What do you use to record?

What do you use to record?

gorillabat
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Joined: Apr 28 2004, 09:53 PM

Oct 28 2011, 06:32 AM #1

I used to do the old cassette 4-track thing but lately I've been using this cheap Line 6 Toneport device and it's pretty cool.

I am not real fond of the multitracking software that came with it though. Wondering about switching to Reaper or Audacity or something.

Would also like to know what anyone uses for drums. I can't afford to purchase anything right now...I have an old drum machine but it barely functions.
unrefined
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Joined: Jun 20 2009, 02:14 AM

Oct 28 2011, 06:56 AM #2

I use the Yamaha YDD-60 electronic drum pads. You can play them with sticks or even your hands, and they have about 260 programmable tones, about 100 of which are actually usable. I use loops as well, but I can never resist adding some 'real' drums on top of those, because it's fun, and makes it sound more human and less robotically metronomic to have someone actually hitting something with a stick... :)

I use GarageBand for the actual recording (to answer your first question.)
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marvell78
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Joined: Jul 3 2003, 06:24 PM

Nov 7 2011, 05:49 PM #3

flickeringlexicon @ Oct 28 2011, 06:56 PM wrote: I use the Yamaha YDD-60 electronic drum pads. You can play them with sticks or even your hands, and they have about 260 programmable tones, about 100 of which are actually usable. I use loops as well, but I can never resist adding some 'real' drums on top of those, because it's fun, and makes it sound more human and less robotically metronomic to have someone actually hitting something with a stick... :)

I use GarageBand for the actual recording (to answer your first question.)

i am using garageband too

one thing i cant get though. how do you delete whole sections of a song?

say i want to cut out the last minute of a song. when i shade and press delete instead of that shaded chunk disappearing, some tracks do and some dont

the other thing: how do you add bars in the middle of a song?

i find the best simplest recording is adobe audition. easy to work, good fx. what i do now is record in garageband and then take the finished mp 3 to my old laptop and tidy it up using adobe audition (using eq, speed, fx and so on

i find it useful to double up the garageband finsihed mp3 or maybe even treble it in adobe and then set each mp3 at a differnt effect and eq and then mix the three trackls down into one single track. adds cosndierably to the punch lol. found that setting one track with a very slight chorus was very effective in filling things out (also pan so that r and l and midddle are slightly different with the chorused track in th middle...whole thing takes maybe ten minutes or so but worth it
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Joined: Jun 20 2009, 02:14 AM

Nov 7 2011, 06:06 PM #4

marvell78 @ Nov 7 2011, 10:49 AM wrote: i am using garageband too

one thing i cant get though. how do you delete whole sections of a song?

say i want to cut out the last minute of a song. when i shade and press delete instead of that shaded chunk disappearing, some tracks do and some dont

the other thing: how do you add bars in the middle of a song?

i find the best simplest recording is adobe audition. easy to work, good fx. what i do now is record in garageband and then take the finished mp 3 to my old laptop and tidy it up using adobe audition (using eq, speed, fx and so on

i find it useful to double up the garageband finsihed mp3 or maybe even treble it in adobe and then set each mp3 at a differnt effect and eq and then mix the three trackls down into one single track. adds cosndierably to the punch lol. found that setting one track with a very slight  chorus was very effective in filling things out (also pan so that r and l and midddle are slightly different with the chorused track in th middle...whole thing takes maybe ten minutes or so but worth it
Good questions, Marvell. To delete whole sections, you have to do one track at a time. Make a dividing line in each track using Command + T, that will split the track wherever the red cursor line is. You can select all with Command + A before you split the tracks up, but you'll still have to delete going from one track to the next, getting rid of the section in question as you go.

Adding bars in the middle: Also use that Command + T splitting technique, and move the end of the track a few bars ahead, leaving an empty space. Record or paste something into that space. I just had to make a song longer cos I found I wanted another chorus in the middle, that's how I did it. It's better to do it early on, though, before you have too many tracks finished, otherwise matching them all up to tempo will be that much harder. I hope this helps, I'm the worst teacher on Earth, and it's even more difficult to write out rather than say...

I think it's very wise of you to 'treat' the GB files on something else when you're finished. I do a lot of EQing into a CD burner for my mixdowns... :banghead:
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Joined: May 8 2004, 01:33 PM

Nov 8 2011, 10:30 PM #5

For the album I am working on now, the album is recorded with:

1. public domain songs and samples (from Internet archive mostly).

2. Samples from friends playing instruments, Mixcraft 5 and some sample packages I purchased for a couple hundered bucks.

