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December 27th, 2012, 3:44 am #11

How was your cantatas?
Merry Christmas!!!
Anonymous is still high from his Merry Christmas!

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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 27th, 2012, 4:14 am #12

Rubel Shelly Baptizing Santa.

http://www.piney.com/WinRSSunSanta.html

The problem with most religious teknokrats is that they do not know the meaning of the assembly and do not HAVE to know as long as elders who don't know nor care hire someone who appeals to their own carnal nature.

From BEFORE the Fall Moses was told how to conduct schools of the Word and this was called the qahal, synagogue or Church in the wilderness. This was to quarantine the godly people from the Jacob-cursed and God-condemned and Atchley pattern of the Levites.

The assembly is defined both inclusively and exclusively by the Spirit of Christ in the prophets, made more certain by commands and examples by Jesus, eye and ear witnessed by the Apostles who left us a "memory" of that revelation. That is the INCLUSIVE pattern for both Jew and Gentile thus annulling any Jewish ritual:

Ephesians 2:20 And are built [educated] upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;


The elders are authentic only if they teach that which HAS BEEN TAUGHT and sit down ANYONE who goes beyond that sole teaching resource. Therefore, whatever the value of Christmas it is EXCLUDED by commands, examples or remote inferences from the assembly which is only A School of the Word.

Rubel Shelly: "And when I tell you that Santa has been baptized, I'm echoing the ancient Christian tradition of what one theologian dubbed "baptizing the traditions of secular holidays in the message of God's love that has been revealed in Jesus Christ."

Since the time of Emperor Constantine's conversion to Christ and his order to "Christianize" the pagan feasts,

Christians have been seeking to turn every symbol (mark IDOL) to the glory of God. Thus a midwinter festival to the <font color="#FF0000">S-U-N
was converted into a day of rejoicing over the S-O-N of God. If Jesus is described by biblical writers as the "Sun of Righteousness" and God's "true light coming into the world," what could be more natural?

"Whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him," counseled the Apostle Paul (Col. 3:17).

If any activity, celebration, or feast cannot be immersed in Christ-honoring significance, there is no place for it in our lives. If it can be baptized in or colored with Christian connotation, we would be dishonoring God and cheating ourselves by failing to do so.


"Lucifer and the powers of the air hovering around it... try in vain to tear down the cross and to silence the importunate clangour of the bells. In the Golden Legend Longfellow wrote:

Lucifer Lower! lower!
Hover downward!
Seize the loud vociferous bells, and
Clashing, clanging, to the pavement
Hurl them from their window tower,
Voices. All they thunders
Here are harmless!
Fore these bells have been anointed,
And baptized with holy water!
They defy our utmost power." </font>
You will remember that Steve Flat and Rubel Shelly were co-conspirators in the Jubilee movement. It had as its goal a new style of musical worship, a broader role for women and an inclusive church.

http://www.piney.com/RSReImaging.html

In addition to following Max Lucado's seeing the S.O.N God as the S.U.N God with the need for Levitical singers, Rubel imitated the Methodist Sophia worship which is connected the AGAPE as worship of the triple-goddesses. If you SEE and HEAR them perform they you are FORCED to give attention to those who CLAIM the role of Jesus as "leading you into the presence of God."

Rubel Shelly claimed to have new spectacles through which they were getting a new vision for the church. John Mark Hicks in Come to the Table sold the idea that the Lord's Supper was a sacrificial meal where God ate with the people while they burned the fat with great JUBILATION.

Rubel Shelly also grabbed the feminists-lesbian Methodist Clergy who had trashed Jesus and worshipped Sophia. This fits the pattern of the Agape where MOON HONEY was menstrual blood. He came up with his version of Reimaging the Church of Christ as a take-off of the Methodist Revisioning conferences.

Madison also once had an EASTER tree: that is/was the worship of Ishtar. The women worshipped the abominations painted on the temple walls while the men held their Sun Rise Service. Therefore, there is a long chain connecting the Purpose Driven long range pan to REMOVE Christ off the public confession and USE (as they say) women.



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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

December 27th, 2012, 5:50 am #13

Anonymous is still high from his Merry Christmas!

