Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

January 10th, 2016, 6:25 am #31

Donnie, when you say "Hopefully, the Christian is aware that "THE Holy Spirit" (definite article THE) belongs to God only. Again, God's Spirit is not another "person" and it belongs to Him only.
Hopefully, the Christian is aware that he receives a holy spirit (pure conscience) at baptism and strives to maintain a spirit that is holy and pure throughout his Christian living."

The Christian is aware that YOU are trying to change the very Word of God. The Scriptures SAY in Acts 2:38 that we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit not the gift of A holy spirit.

The Christian also knows that that YOU are shortchanging yourself when you don'accept that gift, but as for US Christians, we gladly accept the gift. What is the gift of the Holy Spirit? If you want varied opinion, then there is your conundrum. Stick to what you know.
Dave said to Donnie:
[color=#000000" size="4" face="times]"The Christian is aware that YOU are trying to change the very Word of God. The Scriptures SAY in Acts 2:38 that we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit not the gift of A holy spirit.

The Christian also knows that that YOU are shortchanging yourself when you don'accept that gift, but as for US Christians, we gladly accept the gift. What is the gift of the Holy Spirit? If you want varied opinion, then there is your conundrum. Stick to what you know.[/color]
[color=#0000FF" size="4" face="times]Question(s) for Dave regarding Acts 2:38--

1. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) the "Holy Ghost" as the gift?
---------------------- or -----------------------
2. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) the spirit of holiness [purity, being refreshed, a clear conscience]?
---------------------- or -----------------------
3. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) _____ _____ _____ _____ _____ _____?


For those who adhere to the Trinity Creed: --

1. What is "the gift of the Holy Ghost"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
2. Is the "Holy Ghost" the gift? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
3. Why is Jesus Christ not "the gift"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
4. Why is God the Father not "the gift"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
5. When the "Holy Ghost" is received, does one he become Charismatic? _____ _____
6. What does one expect when the "Holy Ghost" is received? _____ _____ _____
7. When you (Dave) received the "Holy Ghost," what did you experience? _____ _____
[/color]


_______________________

[color=#FF0000" size="3" face="times]Edited to emphasize the questions for those who believe the Trinity doctrine. [d.c.][/color]
Last edited by Donnie.Cruz on January 10th, 2016, 7:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

January 10th, 2016, 8:15 pm #32

If people want to believe that Jesus WAS God because the Word was God made known in the flesh, We need to repeat that the Greek pagans believed that Hermes (Mercury, Kairos) was the AGENT between the people and their Gods.

However, the Greek LOGOS or LATIN VERBUM understood by the literate classes was NEVER a person which means a PEOPLE by definition of LU and a few others.

Verbum is That which is spoken or said; cf. Goth. vaurd; Germ. Wort; Engl. word, a word; plur., words, expressions, language, discourse, conversation, etc. (cf.: vox, vocabulum). translation of LOGOS

You are left with Jesus being the LOGOS which includes SPEAK words OPPOSITE to ODE words: it excludes expressing one's own opinions (as with Jesus), singing, playing instruments or any kind of visual arts outlawed as self-pleasure in Romans 15:1 SO THAT "you can use one mind and one mouth to speak that which is written for our learning.

So LOGOS was never a member of the god family. The Historic trinity writers knew that the WORD or that which God SPEAKS is His Son whereas Jesus was the son of David after the flesh.

In the same way, Spirit or Spiritus in Latin speaks of Apollon or Abaddon and the worship of the starry host. The SERVICE to the Sun god, Apollo, by the Levites is called HARD BONDAGE.

Spirit in Hebrew and Greek by the literate classes (excluded religion actors or parasites) never defines a PERSON but the Mind or Mental disposition of that person.

Latin: no article accipietis donum Sancti Spiritus

Accipio to take a person or thing TO oneself
1. To hear, to perceive, to observe, to learn (cf. opp. do = I give in words, i. e. I say): hoc simul accipe dictum, Hence very freq. in the histt., to get or receive intelligence of any thing, to learn:
2. To comprehend or understand any thing communicated:
3. With the accessory idea of judging, to take a thing thus or thus, to interpret or explain

In the CORDE or heart Pllautus Casina 22: MYRRHINA
Hah! What is it? Prithee, repeat that same again; for, on my word, I don't in MY MIND sufficiently comprehend your complaints.


