The Law of Silence: Two Views: The intoxicating New Wineskin heresy.

The Law of Silence: Two Views: The intoxicating New Wineskin heresy.

Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

May 24th, 2012, 2:34 am #1

God does not speak to the wise or Sophists: Scribes and Pharisees, Hypocrites named by Christ in Ezekiel 33 as self-speakers, singers and instrument players. God IS silent because Jesus said that God HIDES from them. God sends them strong delusions and makes them foolish

http://www.piney.com/Isaiah.57.The.Law.odddf Silence.html

http://www.piney.com/CENI.Commands.Exam ... ences.html





The Spirit OF [preposition] Christ defined the future Ekklesia or Church of Christ both inclusively and exclusively in the prophets. In Isaiah 57

http://www.piney.com/Isaiah.57.The.Law.of.Silence.html

In Isaiah 50 Christ defined the future MOCKING and SMITING of Messiah in a musical sense by the Levites

http://www.piney.com/Isaiah.50.Smitten.Plucked.html

In Isaiah 55 Christ outlawed spending ou money for the Free Water of the Word. Beginning in the wilderness the only ROLE is to read the word for its' comfort and doctrine. Equating the Word and Spirit is universal.

http://www.piney.com/Isaiah.55.Word.Spirit.html

In Isaiah 58 Christ outlawed speaking our own words or seeking our own pleasure.

http://www.piney.com/Isaiah.58.html

That doesn't prevent Rick Atchley from using buffoonery to mock the Law of Silence.
2. Since honoring the commands of Christ for the future reign of Christ defined inclusively and exclusively to MARK those who mock His word.
3. The Spirit OF Christ in Jeremiah 23 says that is blaspheming the Holy Spirit of Christ

http://www.piney.com/Rick.Atchley.Law.of.Silence.html







The New Wineskins Magazine builds on the foundation of Al Maxey, Edward Fudge and others. This was part of the Jubilee movement--from Nashville a city set on seven hills--when Rubel Shelly, Max Lucado, Rick Atchley and others thought the time was right to RESTRUCTURE all Churches of Christ into defacto Christian Churches or Baptist Churches.

http://www.piney.com/New.Winskins.Magazine.html

H. Leo Boles proving that the Christian Church invented the Law of Silence.

http://www.piney.com/Unity.Boles.html

Boles:
"Areas of silence," "liberty of opinion," and "the realm of expediency" are trite phrases used by leaders in the "Christian Church" and have been coined and put on a par with the teachings of the New Testament. It is just another way of saying that the opinions of men may guide the people of God, and that some of the people of God should submit to the opinions of men. There was unity with God's people so long as they respected the slogan, "Where the scriptures speak, we speak; and where the scriptures are silent, we are silent"; but when brethren began to claim the authority to speak where the New Testament is silent, and impose their opinions upon other brethren, division and separation were the inevitable results.

W.R. Walker, in Christian Standard, May 27, 1939, said: "There are two areas in our religious living in which the authority of Christ must be recognized. The first embraces all his teaching and that of his inspired followers, the `vocal area' ; but there is another area, the `area of silence."' He further said:

"I am persuaded that Christ has authority in the `areas of silence.'
Christ, by his silence, in every situation concerning which
he has left no direct teaching,
has bestowed on me this authority to act for myself."


Boles: Here are the two standards or rules recognized
.....by many in the "Christian Church,"
..........namely, that of "walking by faith,"
..........and that of "walking by opinion."

W.R. Walker calls the opinions of man in the "areas of silence" "the authority of Christ." This is tantamount to saying that man's opinions in the "areas of silence" are of equal force with the word of God.

I join issue with him on this point. There can be no unity in the "area of silence," as there can be no unity on opinions when each man claims the authority to do what is right in his own eyes. This would violate every scripture that God has given instructing his people to be "of the same mind, the same judgment of one accord."

