Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

July 5th, 2011, 5:06 pm #11

Hymn is like prayer: we SPEAK in the Gree and Latin.

If you want to do four-part-fanny with one of the few Biblical hymns as a FAMILY affair and the GO OUT and return again at the next appointed time of the year, I can buy that.

The other reasson paul is using antithetical parallelism since he does no want you to hoot like owls or enchant is that psallo is a SMITING with your finger and SHOOTING you in the heart and shootiing love arrows with your lyre. Means HOLD the vocal souns: hold the shooting out hurtful things!



Psallo is NEVER use to Play A Harp in any Greek literature: it just means SMITE with your fingers and NEVER with a plectrum. It only includes the DESTRUCTIVE influence: they shot out hymns and made the heart strings sing but MUSICAL MELODY has several words Paul could have used. By using ANTITHESIS he was pretty sure that you would not try to SPEAK and SING AT the same time.

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Dave
Dave

July 5th, 2011, 9:49 pm #12

Matthew 26:30 And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.

http://www.piney.com/Matthew.26.Sung.Hymn.Went.Out.html

Or maybe not. Those willing to sow discord and damage God's children by appealing to often one-time events and then conduct what they call a worship service (service means hard bondage) prove that they cannot define "disciple" or "ekklesia."

The command for the church was to PREACH the word of god by READING IT. Paul issued this command to timothy including defining any doctrinal content and using Scripture to comfort one another. That simple "pattern" is repeated so many times to prove why Jesus didn't speak to the clergy without parables and Paul's letters are set-ups to fool the foolish who USE them rather than

Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them,
.....Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem,
..... be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

Acts 13:27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers,
.....because they knew him not,
..... nor yet the voices of the prophets
.....which are read every sabbath day,
.....they have fulfilled them in condemning him.

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city
..... them that preach him,
.....being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read,
.....ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Colossians 4:16 And when this epistle is read among you,
.....cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans;
.....and that ye likewise read the epistle from Laodicea.

1Thessalonians 5:27 I charge you by the Lord
.....that this epistle be read unto all the holy brethren.

1Timothy 4:13 Till I come, give attendance to [public] reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.

Revelation 5:4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy
.....to open and to read the book
.....neither to look thereon.

Too bad that God was not competent to define HOW He wanted His inspired message delivered to the churches.
William, I do understand. My message is true, so what else can you attack?
You go right ahead, but SHPULD you do it?

SHPULD you?

How could you miss that one if you use a spell check? I don't use one. Can't you tell William? So what is your excuse?


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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

July 6th, 2011, 4:47 am #13

Dave, I'm a bit worried about you. Hmmmm... Since you keep typing "SHPULD," I wonder if, indeed, your craving for the dope has affected your vision. Maybe you SHOULD have your eyes checked; or better yet, lay off the dope.
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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

July 6th, 2011, 5:04 am #14

William, I do understand. My message is true, so what else can you attack?
You go right ahead, but SHPULD you do it?

SHPULD you?

How could you miss that one if you use a spell check? I don't use one. Can't you tell William? So what is your excuse?

Dave wrote:

Do the Dance
July 5 2011, 8:51 AM

Keep dancing boys, but when the Word says that Jesus sung, it is good enough for me.
And YES, Ken, and Donnie, Ephesians 5:19 is a command to sing to one another (meaning vibration of the vocal cords)....

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Dave is confusing events and occurrences with commands and directives:

This is an EVENT: "[41] Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover." (Luke 2)

This is an EVENT: "[30] And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives." (Matt. 26)

This is an EVENT: "[25] And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang praises unto God: and the prisoners heard them." (Acts 16)

This is an EVENT: "[3] And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb...." (Rev. 15)

This is a COMMAND: "[17] Pray without ceasing." (I Thess. 5)

This is a COMMAND: "[22] Abstain from all appearance of evil." (I Thess. 5:22)

This is a COMMAND: "[19] Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out...." (Acts 3)

A VERY IMPORTANT NOTE FOR DAVE: There is not a single event or occurrence in the New Testament during which the NT Christians ever operated musical devices in the gathering of saints. There is NO COMMAND to play any kind of musical instrument when NT believers gather to "teach and admonish one another" and to "let the word of Christ dwell in you richly."[/color]
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Dr.Bill Crump
Dr.Bill Crump

July 6th, 2011, 12:46 pm #15

William, I do understand. My message is true, so what else can you attack?
You go right ahead, but SHPULD you do it?

SHPULD you?

How could you miss that one if you use a spell check? I don't use one. Can't you tell William? So what is your excuse?

Dave, I'm a bit worried about you, because you continue to write "SHPULD" over and over. As you may recall, that's perseveration. At first I naturally thought you didn't know how to spell, but I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt: perhaps you have an eye problem. Is your eyesight blurred or impaired in some way that you can't clearly see your keypad? Maybe you SHOULD have your eyes examined.
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R*
R*

July 6th, 2011, 2:41 pm #16

Dave wrote:

Do the Dance
July 5 2011, 8:51 AM

Keep dancing boys, but when the Word says that Jesus sung, it is good enough for me.
And YES, Ken, and Donnie, Ephesians 5:19 is a command to sing to one another (meaning vibration of the vocal cords)....