3. Mixcraft 5 (mixing, track speed, effects). I really like Mixcraft 5 (can't remembr how much I paid for it). Mixcraft 5 is recommended.

4. My voice recorded by video camera. I have a nice mic and a phantom power, but it is so hard to use those devices correctly (eg, impedance matching problems) that I mostly just went with my video camera to record vocals. This is also very helpful in making the videos because the vocal track is perfectly synced. The video camera's audio recorder isn't as good, but it is good enuf!
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ryaneno
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Joined: May 28 2009, 10:29 PM

Nov 8 2011, 11:37 PM #6

"My music is sampled
it's completely fake
it's done my machines
cause they don't make mistakes"...
Try To Be Grateful


Painful Defecation http://painfuldefecation.bandcamp.com/
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marvell78
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Joined: Jul 3 2003, 06:24 PM

Nov 9 2011, 01:08 AM #7

Cleanville Tziabatz @ Nov 9 2011, 10:30 AM wrote: For the album I am working on now, the album is recorded with:

1. public domain songs and samples (from Internet archive mostly).

2. Samples from friends playing instruments, Mixcraft 5 and some sample packages I purchased for a couple hundered bucks.

3. Mixcraft 5 (mixing, track speed, effects). I really like Mixcraft 5 (can't remembr how much I paid for it). Mixcraft 5 is recommended.

4. My voice recorded by video camera. I have a nice mic and a phantom power, but it is so hard to use those devices correctly (eg, impedance matching problems) that I mostly just went with my video camera to record vocals. This is also very helpful in making the videos because the vocal track is perfectly synced. The video camera's audio recorder isn't as good, but it is good enuf!
and what did you do about backing tracks

how did you sync your voice with them and the video?

did you film yourself singing over them (only asking because we were thinking of doing something similar here...and not sure whether to sing over backing tracks through a mixer with proper mic and film that or play backing tracks and sing over them using the video mic and film that
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Joined: May 8 2004, 01:33 PM

Nov 9 2011, 01:34 PM #8

marvell78 @ Nov 8 2011, 09:08 PM wrote:
Cleanville Tziabatz @ Nov 9 2011, 10:30 AM wrote: For the album I am working on now, the album is recorded with:

1.  public domain songs and samples (from Internet archive mostly).

2.  Samples from friends playing instruments, Mixcraft 5 and some sample packages I purchased for a couple hundered bucks.

3.  Mixcraft 5 (mixing, track speed, effects).  I really like Mixcraft 5 (can't remembr how much I paid for it).  Mixcraft 5 is recommended.

4.  My voice recorded by video camera.  I have a nice mic and a phantom power, but it is so hard to use those devices correctly (eg, impedance matching problems) that I mostly just went with my video camera to record vocals.  This is also very helpful in making the videos because the vocal track is perfectly synced.  The video camera's audio recorder isn't as good, but it is good enuf!
and what did you do about backing tracks

how did you sync your voice with them and the video?

did you film yourself singing over them (only asking because we were thinking of doing something similar here...and not sure whether to sing over backing tracks through a mixer with proper mic and film that or play backing tracks and sing over them using the video mic and film that
On the on the ones where the vocal track also serves as the vocal track of the video, I basically use Mixcraft 5 as my mixer of instruments (and any backing vox). Then I use the video editor to put the instrumental track and the video trax together as one (along with video). The hard part is that I have been doing the vocals first and force match the instruments (sampled, not played) to it. This requires many trips between the video editing program and Mixcraft 5 to get the instruments to match the lead "camera vocals." It is time-consuming, but when I don't have to worry about playing instruments or setting up mics, this matching of samples to each other and to a vocal track becomes the bulk of the compositional process and the bulk of the fun.

It also helps that the "camera vocals" are usually more spoken than sung on the new record, although I could imagine doing the music first, then recording the "camera vocal" while listening to the music (eg, on headphones) and then it would be presumably extremely easy to sync and mix the audio in my video editor to make the "video master tape" of the song.

Not recommending this process for anybody else. Just excited to be working on new music again and thus able to talk about it again.

New Farces Wanna Mo album drops 1 Jan 2012.