ACCEPT in Greek is Lambano b. apprehend with the mind, understand, “phreni l. ton logon” Hdt.9.10; “noō” Id.3.41; “tē dianoia” 9. apprehend by the senses, b. [select] apprehend with the mind, understand, “phreni l. ton logon” Hdt.9.10; “


Gift or Donum is a Gift brought to a Deity or person: Jesus said MY WORDS are SPIRIT and LIGHT. The Gift of A holy spirit requests that God give you A good consciousness or a CO-PERCEPTION when you are SAVED BY BAPTISM. Here, saved is TO and FROM something: a person whom God speaks to is SAFE FROM the Ephesian corruption defined in the beginning of Ephesians 2.

Santio means something MADE sacred: The Spirit or MIND of God does not need to be MADE sacred.

OUR UNholy minds or spirit is made A HOLY mind or spirit which means that we can APPREHEND the Word of God. No one played the harps of David in Revelation they APPREHENDED the harp of God often used to god "playing" the Minds.

That is why NONE of the ex-churches we have discussed is A Church of Christ which is A school of Christ commanded to teach what HE commanded to be taught and observed. I believe that without exception the CM-discussed churches of Christ have changed the sign or hoped to change the sign (locally) and have repudiated everything taught by churches of Christ except THE LAW OF SINGING and the LAW OF FLEECING.

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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

January 10th, 2016, 8:36 pm #33

Dave said to Donnie:
[color=#000000" size="4" face="times]"The Christian is aware that YOU are trying to change the very Word of God. The Scriptures SAY in Acts 2:38 that we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit not the gift of A holy spirit.

The Christian also knows that that YOU are shortchanging yourself when you don'accept that gift, but as for US Christians, we gladly accept the gift. What is the gift of the Holy Spirit? If you want varied opinion, then there is your conundrum. Stick to what you know.[/color]
[color=#0000FF" size="4" face="times]Question(s) for Dave regarding Acts 2:38--

1. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) the "Holy Ghost" as the gift?
---------------------- or -----------------------
2. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) the spirit of holiness [purity, being refreshed, a clear conscience]?
---------------------- or -----------------------
3. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) _____ _____ _____ _____ _____ _____?


For those who adhere to the Trinity Creed: --

1. What is "the gift of the Holy Ghost"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
2. Is the "Holy Ghost" the gift? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
3. Why is Jesus Christ not "the gift"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
4. Why is God the Father not "the gift"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
5. When the "Holy Ghost" is received, does one he become Charismatic? _____ _____
6. What does one expect when the "Holy Ghost" is received? _____ _____ _____
7. When you (Dave) received the "Holy Ghost," what did you experience? _____ _____
[/color]


_______________________

[color=#FF0000" size="3" face="times]Edited to emphasize the questions for those who believe the Trinity doctrine. [d.c.][/color]
[color=#0000FF" size="4" face="times]Dave, don't miss the questions above related to Acts 2:38 and the part that mentions "the gift" of "the Holy Ghost" -- which Trinitarians have designated as "God" Person No. 3.

Bill, feel free to chime in with your "Person/Being" arguments. For example, is the "Holy Ghost/Spirit" also ONE PERSON jointly with God and Jesus [your claim]?[/color]
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Dave
Dave

January 10th, 2016, 9:38 pm #34

Dave said to Donnie:
[color=#000000" size="4" face="times]"The Christian is aware that YOU are trying to change the very Word of God. The Scriptures SAY in Acts 2:38 that we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit not the gift of A holy spirit.

The Christian also knows that that YOU are shortchanging yourself when you don'accept that gift, but as for US Christians, we gladly accept the gift. What is the gift of the Holy Spirit? If you want varied opinion, then there is your conundrum. Stick to what you know.[/color]
[color=#0000FF" size="4" face="times]Question(s) for Dave regarding Acts 2:38--

1. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) the "Holy Ghost" as the gift?
---------------------- or -----------------------
2. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) the spirit of holiness [purity, being refreshed, a clear conscience]?
---------------------- or -----------------------
3. When one repents and is baptized, does he receive: (a) forgiveness of sins and (b) _____ _____ _____ _____ _____ _____?


For those who adhere to the Trinity Creed: --

1. What is "the gift of the Holy Ghost"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
2. Is the "Holy Ghost" the gift? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
3. Why is Jesus Christ not "the gift"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
4. Why is God the Father not "the gift"? _____ _____ _____ _____ _____
5. When the "Holy Ghost" is received, does one he become Charismatic? _____ _____
6. What does one expect when the "Holy Ghost" is received? _____ _____ _____
7. When you (Dave) received the "Holy Ghost," what did you experience? _____ _____
[/color]


_______________________

[color=#FF0000" size="3" face="times]Edited to emphasize the questions for those who believe the Trinity doctrine. [d.c.][/color]
Speak that which is written, not what Ken and Donnie conjures up in their minds.