Last edited by Ken.Sublett on August 1st, 2013, 1:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

May 24th, 2012, 3:32 am #2

The Jesus Proposal: Rubel Shelly and John York

http://www.piney.com/Jesus.Proposal.Book.html

Rubel Shelly and John York in the Jesus Proposal: [p. 114] Our proposal to focus on Jesus means that Scripture is NO LONGER a set of proof-texts or a collection of facts or God's rulebook for human behavior. Scripture is the unfolding story of God acting both to create and to re-create. It is not an easy book to understand.

It was NEVER intended as a document to [p. 115] be INDIVIDUALLY read and interpreted--a sort-of correspondence course in salvation.

As we go to the cradle only in order to find the baby, so we go to the Scriptures ONLY to find Christ. Martin Luther. For thousands of years it could only be heard and interpreted in the context of community.

Yes, INDIVIDUALS could comment on Scripture, but those comments were always for the LARGER hearing of the community.Only after there was INDIVIDUAL access did there become an opportunity for an individual, isolated reading and interpretation that had no need or use for community.

Just as identity in Christ is always COMMUNITY identity,our reading of Scripture becomes a COMMUNITY READING as well.

While we still have access to reading as individuals,we stop asking, "What does this mean to me?"--as though there is such an isolated meaning. Instead we have a GROUP MENTALITY that asks, "What does this mean to US?"we lay aside INDIVIDUAL interpretations precisely because they are inevitably argumentative and divisive.

We GIVE UP the right of individual interpretation and take on the accountability of SHARED READING. This is not a pooling of collective ignorance. The Bible is full of stories from ancient and often quite alien cultural settings and belief systems, and we cannot ignore those differences. So we listen to the voices of scholarship just as we listen to the child who intuitively hears what God is saying in a particular story.


"Liberal literary criticism allows each community the right to re-write Scripture. The canon (not necessarily of biblical texts, but at least in the meanings of those texts) is not closed.

"It is difficult to know whether Fish intended this as a by-product, but the idea of authority resting in the interpretive community gave rise to narrative theology-- a theology which simply affirms a given community's right to come up with its own interpretation, or to "write" its own new biblical text. Narrative theology gave rise to various narrative communities-- hence, the arrival of liberation and feminist theologies.

"Narrative theology does not recognize any absolute truth or meaning in a text. Because Buber is the founder, most narrative theology, especially in Jewish circles, is related to Auschwitz."

"And, what is the purpose of reading texts, for narrative theologians? Why, of course, to affirm the self. Hazards in the Mainline.
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Anonymous
Anonymous

May 24th, 2012, 5:47 am #3

....and he's off on another tangent. Yet the question remains, "When did God ever reveal truth by saying absolutely nothing?" Silence does not prohibit nor permit. <em>Specificity</em> permits or prohibits.
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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

May 24th, 2012, 6:33 am #4

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]When?

It's when God directed His followers to do "as it is spoken":[/color]
  • "God spake unto Noah...."
    </li>
  • "God spake unto Moses...."
    </li>
  • "Hear ye the word which the LORD speaketh unto you..." (Jer. 10:1)
    </li>
  • "Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel..." (Jer. 28:2)
    </li>
  • "... as the voice of the Almighty God when he speaketh..." (Ezek. 10:5)
    </li>
  • "For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God..." (John 3:34)
    </li>
[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]It's when God directed His followers to do "as it is written":[/color]
  • "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy." (I Pet. 1:16)
    </li>
  • "For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God." (Rom. 14:11)
    </li>
  • "... for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord." (Rom. 12:19)
    </li>
  • "... as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace...." (Rom. 10:15)
    </li>
  • "... as it is written, The just shall live by faith." (Rom. 1:17)
    </li>
  • "Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer..." (Luke 24:46)
    </li>
  • Teach and admonish one another in ... songs -- that is in Scripture
    </li>
  • The conversion process or pattern is written in Scripture
    </li>
  • The pattern for observance of the Lord's Supper is written in Scripture
    </li>
  • The pattern for church leadership is written in Scripture
    </li>
[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]When God has said "absolutely nothing" about something, then His followers must respect that.

The argument that God actually thought about directing His followers to use musical devices and other accessories in the assembly of saints, but He just failed or forgot to put it in writing[/color] ...

