpo at that time. As an aside, I can add that I was present in Las Vegas when Chuck Sullivan asked Jimmy Ibrao (friend to friend) "Hey, Jimmy, what's this I'm hearing about you being Ed Parker's first black belt?" to which Jimmy replied, "I don't say that; other people say that!"

With respect,
tom bleecker

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Joined: October 14th, 2005, 5:16 am

July 10th, 2008, 8:37 pm #5

Tom yep, all that goes around comes around some have mentioned. Depends on the venue I have noticed.

So can we say it is someone, for sure got it first...LOL

Gary
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Joined: June 13th, 2005, 7:25 pm

July 10th, 2008, 9:24 pm #6

>According to Chuck Sullivan it was Charles Beeder shortly followed by James Ibrao.<

Beginning in 2000 when the Journey was being written, I've had many conversations with Chuck Sullivan about the subject of Mr. Parker's first black belt. According to these firsthand conversations, including one that included Jimmy Ibrao being physically present, Chuck strongly believes that (Mr. Beeder aside) Rich Montgomery was Mr. Parker's first black belt (in California). And as many know, Chuck was physically active in kenpo at that time. As an aside, I can add that I was present in Las Vegas when Chuck Sullivan asked Jimmy Ibrao (friend to friend) "Hey, Jimmy, what's this I'm hearing about you being Ed Parker's first black belt?" to which Jimmy replied, "I don't say that; other people say that!"

With respect,
tom bleecker
You are correct Mr. Bleecker ... I read over Newsletter #52 3rd quarter 2007 from Mr. Sullivan and it says it was Rich Montgomery.

Apologies for the mis-information. The brain is getting rusty.

Salute,

Martin
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Joined: October 14th, 2005, 5:16 am

July 10th, 2008, 9:37 pm #7

>According to Chuck Sullivan it was Charles Beeder shortly followed by James Ibrao.<

Beginning in 2000 when the Journey was being written, I've had many conversations with Chuck Sullivan about the subject of Mr. Parker's first black belt. According to these firsthand conversations, including one that included Jimmy Ibrao being physically present, Chuck strongly believes that (Mr. Beeder aside) Rich Montgomery was Mr. Parker's first black belt (in California). And as many know, Chuck was physically active in kenpo at that time. As an aside, I can add that I was present in Las Vegas when Chuck Sullivan asked Jimmy Ibrao (friend to friend) "Hey, Jimmy, what's this I'm hearing about you being Ed Parker's first black belt?" to which Jimmy replied, "I don't say that; other people say that!"

With respect,
tom bleecker
Here is a link that goes into it, in depth with pictures.
The pictures are good for all to see, the written may not be, but it is pretty well researched it seems.

http://kenpokarate.com/first_shodan.html

Gary
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Joined: November 24th, 2004, 9:07 pm

July 10th, 2008, 11:58 pm #8

Many people looked at this web link back when the Journey's history chapter was being written. The difficulty that concerned many of us was that Will Tracy seemed to arbitrarily affix dates to many of his photos - and in other areas Will's memory didn't agree with the memories of others who were present. One example was my personal conversation with Jimmy Woo. When asked who Mr. Parker's first black belt was, Jimmy recalled that it was Rich Montgomery. Anyway, after all was said and done, the determination was made that in our collective view Rich was the first black belt. Could we be mistaken? Of course. That said, when one considers that many individuals began their kenpo journey more than 50 years ago - and a fair number of those have passed on, stopped training, or are training in an art entirely different from what they trained 50 years ago - is it really all that important if one of them received his black belt six months before another?

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Joined: October 14th, 2005, 5:16 am

July 11th, 2008, 2:43 am #9

Tom thanks for the good discussion, it does not matter to me, to bad I did not study with the man, I now could say I did. But with my path and demeanor. I'd still be a dirty white. I made a choice back then and picked Sifu Johnny Leoning.

Worked for me. I always thought I'd go back and study some more after LEO, but he passed away at an early age, 1977.

He was a very good MA, weapons etc. did you ever meet him. He was the Sifu to many in Hollywood also, played Master Te in the Kung Fu series.

Gary
Last edited by BGile on July 11th, 2008, 2:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: November 24th, 2004, 9:07 pm

July 11th, 2008, 4:36 am #10

>He was a very good MA, weapons etc. did you ever meet him.<

I don't recall personally meeting Sifu Leoning, although I do remember hearing many good things about him as both an individual and martial artist.

Salute
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