Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 2nd, 2016, 1:06 am #21

There are many parallels to the NEVER MUSICAL passages which in fact OUTLAW making melody WITH a harp. I will post Romans 15 which is the same as the Spirit OF Christ in Isaiah 58 etc.

It is amoral and beyond redemption to say that God COMMANDS instrumental praise and be purpose driven to sow discord to force the issue when there is no command, example or remote inference of group singing with or without instruments. We grownups do not do that even with a law if we are sincere that we are Disciples of Christ.
Last edited by Ken.Sublett on April 2nd, 2016, 1:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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April 2nd, 2016, 3:24 pm #22

Glad you both pointed out those scriptures. I really just didn't know what to do, glad I have godly people to help me!


Galatians 5:7-12(NIV)

7 You were running a good race. Who cut in on you to keep you from obeying the truth? 8 That kind of persuasion does not come from the one who calls you. 9 “A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough.” 10 I am confident in the Lord that you will take no other view. The one who is throwing you into confusion, whoever that may be, will have to pay the penalty. 11 Brothers and sisters, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished. 12 As for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 2nd, 2016, 3:59 pm #23

The lack of teaching on such themes as marriage, honesty in daily living, sexual morality, duties to fellow man has had a dreadful effect on faithfulness not only to Christ but to the Church.

This is especially obvious when we analyze the teachings from the pulpit. The obsession with grace, to the ignoring of the workmanship of the Christian (See Ephesians 2:8-11), has led to latitudinal behavior and a pathetic answer to "Why would Jesus do?" (WWJD). Clearly the passage says that if we are "saved by grace through faith" that we are the workmanship of God.

It is also obvious when we examine our worship hymns. They are usually devoid of moral teaching. In this way, the modern worship service is a "golden calf," with us admiring the gold, but we have a calf instead of a moral God.

The continual emphasis on "fruits of the spirit" with a complete ignoring of the "works of the flesh" has become a disgrace to those who really want to realign their lives along Christian virtues. See Galatians 5:16-26.

The church worshipper comes away from worship "thirsty." Jesus said that he was the water of life.

John 4:13 Jesus answered, “Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14 but whoever drinks the water I give them will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give them will become in them a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

Isn't it about time we left the elemental teachings and are ready for meat of the word. Hebrews 6:1-3.

Simplistic teaching leads many to leave the church to search for some better instructions about how to lead their lives.
I agree but remember that elders are restricted to "teaching that which has been taught" so if they do not then you have more right than they. Paul silenced BOTH male and female other than the one-piece pattern "so that WE might all be saved (kept safe) and "come to a knowledge of the truth." That is the one-piece pattern: anything else is cultish.

If you look around you will find people their Hannukah is called Hyakinthia the beloved in light. This is the Hyacinthus below. Jesus refuted all of the Jewish festivals for instance by saying I AM THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD. The Babylon Talmud ooozing into some colleges and churches is part of the amorality. God turned the Jews over to worship the starry host (acts 7) because of instrumental-trinitarian idolatry. This is the MARK of all of the musical worship teams which get marked up pretty severely.

As we know from myth, Apollon with his disc (ie the sun) accidentally struck Hyakinthos, and the paian was believed to have been part of his attempts to bring back the youth and save him from mortal death. For this reason the paian is particularly important during this festival, most especially on this day as far as I see it. Heliguennia on the other hand marks the longest day of the year, when the light of the sun is utterly victorious over the night. Thus we celebrate Helios Eleutherios, Helios the god who is freeing, for the sun it at the very pinnacle of its strength today.

Rubel Shelly and Lucado want us to begin thinking of the S.O.N god as the S.U.N.

Last edited by Ken.Sublett on April 2nd, 2016, 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 2nd, 2016, 5:53 pm #24

The lack of teaching on such themes as marriage, honesty in daily living, sexual morality, duties to fellow man has had a dreadful effect on faithfulness not only to Christ but to the Church.

This is especially obvious when we analyze the teachings from the pulpit. The obsession with grace, to the ignoring of the workmanship of the Christian (See Ephesians 2:8-11), has led to latitudinal behavior and a pathetic answer to "Why would Jesus do?" (WWJD). Clearly the passage says that if we are "saved by grace through faith" that we are the workmanship of God.

It is also obvious when we examine our worship hymns. They are usually devoid of moral teaching. In this way, the modern worship service is a "golden calf," with us admiring the gold, but we have a calf instead of a moral God.