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Yeah ... sounds like that David Fields [from another location] still high from his very Merry Christmas! [/color]
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December 28th, 2012, 2:17 am #14

You will remember that Steve Flat and Rubel Shelly were co-conspirators in the Jubilee movement. It had as its goal a new style of musical worship, a broader role for women and an inclusive church.

http://www.piney.com/RSReImaging.html

In addition to following Max Lucado's seeing the S.O.N God as the S.U.N God with the need for Levitical singers, Rubel imitated the Methodist Sophia worship which is connected the AGAPE as worship of the triple-goddesses. If you SEE and HEAR them perform they you are FORCED to give attention to those who CLAIM the role of Jesus as "leading you into the presence of God."

Rubel Shelly claimed to have new spectacles through which they were getting a new vision for the church. John Mark Hicks in Come to the Table sold the idea that the Lord's Supper was a sacrificial meal where God ate with the people while they burned the fat with great JUBILATION.

Rubel Shelly also grabbed the feminists-lesbian Methodist Clergy who had trashed Jesus and worshipped Sophia. This fits the pattern of the Agape where MOON HONEY was menstrual blood. He came up with his version of Reimaging the Church of Christ as a take-off of the Methodist Revisioning conferences.

Madison also once had an EASTER tree: that is/was the worship of Ishtar. The women worshipped the abominations painted on the temple walls while the men held their Sun Rise Service. Therefore, there is a long chain connecting the Purpose Driven long range pan to REMOVE Christ off the public confession and USE (as they say) women.



Amalgamation of Christianity with Paganism and its Results
<table><tr><th>-------------Christian Form------------- </th><th>-------------Pagan Practice------------- </th><th>----------Unfortunate Results----------- </th></tr><tr><th>Jesus is the Son of God </th><th>The Corn Mother is God</th><th>Mary is the Mother of God</th></tr><tr><th>Jesus is the Son of God </th><th>The Sun is God</th><th>Jesus is the Sun God</th></tr><tr><th>Church is our Model</th><th>The Community is our Model</th><th>Model the Church after the Community</th></tr><tr><th>We are saved by Grace</th><th>Works do not indicate Salvation</th><th>Grace has nothing to do with Works</th></tr><tr><th>The Church is Unique</th><th>I feel uncomfortable being unique</th><th>Make the church like Everything else</th></tr><tr><th>Congregation likes the preacher</th><th>Elders allow havoc</th><th>Get another preacher</th></tr><tr><th>Church Growth depends on many factors</th><th>There aren't but two salvation issues</th><th>Build the church on two issues</th></tr></table>
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William
William

December 31st, 2012, 1:28 am #15

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Yeah ... sounds like that David Fields [from another location] still high from his very Merry Christmas! [/color]
In many respects, the anti-Christmas arguments are indeed irrelevant.

We are told more about the birth of Jesus, relatively, than many facets of our religion. Many prophecies, and some details in two of the gospels and allusions in John.

If an angel was sent to announce his birth - twice -, it must have been considered important, so why can't I? Isn't this a biblical example?

If the angels sang (or chanted)in celebration of his birth, why can't I? Isn't this a biblical example?

If the "wise men" brought gifts, why can't I memorialize the event? Isn't this a biblical example?

If the shepherds went to worship him at his birth, why can't I memorialize the event? Isn't this a biblical example?

Not either the wise men or the shepherds were there on his birthday, although the shepherds were close.

The calendar on the wall is a pretty modern invention. Who cares what day it was?

Since Zechariah was of the course of Abia we have clues, but nothing very close. Of course it was not the 25th of Dec. However, I have had the privilege of being in Bethlehem on Christmas Eve, and round about there were shepherds, in the rain. I doubt if Judea was as wild in ca. 4 B.C. as in David's time, I am sure that most of the lions and bears were gone by Jesus time, but night or day or hot or cold the flock has to be watched.

Orthodox and Armenian "Christians" do not celebrate on 25th December, but they celebrate.

If it is o.k. for me to have a birthday party for my (fill in blank here)(children, grandchildren, parent, friend), then why can I not have a birthday party for the only one who really matters.

The first big and still somewhat unresolved controversy of Christendom was over the date of Easter, not the birthday. Easter?!! Well, at least the word appears in the KJV.

Is it not wisdom to take a time of celebrating and looking forward to refocus on something that really matters?

Is it not wisdom to take a time of remembering what was joyous and converting it into money? Jesus is probably appalled, and I suspect he would turn the cords of his tunic into a scourge and use it on many, still ...