Does the Scriptures say "the gift OF the Holy Spirit' or as YOU and KEN claim "the gift of A holy spirit?"

THIS...is living and factual proof that you two DO NOT adhere to the very Word of God.

So call it a Trinity approach to your attack on and about the Scriptures.


If nothing else, I do appreciate you two allowing me to continue to post here. It gives everyone coming here a chance to make their own decisions and know beyond a shadow of a doubt that you two do NOT adhere to the Truth.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

January 10th, 2016, 10:05 pm #35

I just READ the text posted above:

Latin Receiving is:: no article accipietis donum Sancti Spiritus

Accipio to take a person or thing TO oneself
1. To hear, to perceive, to observe, to learn (cf. opp. do = I give in words, i. e. I say): hoc simul accipe dictum, Hence very freq. in the histt., to get or receive intelligence of any thing, to learn:
2. To comprehend or understand any thing communicated:
3. With the accessory idea of judging, to take a thing thus or thus, to interpret or explain


In the CORDE or heart Pllautus Casina 22: MYRRHINA
Hah! What is it? Prithee, repeat that same again; for, on my word, I don't in MY MIND sufficiently comprehend your complaints.

ACCEPT in Greek is Lambano b. apprehend with the mind, understand, “phreni l. ton logon” Hdt.9.10; “noō” Id.3.41; “tē dianoia” 9. apprehend by the senses, b. [select] apprehend with the mind, understand, “phreni l. ton logon” Hdt.9.10; “
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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

January 10th, 2016, 10:31 pm #36

Speak that which is written, not what Ken and Donnie conjures up in their minds.

Does the Scriptures say "the gift OF the Holy Spirit' or as YOU and KEN claim "the gift of A holy spirit?"

THIS...is living and factual proof that you two DO NOT adhere to the very Word of God.

So call it a Trinity approach to your attack on and about the Scriptures.


If nothing else, I do appreciate you two allowing me to continue to post here. It gives everyone coming here a chance to make their own decisions and know beyond a shadow of a doubt that you two do NOT adhere to the Truth.
[color=#0000FF" size="4" face="times]Dave, regardless of what other statements you post, I would appreciate you taking the time to answer those specific questions above. Bill detests numbered questions and ignores them, but at least I've known you to respond to certain numbered questions, among several questions.

BTW, I do not attack the Scriptures. But I disagree with Trinity adherents when they present "scriptures" that do not prove the Trinity dogma.

Those questions are numbered for reference purposes.[/color]
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Dave
Dave

January 11th, 2016, 2:38 am #37

I just READ the text posted above:

Latin Receiving is:: no article accipietis donum Sancti Spiritus

Accipio to take a person or thing TO oneself
1. To hear, to perceive, to observe, to learn (cf. opp. do = I give in words, i. e. I say): hoc simul accipe dictum, Hence very freq. in the histt., to get or receive intelligence of any thing, to learn:
2. To comprehend or understand any thing communicated:
3. With the accessory idea of judging, to take a thing thus or thus, to interpret or explain


In the CORDE or heart Pllautus Casina 22: MYRRHINA
Hah! What is it? Prithee, repeat that same again; for, on my word, I don't in MY MIND sufficiently comprehend your complaints.

ACCEPT in Greek is Lambano b. apprehend with the mind, understand, “phreni l. ton logon” Hdt.9.10; “noō” Id.3.41; “tē dianoia” 9. apprehend by the senses, b. [select] apprehend with the mind, understand, “phreni l. ton logon” Hdt.9.10; “
No complaint here other than complete worthlessness covered with human skin, breathing, with a heart beat, taking up valuable space on planet earth.

Other than that, no complaints.

Prithee indeed.
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Bill
Bill

January 11th, 2016, 2:37 pm #38

[color=#0000FF" size="4" face="times]Dave, regardless of what other statements you post, I would appreciate you taking the time to answer those specific questions above. Bill detests numbered questions and ignores them, but at least I've known you to respond to certain numbered questions, among several questions.

BTW, I do not attack the Scriptures. But I disagree with Trinity adherents when they present "scriptures" that do not prove the Trinity dogma.

Those questions are numbered for reference purposes.[/color]
Let's just say that I ignore "questions" from megalomaniacal fanatics. LOL
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Dave
Dave

January 12th, 2016, 12:49 am #39

This coming from William (Bill) the narcissist with a brain preoccupied by dolls and women's underwear.
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Bill
Bill

January 12th, 2016, 6:10 am #40

Dave, you're a real riot. Do you ever wonder what life would be like if you’d had enough oxygen at birth?
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