Hope they don't stop selling legal, synthetic mj before it is done. It is like patience and creative solutioning in a little black bag.
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marvell78
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Joined: Jul 3 2003, 06:24 PM

Nov 9 2011, 11:11 PM #9

looking forward to hearing it. i think the forced matcvhing is difficult enough, we have tried that. if there was some way of having an audible click track or some in-ear job it might make it slightly easier

i think we are going for playback of instrumental in the room and live vocals over it. all taped. then the video tape mixed as a track along with the original instrumental track. hopefully, the original instrumental track will fill out the 'gap' (between the playback and the live vox) that will obviously occur when the video mic is being used. it will be lo fi but it may be interesting

was wondering, are there any outlets (apart from haivng your own site) over your way for this kind of production? dont want it to disappear into the youtube tide

btw, what are the pieces like? spoken vocals and samples? sounding like what (roughly)? a track we did called 'oceanic' i sent to you ages ago, i am sure that is what we did with it. we wenrt trhough a phase of producing longish peices with differnt sections, each with a differnt character or vocal persona. i must check back. it may be online somewhere
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Joined: May 8 2004, 01:33 PM

Nov 10 2011, 12:59 AM #10

marvell78 @ Nov 9 2011, 07:11 PM wrote: looking forward to hearing it. i think the forced matcvhing is difficult enough, we have tried that. if there was some way of having an audible click track or some in-ear job it might make it slightly easier

i think we are going for playback of instrumental in the room and live vocals over it. all taped. then the video tape mixed as a track along with the original instrumental track. hopefully, the original instrumental track will fill out the 'gap' (between the playback and the live vox) that will obviously occur when the video mic is being used. it will be lo fi but it may be interesting

was wondering, are there any outlets (apart from haivng your own site) over your way for this kind of production? dont want it to disappear into the youtube tide

btw, what are the pieces like? spoken vocals and samples? sounding like what (roughly)? a track we did called 'oceanic' i sent to you ages ago, i am sure that is what we did with it. we wenrt trhough a phase of producing longish peices with differnt sections, each with a differnt character or vocal persona. i must check back. it may be online somewhere
I lissen to "Oceanic" fairly often because it ended up on one of the FoF Comps (a 3 disc set) that I compiled in late 2007 or early 2008. I think u were called the "something 7" then.

I don't want to give a sneak peek to my album just yet, but, suffice it to say that 6 of the 7 tracks are recorded. The undone track is planned to be a 10 minute instrumental. Three of the seven songs will have vocals (like I was talking about above) and they are all finished. It will be at least 40 minutes long (even if I have to add another spoken word piece, but I hope I don't). This one unfinished track I may not even have a songwriting credit on (would be a first for a Farces Wanna Mo song), and I think my little brother will do the video for it (I did the videos for the other six songs already). I am forcing myself not to lissen to the unfinished FWM album right now (I lissened to it compulsively in late sep and early Oct - atm it makes me slightly sick).

As far as I am concerned, if you and BradX like the album, then it is a total success, but I also hope that more people will glom on and understand what I have done there.
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mikeplow1961
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Joined: Nov 20 2010, 02:43 PM

Nov 10 2011, 11:55 AM #11

I use Cakewalk Sonar, not because it's any better than anything else but because I started off with the very simple Cakewalk Guitar tracks when I started recording again, then progressed to Home Studio then Producer. I think they have their pros and cons and it's just what you get used to using and feel comfortable with.

I did install Cubase briefly last year but didn't get on with it.

I've used Garageband on the Ipad just doodling about.

If only they could produce an app opr piece of software that could make you focus on actually completing something. I'd buy that.
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MCR
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MCR
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Joined: Oct 10 2005, 12:25 PM

Nov 10 2011, 12:15 PM #12

mikeplow1961 @ Nov 10 2011, 11:55 AM wrote:
If only they could produce an app opr piece of software that could make you focus on actually completing something. I'd buy that.
:applaud:

I don't think I have finished anything since moving over to recording on computer.

With the old reel to reel analogue 8 track I had hooked up to an Atari 1040 running Creator I did loads of stuff because I had to decide on a course of action and stick to it due to not much outboard really and doing a final stereo mix could get quite complicated with an analogue desk you only wanted to do it once and get it right, no automation for mutes or fader rides.
Remember. Tony Iommi is your friend


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Joined: May 8 2004, 01:33 PM

Nov 10 2011, 04:12 PM #13

When I moved my music making operations to computer in 2001, the next album took two years to make, constantly working in my free time. The next one after that took well over three years (although the work was more sporadic). This was a hugely slow pace for me, although I am glad I took the time.

So, yeah, moving to computers will slow you up, at least at first.

The other problem with the computer is that making subtle "mistakes" is part of the learning process. If you somehow use a computer to make a song sound worse, you might not notice the problem for a year or two. Of course, the most basic and most recognized of these mistakes is "clipping." But there are all kinds of things you can make on the computer that might sound good at first, but ultimately harm the songs. You have to develop a sort of critical scrutiny to catch the bad stuff before it gets too far and gets embedded in the song. Listening for clipping is easy once you know what you are listening for, but listening for other bad things, when you don't know what bad thing exactly you are listening for is a harder skill. Takes trial and error and that takes time. You have to take the headphones off and really live with the songs, even when they are only part completed.