The continual emphasis on "fruits of the spirit" with a complete ignoring of the "works of the flesh" has become a disgrace to those who really want to realign their lives along Christian virtues. See Galatians 5:16-26.

The church worshipper comes away from worship "thirsty." Jesus said that he was the water of life.

John 4:13 Jesus answered, “Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14 but whoever drinks the water I give them will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give them will become in them a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

Isn't it about time we left the elemental teachings and are ready for meat of the word. Hebrews 6:1-3.

Simplistic teaching leads many to leave the church to search for some better instructions about how to lead their lives.
Romans 14 outlaws any doubtful disputation which does not edify or educate. It is always necessary to refute the common pagan views which included the Jews after they were turned over to worship the starry host.

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Joined: February 11th, 2016, 11:16 pm

April 2nd, 2016, 7:17 pm #25

When I was young I remember people at church talking about Rock and Roll, and they would say that it was "devil music". I couldn't figure out why, and no one seemed to be able to explain why. Since coming to this site and Piney.com, I now have an answer. Also, I had questions about certain verses, and what did they refer to:

How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the Lord is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain. (‭Jeremiah‬ ‭8‬:‭8‬ KJV)
What were they lying or vain about?
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. (‭John‬ ‭4‬:‭24‬ KJV)
Why do we worship God with our physical bodies, in the assembly?
Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? (‭Acts‬ ‭7‬:‭48-49‬ KJV)
What does this mean and why did Soloman build a temple?


There were many other questions I had, and now I have a better understanding. I'm still a disciple and have much to learn.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 2nd, 2016, 10:09 pm #26

A Christian is a DISCIPLE. A Disciple is a STUDENT. Jesus said go make DISCIPLES. He did not say GO but build houses by human hands so you can WORSHIP with the WORKS of human hands. The unique, well defined worship concept from the Church in the wilderness is to give your attention to READING the Word for doctrine and Comfort.

A musical instrument is a machine for doing hard work (ERGON) or to enable WRATH or and ORGE.

Jesus said that was the Little Flock the Father had given Him OUT OF the World order.
It IS SECTARIAN: It is the WAY that is called a SECT or a Road very narrow and fools cannot even stumble into it.

I really became a student when I used to skip out when the preacher began self exhibiting and speaking out of his own head or "out of his head speaking."

what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? (‭Acts‬ ‭7‬:‭48-49‬ KJV)

People with a Phd in Bible and the Head of the Bible department and preachers can fleece the flock so we CAN BUILD A HOUSE TO WORSHIP GOD and, I insist, CANNOT grasp that verse.

Isn't that the spookiest thing you ever heard?


Last edited by Ken.Sublett on April 2nd, 2016, 10:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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April 3rd, 2016, 2:14 pm #27

When I was young I remember people at church talking about Rock and Roll, and they would say that it was "devil music". I couldn't figure out why, and no one seemed to be able to explain why. Since coming to this site and Piney.com, I now have an answer. Also, I had questions about certain verses, and what did they refer to:

How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the Lord is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain. (‭Jeremiah‬ ‭8‬:‭8‬ KJV)
What were they lying or vain about?
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. (‭John‬ ‭4‬:‭24‬ KJV)
Why do we worship God with our physical bodies, in the assembly?
Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? (‭Acts‬ ‭7‬:‭48-49‬ KJV)
What does this mean and why did Soloman build a temple?


There were many other questions I had, and now I have a better understanding. I'm still a disciple and have much to learn.


2 Timothy 4:3-4 (NIV)

3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 3rd, 2016, 4:08 pm #28

The lack of teaching on such themes as marriage, honesty in daily living, sexual morality, duties to fellow man has had a dreadful effect on faithfulness not only to Christ but to the Church.

This is especially obvious when we analyze the teachings from the pulpit. The obsession with grace, to the ignoring of the workmanship of the Christian (See Ephesians 2:8-11), has led to latitudinal behavior and a pathetic answer to "Why would Jesus do?" (WWJD). Clearly the passage says that if we are "saved by grace through faith" that we are the workmanship of God.

It is also obvious when we examine our worship hymns. They are usually devoid of moral teaching. In this way, the modern worship service is a "golden calf," with us admiring the gold, but we have a calf instead of a moral God.