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B
B

December 31st, 2012, 2:55 am #16

Jesus explicitly told us to remember His death, which we do every first day of the week when we take the Lord's Supper; He never said anything about remembering His birth. Still...men took it upon themselves to remember His birth in a BIG way. Men have always taken it upon themselves to establish things in the name of "Christian doctrine" that Jesus never told us to do.
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B
B

December 31st, 2012, 3:09 am #17

In many respects, the anti-Christmas arguments are indeed irrelevant.

We are told more about the birth of Jesus, relatively, than many facets of our religion. Many prophecies, and some details in two of the gospels and allusions in John.

If an angel was sent to announce his birth - twice -, it must have been considered important, so why can't I? Isn't this a biblical example?

If the angels sang (or chanted)in celebration of his birth, why can't I? Isn't this a biblical example?

If the "wise men" brought gifts, why can't I memorialize the event? Isn't this a biblical example?

If the shepherds went to worship him at his birth, why can't I memorialize the event? Isn't this a biblical example?

Not either the wise men or the shepherds were there on his birthday, although the shepherds were close.

The calendar on the wall is a pretty modern invention. Who cares what day it was?

Since Zechariah was of the course of Abia we have clues, but nothing very close. Of course it was not the 25th of Dec. However, I have had the privilege of being in Bethlehem on Christmas Eve, and round about there were shepherds, in the rain. I doubt if Judea was as wild in ca. 4 B.C. as in David's time, I am sure that most of the lions and bears were gone by Jesus time, but night or day or hot or cold the flock has to be watched.

Orthodox and Armenian "Christians" do not celebrate on 25th December, but they celebrate.

If it is o.k. for me to have a birthday party for my (fill in blank here)(children, grandchildren, parent, friend), then why can I not have a birthday party for the only one who really matters.

The first big and still somewhat unresolved controversy of Christendom was over the date of Easter, not the birthday. Easter?!! Well, at least the word appears in the KJV.

Is it not wisdom to take a time of celebrating and looking forward to refocus on something that really matters?

Is it not wisdom to take a time of remembering what was joyous and converting it into money? Jesus is probably appalled, and I suspect he would turn the cords of his tunic into a scourge and use it on many, still ...
I wouldn't get upset over threads like this. There will always be Christmas naysayers. Every year some television documentary rounds up a bunch of "biblical scholars" who discuss the so-called "myth" of Jesus' birth. They do all they can to turn the story of Jesus' birth in Matthew and Luke into a fairy tale. Still...man keeps celebrating Christmas.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 31st, 2012, 3:10 am #18

Jesus explicitly told us to remember His death, which we do every first day of the week when we take the Lord's Supper; He never said anything about remembering His birth. Still...men took it upon themselves to remember His birth in a BIG way. Men have always taken it upon themselves to establish things in the name of "Christian doctrine" that Jesus never told us to do.
Pagan triads were father, mother, eternally mewling-messing-needing mother infant.

If they can keep Jesus in the manger they do not have to come fact to face with Jesus dying on the cross to PROVE that HE earned the right to be the one and only mediator: no worship teams cannot lead you into the presence of God: that goose-flesh according to the Wimber and Wineskinners is having a climatic experience with the spirit.

http://www.piney.com/VineyardIntimacy.html

That's the ABSOLUTE meaning of Sorcery and the machinery with the most powerful and addictive witchery power was MUSIC. Modern Medicine affirms.

Last edited by Ken.Sublett on December 31st, 2012, 3:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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December 31st, 2012, 4:08 am #19

I wouldn't get upset over threads like this. There will always be Christmas naysayers. Every year some television documentary rounds up a bunch of "biblical scholars" who discuss the so-called "myth" of Jesus' birth. They do all they can to turn the story of Jesus' birth in Matthew and Luke into a fairy tale. Still...man keeps celebrating Christmas.
President's Day is celebrated on George Washington's birthday.

Martin Luther King Day on his birthday.

Christmas is celebrated by some as Jesus' birthday, by others as a secular day.

July 4 as National birthday.

Then we have Halloween which is a macabre type of way remembers death.

Thanksgiving which is more a religious day than a secular day.

As does Easter, which remembers the resurrection, at least by some.