... is fallacious and ludicrous.
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Joined: February 16th, 2012, 8:07 pm

May 24th, 2012, 6:58 am #5

<em>The argument that God actually thought about directing His followers to use musical devices and other accessories in the assembly of saints, but He just failed or forgot to put it in writing ...

... is fallacious and ludicrous.</em>

You're absolutely right. I don't know anyone who has made that argument; I certainly never have.I don't even know why you bring it up.
When God prohibits something, He is always very specific about it. Jesus didn't have to forbid the practice of witchcraft and sorcery because God had <em>already</em> spoken to it (see Leviticus 19:26).
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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

May 24th, 2012, 7:25 am #6

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Here are my observations from your response:

-- That you didn't understand the title of my post about worship of Mary
-- That you agree with the Roman Catholics about praying to Mary
-- That you agree with several RCC heresies because God did not say "not to"
-- That you agree that God had intended to direct His followers to use the trumpet, the drums ...
-- ... but that God had a memory lapse -- forgot to put it in writing

God deserves better respect than that from you -- simply refrain from making up something not mentioned in Scripture ... and call it God's directive. [/color]
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Joined: February 16th, 2012, 8:07 pm

May 24th, 2012, 9:34 am #7

Donnie, you are reading your own prejudices into my responses. Give me a break, man, you're not that stupid. Grow up.
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Joined: February 16th, 2012, 8:07 pm

May 24th, 2012, 9:36 am #8

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Here are my observations from your response:

-- That you didn't understand the title of my post about worship of Mary
-- That you agree with the Roman Catholics about praying to Mary
-- That you agree with several RCC heresies because God did not say "not to"
-- That you agree that God had intended to direct His followers to use the trumpet, the drums ...
-- ... but that God had a memory lapse -- forgot to put it in writing

God deserves better respect than that from you -- simply refrain from making up something not mentioned in Scripture ... and call it God's directive. [/color]
Donnie, you are reading your own prejudices into my responses. Give me a break, man, you're not that stupid. Grow up. If you are going to dialogue with me, be honest at least.
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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

May 25th, 2012, 12:42 am #9

[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Brian,

So, refute my "own prejudices."

Let me illustrate and simplify my understanding of YOUR LOGIC that the law of silence is not prohibitive:[/color]
<ol>[*][color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]Scripture does not specify this prohibition: "Thou shalt not worship Mary, 'Mother of God.'"[/color]
</li>[*][color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]You argue that silence of Scripture is not prohibitive.[/color]
</li>[*][color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]You argue that silence of Scripture does not prohibit instrumental music[/color]
</li>[*][color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]It follows your logic that Scripture does not prohibit both "Mary" and "IM"[/color]
</li>[*][color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]It further follows your logic that if it's OK to worship with musical devices...[/color]
</li>[*][color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]It further follows your logic also that it's OK to worship Mary, "Mother of God."[/color]</li>[/list]
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B
B

May 25th, 2012, 1:34 am #10

It seems that many people today prefer a type of "pseudo-Christianity" based on what God/Jesus DOESN'T say rather than on what He EXPLICITLY SAYS. People who are basically dissatisfied with New Testament Christianity are all too eager to take explicit doctrines addressed in the New Testament and add anything and everything to them, based on the fallacious notion of "God didn't say not to."

There is nothing in the New Testament that states God's silence is permissive or not prohibitive. That is man's rash and hasty assumption. There is nothing in the New Testament that states "God didn't say not to." That is man's rash and hasty assumption.

"If ye love me, keep my commandments" (John 14:15 KJV). Notice that Jesus DOES NOT SAY, "If ye love me, ye may do anything that I have not forbidden."

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven" (Matt. 7:21 KJV). Notice that Jesus DOES NOT SAY, Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth all that the will of my Father which is in heaven has not forbidden."

"And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?" (Luke 6:46). Notice that Jesus DOES NOT SAY, "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I have not forbidden?"

Dissatisfaction and desperation drive many "Christians" to play around with and pollute the New Testament to satisfy their own personal desires.

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