The more time you spend, the quicker the process of doing music on computer gets. I would say I am at a point where the computer speeds things up instead of slowing them down. Now it is only lack of song ideas that slows me down.

Of course the good software is now a lot more user friendly and forgiving than it was back in 2002. On the other hand, there are a lot fewer free, weird, small compositional and/or sound processing tools on the internet now than there was back then. On the third hand, there are a lot more public domain samples of audio and video now compared to back then.
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mikeplow1961
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Joined: Nov 20 2010, 02:43 PM

Nov 10 2011, 06:26 PM #14

I can work very quickly in Sonar, it's just getting round to devoting some time to it. Having a four year old means there's always a dozen distractions or commitments and this has worsened now she's at school and has a social whirl of swimming club, dance class, rainbows and can so and so come round to play. By the time she goes to bed I'm cream crackered.

I need a FOf record club #3 project assignment and Flexi as a slavedriver record company boss to get motivated. :lol:
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Joined: Jun 20 2009, 02:14 AM

Nov 10 2011, 11:41 PM #15

mikeplow1961 @ Nov 10 2011, 11:26 AM wrote: I can work very quickly in Sonar, it's just getting round to devoting some time to it. Having a four year old means there's always a dozen distractions or commitments and this has worsened now she's at school and has a social whirl of swimming club, dance class, rainbows and can so and so come round to play. By the time she goes to bed I'm cream crackered.

I need a FOf record club #3 project assignment and Flexi as a slavedriver record company boss to get motivated. :lol:
:lol: Hyaaah!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IB9N2VND2fQ
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Saveloy
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Joined: Nov 27 2003, 12:24 PM

Nov 11 2011, 11:24 AM #16

mikeplow1961 @ Nov 10 2011, 07:26 PM wrote:I need a FOf record club #3 project assignment and Flexi as a slavedriver record company boss to get motivated.  :lol:
:lol: Isn't it time for another Fall album cover? The last one feels like *aaaages* ago.

When my lot started out we recorded onto a borrowed 4-track tape deck (a Fostex). The recordings would be re-recorded onto a PC, cherry picked for the least-bad bits and mucked about with in CoolEdit Pro, and/or Acid (which was a really nice, intuitive loop sequencer).

All the tracks here were created that way - some more mucked about with than others:

Les Waters

After a few years of that we lost the 4-track and the mics, and until recently we've had to make do with recording directly onto a PC in MONO, via a single crappy vocal mic (5 quid supermarket job). I've got hours and hours of recordings done that way, from which I've derived scads of loops, half-songs etc, but so far no actual finished tunes.

As of Feb this year, however, I've had a digital 4-track. No decent mics, yet, but the inbuilt ones do me okay. The version of And This Day we did for the 'Hex Enduction Ours' project was the first attempt at an actual tune using it. I'm still using CoolEdit Pro (is it called Audition now?).
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Joined: Jun 20 2009, 02:14 AM

Nov 11 2011, 03:39 PM #17

"And This Day" sounded great, and was a pleasure to 'Master.' If that was your first attempt with the new gear, you can only get better still...
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misterrogers
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Joined: May 7 2007, 12:35 AM

Nov 11 2011, 04:56 PM #18

If you want something that is less computer-software based, I am fond of the Zoom R24 digital-goes for about 450 american, all kinds of effects, etc built in..phatom power, high impedence input..then for the mix down-it pairs up/transfers to cubase program for extensive mixing..pretty easy to get a handle on but i know theres plenty of youtube tutorials and a dvd you can get for it..easy to bounce stuff around, combine, submix (drums for instance), etc..

i am also a vet of the tascam cassette thang where i did demos ,etc for years..this zoom is no toy like that-you will get deep rich studio sounds..i have a nice general purpose mic (SI-4?) that does wonders

i tell you that i was out of the game for 15-20 yrs (recording my ideas) and this machine is a wonder..between this and the amp modeling craze, its a great time to be a musician....they are making toys (like korgs kaosillator or the monotribe stuff that elena uses/used on yfoc-all geared to non musicians, packed with great sounds) that put the emphasis on sounds...most of the pop stuff i hear in the us has devolved to where theres only one riff or part that goes thru the whole tune-demonstrating a vacuum of creativity

but the more it goes this way, musicianship becomes (as it should in my opine) the premium asset that cant be modeled..

for functions sake, you would be crazy to buy a marshall stack, an orange amp or a jazz chorus these days when you get exact modeling for 200 bucks on a new fender (or other) amp