The continual emphasis on "fruits of the spirit" with a complete ignoring of the "works of the flesh" has become a disgrace to those who really want to realign their lives along Christian virtues. See Galatians 5:16-26.

The church worshipper comes away from worship "thirsty." Jesus said that he was the water of life.

John 4:13 Jesus answered, “Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14 but whoever drinks the water I give them will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give them will become in them a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

Isn't it about time we left the elemental teachings and are ready for meat of the word. Hebrews 6:1-3.

Simplistic teaching leads many to leave the church to search for some better instructions about how to lead their lives.
The self-pleasure outlawed in Romans 14-15 so we can USE ONE MIND AND ONE MOUTH TO SPEAK THAT WHICH IS WRITTEN FOR OUR LEARNING IS THE SCENIC OR SELF-EXHIBITION which is defined by the Greeks and Paul as selling your body at retail.


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Joined: February 11th, 2016, 11:16 pm

April 3rd, 2016, 6:14 pm #29



2 Timothy 4:3-4 (NIV)

3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. (‭Philippians‬ ‭2‬:‭12‬ KJV)

I make mistakes, but I'm not too arrogant or proud to not go back and correct them. I know when I hear fluff and when I hear the gospel being preached. I love The Lord, and want nothing more but to do his will. I will let no man or woman intimidate me away from the truth. I also love my fellow believers and my enemies. I forgive all men, as The Lord has forgiven me.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. (‭Ephesians‬ ‭6‬:‭12‬ KJV)
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 3rd, 2016, 7:43 pm #30

The lack of teaching on such themes as marriage, honesty in daily living, sexual morality, duties to fellow man has had a dreadful effect on faithfulness not only to Christ but to the Church.

This is especially obvious when we analyze the teachings from the pulpit. The obsession with grace, to the ignoring of the workmanship of the Christian (See Ephesians 2:8-11), has led to latitudinal behavior and a pathetic answer to "Why would Jesus do?" (WWJD). Clearly the passage says that if we are "saved by grace through faith" that we are the workmanship of God.

It is also obvious when we examine our worship hymns. They are usually devoid of moral teaching. In this way, the modern worship service is a "golden calf," with us admiring the gold, but we have a calf instead of a moral God.

The continual emphasis on "fruits of the spirit" with a complete ignoring of the "works of the flesh" has become a disgrace to those who really want to realign their lives along Christian virtues. See Galatians 5:16-26.

The church worshipper comes away from worship "thirsty." Jesus said that he was the water of life.

John 4:13 Jesus answered, “Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14 but whoever drinks the water I give them will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give them will become in them a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

Isn't it about time we left the elemental teachings and are ready for meat of the word. Hebrews 6:1-3.

Simplistic teaching leads many to leave the church to search for some better instructions about how to lead their lives.
Before the fall from grace because of instrumental and trinitarian idolatry, the people had stopped listening to God and demanded that Moses be their mediator. Moses and Paul in 2 Cor 3 said that they would be blind and deaf until ANOTHR PROPHET LIKE ME COMES. Both Moses and Jesus were Elohim in the sense of being rulers: Jesus was a Prophet, Priest and King.

The leaders of the tribes were not religious leaders.

Moses described a system for the EDUCATION and guidance of very small groups: these were vocational.

Jesus just flat forgot to define anyone beyond the elders as pastor-teachers. A pastor teaches the lambs and never gets violent with them. FEEDING is the only purpose of a local assembly. The absolute pattern commanded, exampled, inferred and practiced was that the people ASSEMBLED THEMSELVES with the CENI to Preach the Word by Reading the Word. Paul places the discipline upon the leaders who refuse to teach the Word as the limit of their ruling and disciples listen to the Word and watch the outcome of the Shepherd's life. The elders of the civil and religious synagogue and ekklesia did not reach beyond thee assembly.

Notice that this is still under the Patriarchal dispensation when the RESOURCE was The Book of The Covenant which had no "worship gatherings" beyond "being a blessing to all nations."

The lambs almost never sow discord.



<font face="arial" size="4">The groups of 10 define the synagogue where 10 heads of households gathered in their local area to hear the word PREACHED by being READ. There was no Law of Moses or Laws of the God-abandoned Kings set over us existed as the end of the road for the Jews. These local assemblies were not permitted to use any teaching resource which had not been WRITTEN in the Book of the Covenant and Later what Moses handed down as inspired.
</font>
Last edited by Ken.Sublett on April 3rd, 2016, 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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