Suspended Animation Inc. accused of incompetence

Suspended Animation Inc. accused of incompetence

Joined: May 17th, 2009, 5:13 pm

November 18th, 2010, 4:42 pm #1

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Joined: October 6th, 2004, 6:46 pm

November 18th, 2010, 5:43 pm #2

I like Melody's viewpoint. All we hear otherwise is warm sunshine and colorful butterflies.
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Joined: October 6th, 2004, 6:46 pm

November 18th, 2010, 6:00 pm #3

"What happens if Alcor goes bankrupt, and is not be able to care for their cryogenically-suspended members? Certainly local regulatory agencies would have some sort of requirements, for disposing of their deceased residents, but would Alcor have any legal obligation to the families of those people? Some of those people paid $150,000, (and more, in the way of membership dues, etc.), to be preserved there, and I've heard of significant bequests being left to Alcor. Would these Alcor members, and their families, simply be "out in the warm," without any recourse, if Alcor were to fail?"

It would be interesting to know how much capital was wasted on legal matters when simple answers would have solved problems...
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Joined: October 6th, 2004, 6:46 pm

November 18th, 2010, 6:17 pm #4

Has anyone ever specified how the Alcor $80,000-200,000 fee is allotted to preservation?

I know I asked this question before...
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Joined: September 16th, 2010, 2:14 pm

November 18th, 2010, 6:50 pm #5

I like Melody's viewpoint. All we hear otherwise is warm sunshine and colorful butterflies.
I like her viewpoint in an advisory, not dictatorial, role. I believe grown people can make their own minds up instead of having the government "protect" them. (With the bill footed by people who don't even care.)
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Joined: September 16th, 2010, 2:14 pm

November 18th, 2010, 7:08 pm #6

"What happens if Alcor goes bankrupt, and is not be able to care for their cryogenically-suspended members? Certainly local regulatory agencies would have some sort of requirements, for disposing of their deceased residents, but would Alcor have any legal obligation to the families of those people? Some of those people paid $150,000, (and more, in the way of membership dues, etc.), to be preserved there, and I've heard of significant bequests being left to Alcor. Would these Alcor members, and their families, simply be "out in the warm," without any recourse, if Alcor were to fail?"

It would be interesting to know how much capital was wasted on legal matters when simple answers would have solved problems...
Isn't it kind of a fundamental law of economics that you can't pay for something out of nothing? Continuing to preserve suspendees incurs ongoing maintenance costs. Do you trust Alcor to plan wisely for those costs? If not, can you devise something better? Or do you believe that regulation could somehow ameliorate this problem

(These are all just thought questions for anyone in general, not aimed at you in particular, TWRelated.)

Alcor has specified priorities that they meet such that they only go after one goal if the goals higher in priority are assured. Continued preservation of existing suspendees is the highest priority. If the funding started to dry up gradually, you would see other activities diminish and vanish before suspendees were threatened. As one of the last resorts, full body suspendees (expensive to maintain) would be converted to neuro (this is in the agreements for all Alcor suspendees) to save costs.

Of course, if funds dry up suddenly, there's probably not much anyone can do, is there?

Some have speculated in the past that if the environment became hostile or the economy unfavorable, neurosuspendees could be easily and discretely portable to other more favorable climes. One of these was Dr. Thomas Donaldson, now presumed neurosuspended at Alcor. Alcor and CI both have patients in their care who began their care under other cryonics organizations, or under no organization at all. It is not impossible that in the event of insolvency Alcor might arrange for transfer of patients at someone else's expense to be stored elsewhere at someone else's expense. The question is not "How can people make Alcor's system foolproof?" The question is "Who do you trust if you want to try this?"

Here's Alcor's priorities for anyone who has never seen them:

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/perpetuating.html

ALCOR'S MISSION: The preservation of individual lives, to be sought through the following prioritized list of fundamentals:

1. Maintain the current patients in biostasis.
2. Place current and future members into biostasis (when and if needed).
3. Eventually restore to health all patients in Alcor's care.
4. Fund research into developing more cost effective and reliable means for 1-3 above.
5. Provide public education as a means of fostering growth to support the goals of 1, 2, 3, 4 above.

Under these priorities they would even stop accepting new patients before thawing existing patients.
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Joined: September 16th, 2010, 2:14 pm

November 18th, 2010, 7:09 pm #7

Has anyone ever specified how the Alcor $80,000-200,000 fee is allotted to preservation?

I know I asked this question before...
I have seen a breakdown before online, but it was probably based on older fees. The largest chunk of that is allocated as a deposit to the patient care trust, I believe.

I will try to keep an eye out for this and post it for you, if I see it again.
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Joined: October 6th, 2004, 6:46 pm

November 18th, 2010, 8:05 pm #8

Alcor's day to day costs may be underfunded, but the patients are well provided for?

Aren't day to day costs part of prolonged patient care?
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Joined: October 6th, 2004, 6:46 pm

November 18th, 2010, 8:14 pm #9

I like her viewpoint in an advisory, not dictatorial, role. I believe grown people can make their own minds up instead of having the government "protect" them. (With the bill footed by people who don't even care.)
How can that be, she's not the head of anything. Just offering an opposing viewpoint.

As I've said, a consumer has more rights with someone who works on their car than they do with someone that cryogenically preserves their human relative.
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Joined: May 17th, 2009, 5:13 pm

November 19th, 2010, 5:23 pm #10

I like Melody's viewpoint. All we hear otherwise is warm sunshine and colorful butterflies.
Seriously, what's the problem with having a positive attitude?
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