..i personally need to get a better electronic drumkit..its just too much trouble when you are doing all the parts to have to stop to fine tune an acoustic drumkit and get it mic'd up/balanced. it sounds the best, ill grant you..but not worth the time for me at this point..one day when i finish the tracks (early next year) Ill post a link..no, its nothing like the fall at all. although as i posted in the fall section..my laptop was stolen when i did a track that "borrowed" the beat from laptop dog. i shall not do so again. learnt my lesson, tha fall will get you....(or mark rather)
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gorillabat
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Joined: Apr 28 2004, 09:53 PM

Nov 11 2011, 05:17 PM #19

Saveloy @ Nov 11 2011, 06:24 AM wrote: ...and mucked about with in CoolEdit Pro...
I used to use CoolEditPro all the time. I also used to use a program you could d'l off the 'net called Internet Audio Mix. It was clunky, but you could do a lot with it also. Real easy.

I do miss the old tape 4-track days, but I'm thinking of a project in which I'll use old tape recorders and then input each tape into multitrack software and see if I can get it to synch up. Or not. I got no problem with hiss and room noise!
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Joined: May 8 2004, 01:33 PM

Nov 12 2011, 03:32 PM #20

gorillabat @ Nov 11 2011, 01:17 PM wrote:
Saveloy @ Nov 11 2011, 06:24 AM wrote: ...and mucked about with in CoolEdit Pro...
I used to use CoolEditPro all the time. I also used to use a program you could d'l off the 'net called Internet Audio Mix. It was clunky, but you could do a lot with it also. Real easy.

I do miss the old tape 4-track days, but I'm thinking of a project in which I'll use old tape recorders and then input each tape into multitrack software and see if I can get it to synch up. Or not. I got no problem with hiss and room noise!
What did you use for "Galagan Fighters"?
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gorillabat
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Joined: Apr 28 2004, 09:53 PM

Nov 13 2011, 07:15 AM #21

Cleanville Tziabatz @ Nov 12 2011, 10:32 AM wrote: What did you use for "Galagan Fighters"?
Great holy crap! How did you even know about that stuff?!? I had about forgotten all about it...
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Joined: May 8 2004, 01:33 PM

Nov 13 2011, 02:19 PM #22

gorillabat @ Nov 13 2011, 03:15 AM wrote:
Cleanville Tziabatz @ Nov 12 2011, 10:32 AM wrote: What did you use for "Galagan Fighters"?
Great holy crap! How did you even know about that stuff?!? I had about forgotten all about it...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dCJsDsKCOU
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Joined: Oct 29 2004, 07:09 AM

Dec 25 2014, 11:29 PM #23

I use the free MTSR app on my iPhone. Very easy to use and produces good results. It's a 4 track recorder. I've recorded loads of songs on it.
the flesh covers the bone
and they put a mind
in there and
sometimes a soul,
and the women break
vases against the walls
and the men drink too
much
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misterrogers
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Joined: May 7 2007, 12:35 AM

Dec 29 2014, 03:25 PM #24

I just finished my first LP in 20 years (will be out January) and I used a very inexpensive machine called the Zoom R24. it is not a step method or use some kind of software-it is direct drive onto an SD card. It only cost about 450 US. It was somewhat limiting to the extent that I was dealing with a new system -I had done my last on 2 inch tape in the 90s, etc. So it was a real change. what I did was record all the music tracks first with exactly the sound I wanted (no post processing on the music save reverb or chorus) until I learned the system with the effects- mixing, vocals etc., then onto audacity etc...
At the urging of the guy who helped me with the project, I am soon (this month also) getting a new IMAC system with software (Komplete)- so once again I will be on the learning curve on this first part of this year. will be doing 3 projects this year so I must learn fast. Big concerns for me are drums (I want to play everything live and to avoid (for the most part) clicks or any mechanical or computer rhythm. I know exactly how I want the feel to be on my music and Ill play it myself.
Ill let you know how it goes on the IMAC after I get into it. My pal is convinced I will do better stuff and it be easier. I just don't want (by the sounds) something that is more artificial sounding. I have always gotten a perverse sense of enjoyment when I get results out of cheapness. Not the kind of guy who fetishes/collects guitars, I like them of course but only have about 4 or 5. I really do like working on the cheap.. Wondering how opening this box of sound will change how I do things. Although my records were 20 years apart, you can tell I'm the same dude. I guess that means that I have my own sound.Be interesting to see how it will change-uh.

I'm gonna be posting a link within the month- but I really don't think what I do would be of much interest to this group .. its my thing..
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