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Dave is confusing events and occurrences with commands and directives:

This is an EVENT: "[41] Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover." (Luke 2)

This is an EVENT: "[30] And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives." (Matt. 26)

This is an EVENT: "[25] And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang praises unto God: and the prisoners heard them." (Acts 16)

This is an EVENT: "[3] And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb...." (Rev. 15)

This is a COMMAND: "[17] Pray without ceasing." (I Thess. 5)

This is a COMMAND: "[22] Abstain from all appearance of evil." (I Thess. 5:22)

This is a COMMAND: "[19] Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out...." (Acts 3)

A VERY IMPORTANT NOTE FOR DAVE: There is not a single event or occurrence in the New Testament during which the NT Christians ever operated musical devices in the gathering of saints. There is NO COMMAND to play any kind of musical instrument when NT believers gather to "teach and admonish one another" and to "let the word of Christ dwell in you richly."[/color]
Donnie, where are we going with this? Are you saying we are commanded to sing only in our hearts?
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

July 6th, 2011, 4:24 pm #17

Matthew 26:30 And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.

http://www.piney.com/Matthew.26.Sung.Hymn.Went.Out.html

Or maybe not. Those willing to sow discord and damage God's children by appealing to often one-time events and then conduct what they call a worship service (service means hard bondage) prove that they cannot define "disciple" or "ekklesia."

The command for the church was to PREACH the word of god by READING IT. Paul issued this command to timothy including defining any doctrinal content and using Scripture to comfort one another. That simple "pattern" is repeated so many times to prove why Jesus didn't speak to the clergy without parables and Paul's letters are set-ups to fool the foolish who USE them rather than

Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them,
.....Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem,
..... be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

Acts 13:27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers,
.....because they knew him not,
..... nor yet the voices of the prophets
.....which are read every sabbath day,
.....they have fulfilled them in condemning him.

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city
..... them that preach him,
.....being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read,
.....ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Colossians 4:16 And when this epistle is read among you,
.....cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans;
.....and that ye likewise read the epistle from Laodicea.

1Thessalonians 5:27 I charge you by the Lord
.....that this epistle be read unto all the holy brethren.

1Timothy 4:13 Till I come, give attendance to [public] reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.

Revelation 5:4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy
.....to open and to read the book
.....neither to look thereon.

Too bad that God was not competent to define HOW He wanted His inspired message delivered to the churches.
Praise singing hit the "fans" post Jubilee and Rubel Shelly: as part of a small body of changelings they decreed that CHURCH IS ONLY ABOUT WORSHIP and they defined "worship" in terms of music. That led simple congregational singing to performance singing with everyone racing to "sang my part." This, in turn, was an instrumental form of singing called a cappella or Organum--imitation of the pipe organ.

Of course, they had nevver read any of the Bible which makes the assembly as a Teaching the Word of God Only assembly which read and rehearsed or mutually confessed the Word of Christ in the Prophets and Apostles. Anyone who has ever read Ephesians 3 wouldl understand that:

WHAT IS THIS GRACE?

Eph. 3:6 That the Gentiles
......should be fellowheirs,
......and of the same body,
......and partakers of his promise in Christ
......by THE gospel:
Eph. 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister,
......according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me
......by the effectual working of his power.

TO WHOM IS THIS SAME GRACE EXPANDED.

Eph. 3:8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints,
......is this grace given,
......that I should preach among the Gentiles
......the unsearchable riches of Christ;
Eph. 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery,
......which from the beginning of the world
......hath been hid in God,
......who created all things by Jesus Christ:
Eph. 3:10 To the intent that now
......unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places
......might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
Eph. 3:11 According to the eternal purpose
......which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
Eph. 3:12 In whom we have boldness and access
......with confidence by the faith OF him.

Paul then sets up the SAME role of the church as in Ephesians 5:


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R*
R*

July 6th, 2011, 4:51 pm #18

Dave, I'm a bit worried about you, because you continue to write "SHPULD" over and over. As you may recall, that's perseveration. At first I naturally thought you didn't know how to spell, but I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt: perhaps you have an eye problem. Is your eyesight blurred or impaired in some way that you can't clearly see your keypad? Maybe you SHOULD have your eyes examined.
I'm glad Dr. Crump cares so much about our grammar mistakes! This "shpuld" make your day, Bill.



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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

July 6th, 2011, 4:55 pm #19

Donnie, where are we going with this? Are you saying we are commanded to sing only in our hearts?
I don't believe R* is obtuse, although he may feign obtuseness for comedic purposes. As Ephesians 5:19 clearly states, we are to sing (obviously using our physical voices) and make melody in our hearts. No musical instruments are even mentioned. The true melody that accompanies our singing is to be made in our hearts. It's not that difficult to understand; however, those who deliberately choose to be obtuse will make it unnecessarily difficult.
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R*
R*

July 6th, 2011, 5:49 pm #20

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]R*:

Just a few brief comments:

1. Who's said that singing is wrong? Provide an exact quote.
2. Is there a difference between "sing" and "sing to one another"?
3. Can you find a scripture where "sing" is a command?
4. Can you find a scripture where "sing to one another" is a command?
5. Can you find examples of those who "sang" although "sing" was not a command?

Please note the usage of each word or expression stated above: (a) sing, (b) singing, (c) sang, (d) sing to one another, (e) sang to one another.

Ken is correct in asserting that there is no direct command to "sing one to another" [be careful about this expression] found in Scripture as a command to NT believers. I haven't found one. Maybe it's been overlooked [didn't search well enough].

Would you immediately inform us when you find such a direct command as "sing one to another"?[/color]
I must first say that I have a lot of respect for Ken. He is very well educated and a great guy. I think he told me he lived in NW Alabama at one time. On the other hand, I am not nearly as educated as Ken on the Bible. The problem I have is understanding what Ken writes sometimes. I become frustrated and become short with Ken. That's my bad. I'm picking it out. Please drive on!
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