Days to end wars such as Armistice Day, now called Veteran's Day, which remembers Veterans, and not just those who died in service.

Decoration Day became Memorial Day, which honors those who died in service.

So there are some national days, and some a combinations of religious and seculary meanings.

Did I leave anything out? Could you argue that there really is [not] a separation of church from state?
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Anonymous (Dave F.)
Anonymous (Dave F.)

December 31st, 2012, 1:38 pm #20

I don't want to take away from the warm feelings of the holidays, but I do feel a need to enlighten you to the scam called Christmas today. If you do your research, you will be shocked to find that:

December 25 is a pagan holiday. It has nothing to do with Christ's birth. The Devil has played another trick on the sheeple who call themselves Christian. Below is just one story on the internet exposing the fraud. Several preachers on the internet/shortwave have exposed this fact for years. (Search Christmas, Pagan) After all, didn't Jesus say the NARROW IS THE ROAD ...? When will his people wake up to the DEVIL's deceptions? Reading the article below will help you understand my frustrations with December 25 celebration SCAM.

http://www.essortment.com/christmas-pag ... 42543.html

Few people realize that the origins of a form of Christmas was pagan & celebrated in Europe long before anyone there had heard of Jesus Christ.
No one knows on what day Jesus Christ was born. From the biblical description, most historians believe that his birth probably occurred in September, approximately six months after Passover. One thing they agree on is that it is very unlikely that Jesus was born in December, since the bible records shepherds tending their sheep in the fields on that night. This is quite unlikely to have happened during a cold Judean winter. So why do we celebrate Christ's birthday as Christmas, on December the 25th?


The answer lies in the pagan origins of Christmas. In ancient Babylon, the feast of the Son of Isis (Goddess of Nature) was celebrated on December 25. Raucous partying, gluttonous eating and drinking, and gift-giving were traditions of this feast.


In Rome, the Winter Solstice was celebrated many years before the birth of Christ. The Romans called their winter holiday Saturnalia, honoring Saturn, the God of Agriculture. In January, they observed the Kalends of January, which represented the triumph of life over death. This whole season was called Dies Natalis Invicti Solis, the Birthday of the Unconquered Sun. The festival season was marked by much merrymaking. It is in ancient Rome that the tradition of the Mummers was born. The Mummers were groups of costumed singers and dancers who traveled from house to house entertaining their neighbors. From this, the Christmas tradition of caroling was born.


In northern Europe, many other traditions that we now consider part of Christian worship were begun long before the participants had ever heard of Christ. The pagans of northern Europe celebrated the their own winter solstice, known as Yule. Yule was symbolic of the pagan Sun God, Mithras, being born, and was observed on the shortest day of the year. As the Sun God grew and matured, the days became longer and warmer. It was customary to light a candle to encourage Mithras, and the sun, to reappear next year.


Huge Yule logs were burned in honor of the sun. The word Yule itself means "wheel," the wheel being a pagan symbol for the sun. Mistletoe was considered a sacred plant, and the custom of kissing under the mistletoe began as a fertility ritual. Hollyberries were thought to be a food of the gods.


The tree is the one symbol that unites almost all the northern European winter solstices. Live evergreen trees were often brought into homes during the harsh winters as a reminder to inhabitants that soon their crops would grow again. Evergreen boughs were sometimes carried as totems of good luck and were often present at weddings, representing fertility. The Druids used the tree as a religious symbol, holding their sacred ceremonies while surrounding and worshipping huge trees.


In 350, Pope Julius I declared that Christ's birth would be celebrated on December 25. There is little doubt that he was trying to make it as painless as possible for pagan Romans (who remained a majority at that time) to convert to Christianity. The new religion went down a bit easier, knowing that their feasts would not be taken away from them.


Christmas (Christ-Mass) as we know it today, most historians agree, began in Germany, though Catholics and Lutherans still disagree about which church celebrated it first. The earliest record of an evergreen being decorated in a Christian celebration was in 1521 in the Alsace region of Germany. A prominent Lutheran minister of the day cried blasphemy: "Better that they should look to the true tree of life, Christ."


The controversy continues even today in some fundamentalist sects.
No cantatas???


+++++++++++++++++++

"Words of wisdom" from David Fields -- that one.
Last edited by Donnie.Cruz on December 31st, 2012, 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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