Dan's Stat. Corner

Dan's Stat. Corner

gohoho90
Member
Joined: 03 Nov 2010, 13:26

20 Aug 2015, 07:26 #1

As Dan's work on the concordance correlation coefficient continues, this topic is devoted to his breakdown of The 2015 Fall Cup.

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

22 Aug 2015, 14:50 #2

The mathematics of tournaments are quite interesting. And I know little about mathematics and statistics. I'm just a fan.

Over in Fall Discussion, I've posted about this:

http://www.allourideas.org/falltracks


Dan

gohoho90
Member
Joined: 03 Nov 2010, 13:26

22 Aug 2015, 15:32 #3

Very interesting.

Not too sure why Tommy Shooter is currently top-of-the-pops on there, though.

Will be following this...

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

22 Aug 2015, 16:39 #4

gohoho90 @ Aug 22 2015, 04:32 PM wrote: Very interesting.

Not too sure why Tommy Shooter is currently top-of-the-pops on there, though.

Will be following this...
It takes time to build up, I think. Early results won't be reliable.

After a few thousand responses, assuming anyone bothers to do it, we'll see whether the leaderboard looks anything like the Fall Cup.

Dan

bzfgt
Moderator
bzfgt
Moderator
Joined: 07 Dec 2012, 03:12

25 Aug 2015, 04:31 #5

Do you just keep going until you're sick of it, or does it let you off at some point?

bzfgt
Moderator
bzfgt
Moderator
Joined: 07 Dec 2012, 03:12

25 Aug 2015, 04:39 #6

Crap, it's hard to stop because by the time I have the cursor up to the X to close the tab I can see the next one. I got loopy and made a few wrong votes, I voted down Weather Report Two in favor of something like "The City Never Sleeps.' That one hurt...

avsp
Member
avsp
Member
Joined: 19 Feb 2007, 12:30

26 Aug 2015, 20:40 #7

bzfgt @ Aug 25 2015, 04:31 AM wrote: Do you just keep going until you're sick of it, or does it let you off at some point?
i'm rather regretting my rule of voting till 'Hit The North' is one of the choices, ..., it can take an age

Plus it keeps crashing on me

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

04 Sep 2015, 12:57 #8

Been busy, so I'm a bit behind with all of this. But I haven't forgotten.

Dan

Joined: 25 Nov 2012, 19:22

09 Sep 2015, 18:53 #9

One thing I'd like to know is about track lengths. My gut feeling doing the cup is that the average length of songs increases over time but I have no real evidence for this. If it were true I'm not sure I approve as too many tracks seem to outstay their welcome especially late 80s onwards.

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

09 Sep 2015, 20:58 #10

academichamilton @ Sep 9 2015, 07:53 PM wrote: One thing I'd like to know is about track lengths. My gut feeling doing the cup is that the average length of songs increases over time but I have no real evidence for this. If it were true I'm not sure I approve as too many tracks seem to outstay their welcome especially late 80s onwards.
I haven't done track timing lengths, but arising from my concordance I did do a graph of number of words used in song lyrics per year (of course, you can get very long songs with very few words):

http://z1.invisionfree.com/thefall/inde ... p=22413805


And number of unique words per album:
http://z1.invisionfree.com/thefall/inde ... p=22413816

And see also subsequent posts, where additional information is presented and discussed and sometimes corrected. And whether the data is significant is also discussed.

One day I might get around to adding in track length data and then produce some interesting stats comparing word count with track length across the years.

Dan

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

09 Sep 2015, 21:00 #11

What would I use as a standard canonical track length figure?

I would use my mediamonkey database, but the track length figures there are sometimes distorted.

Dan

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

09 Sep 2015, 21:05 #12

The Fall online discography has track timings. Shall I just use those?

Dan

Bert
Member
Bert
Member
Joined: 27 Sep 2003, 08:51

10 Sep 2015, 15:20 #13

dannyno @ Sep 9 2015, 10:05 PM wrote: The Fall online discography has track timings. Shall I just use those?

Dan
Sorry to potentially give you more to consider, but what would you do where there are two equally 'valid' (for want of a better word) versions of a track which have differing lengths? An example would be the different versions of Dedication on the CD/LP of Sub-Lingual Tablet. With something like that, you couldn't even use release date as a kind of tie-breaker.

I'll shut up now.

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

11 Sep 2015, 14:27 #14

Bert @ Sep 10 2015, 04:20 PM wrote:
dannyno @ Sep 9 2015, 10:05 PM wrote: The Fall online discography has track timings. Shall I just use those?

Dan
Sorry to potentially give you more to consider, but what would you do where there are two equally 'valid' (for want of a better word) versions of a track which have differing lengths? An example would be the different versions of Dedication on the CD/LP of Sub-Lingual Tablet. With something like that, you couldn't even use release date as a kind of tie-breaker.

I'll shut up now.
Well, if I did this I'd be using my concordance as the basis I think rather than start afresh, so I've already made decisions about versions there. I'd just follow that for convenience. (The concordance doesn't include SLT and isn't likely to any time soon).

On the other hand, there was talk elsewhere of construction a canonical catalogue of everything and every version, a la classical composers. The thought of the work involved appals, but no decisions would be required. <shudder>

Dan

gappy tooth
Member
Joined: 13 Jun 2003, 11:23

11 Sep 2015, 14:47 #15

I personally feel that, given that we're voting on composition rather than recording, times would be potentially misleading.

Of course, when we have the Full Fall Recording Cup, featuring every single commercially available edit, version and remix, it can be looked into. ^_^
Good Vi-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-bratio-xx

dannyno
Moderator
dannyno
Moderator
Joined: 11 May 2004, 15:28

12 Sep 2015, 22:28 #16

gappy tooth @ Sep 11 2015, 03:47 PM wrote: I personally feel that, given that we're voting on composition rather than recording, times would be potentially misleading.

Of course, when we have the Full Fall Recording Cup, featuring every single commercially available edit, version and remix, it can be looked into. ^_^
This could already be done, by extending the remit of http://www.allourideas.org/falltracks :-)

Dan

gappy tooth
Member
Joined: 13 Jun 2003, 11:23

17 Sep 2015, 14:36 #17

dannyno @ Sep 13 2015, 10:28 AM wrote:
gappy tooth @ Sep 11 2015, 03:47 PM wrote: I personally feel that, given that we're voting on composition rather than recording, times would be potentially misleading.

Of course, when we have the Full Fall Recording Cup, featuring every single commercially available edit, version and remix, it can be looked into.&nbsp; ^_^
This could already be done, by extending the remit of http://www.allourideas.org/falltracks :-)

Dan
Make it so.
Good Vi-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-bratio-xx

gohoho90
Member
Joined: 03 Nov 2010, 13:26

21 Dec 2015, 21:10 #18

THE 2015 ROUND-BY-ROUND VOTE COUNT:

R502: 16,126 votes/247 matches = 65.29 average
R256: 9,226 votes/129 matches = 71.52 average
R128: 5,074 votes/65 matches = 78.06 average
R64: 2,559 votes/32 matches = 79.97 average
R32: 1,451 votes/16 matches = 90.69 average
R16: 708 votes/8 matches = 88.5 average
QF: 361 votes/4 matches = 90.25 average
SF: 218 votes/2 matches = 109 average
F: 117 votes/1 match = 117 average

OVERALL: 35,840 votes/504 matches = 71.11 average


Most votes in a single match: 117 (Winter v. Blindness)
Least votes in a single match: 48 (Prague '91 v. Blue Christmas & Elf Prefix v. Instrum Two Akatwo)