How do we fix it?

How do we fix it?

Chris
Chris

May 4th, 2003, 1:47 pm #1

There has been much talk about the problems that exist at Madison and that are filtering into other places. What has been lacking is the answer to the question, "How do we fix it?" I am a firm believer in God and His truth (The Bible) and know that the inventions into worship, that have crept up, are damning and very dangerous.
There are those in almost any congregation that would like to see these changes (I think). But aside from teaching, which works, what can we do to thwart the onslaught of so many souls.

It is good to identify the problems, but a solution to them is better (if there is one).

How do we change minds?
How do we stay strong with the truth?
How do we know when it is time to just leave and either go to another congregation or to start another?
How do we do so without damaging the newborn's faith?
What is the answer to the heartbreak?

Please help me with some answers!
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Ray Pippin
Ray Pippin

May 5th, 2003, 5:00 pm #2

Dear Chris,
I read with great interest your inquiry concerning the problems that exist at Madison and are filtering into other places.

You ask the question “How do we fix it?”

You do appear to have some serious questions and seem to be asking them in sincerity and any sincere question deserves a sincere answer.

You said, “It is good to identify the problems, but a solution to them is better (if there is one). And then you list five other questions.

First, let me ask; are you a member at Madison and do you attend? This is very important because if not and you have just been listening to the talk that has been going around, you may very well not have a accurate account of the problems you speak of.

Second, we do need to determine just what the problem is, instead of what someone may be grumbling about. There are some things, which cause weak brothers to really stumble, and then there are other things which some use to grumble about. I think there is a big difference.

If you are a member at Madison, that is attending, and you have some serious problem with what is going on, I would like to meet with you and talk (seriously) about it. I can’t guarantee that you and I can solve it, but I will do everything I can, and will go to the elders with you to see if some kind of consensus can be reached. I don’t think it can be done on this website.

To you who post on this site, please don’t take personal offense to this, but with so many different ones trying to put their two cents worth in, and will not allow a civil discussion to take place between two individuals, is not a good forum for the resolution of such problems.

What is a serious problem to one person may not be a problem at all to some others who post on this site. Others will not stick to the issue at hand but will cut in with their agenda, which is usually something else.

I take you at your word that you are a firm believer in God and His truth..... And I promise you that I will show you every courtesy, if you are interested in having serious discussions on this matter. You may contact me after the second service.

I am usually around for a few minutes after.
Or, you may e-mail me personally and we will set up a time and place for discussion.

May God bless you and others that have a sincere interest in coming to a working solution to whatever the real problem may be.

For the Glory of our Crucified and Risen Lord,
Ray Pippin.......
E-mail lrp6628.30@juno.com
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David Rhoades
David Rhoades

May 5th, 2003, 11:02 pm #3

There has been much talk about the problems that exist at Madison and that are filtering into other places. What has been lacking is the answer to the question, "How do we fix it?" I am a firm believer in God and His truth (The Bible) and know that the inventions into worship, that have crept up, are damning and very dangerous.
There are those in almost any congregation that would like to see these changes (I think). But aside from teaching, which works, what can we do to thwart the onslaught of so many souls.

It is good to identify the problems, but a solution to them is better (if there is one).

How do we change minds?
How do we stay strong with the truth?
How do we know when it is time to just leave and either go to another congregation or to start another?
How do we do so without damaging the newborn's faith?
What is the answer to the heartbreak?

Please help me with some answers!
Chris;

Thanks for your questions. They are ones that need to be addressed.

Here are my simple thoughts.

=============================

How do we change minds?

=============================
We don't. We have a responsibility to warn, and after that we Pray that God
will help them see.

The problem is an old one. Here is an example:

There are 34 million people in the Mormon Church. Do you think they
know they are part of the largest cult in the world. No they don't.
There have been books and movies made about this subject. Why don't
they know?

By the time some find out it's too late, they have children and
spouses controlled by the Mormon Church.

The secret temple ceremony is only available to a select few Mormons.
It's this ceremony that tips them off about their Jesus being the
brother of Lucifer, the sons of one of many gods.
The rituals are right out of the Mason's ritual
book. It's no wonder because their founder Joseph Smith was a Mason,
and he designed it this way, before he was shot to death sometime
around 1860.

Just like most Mason's have no idea of the pagan religion they
practice. It's only after years of rising through the ranks
that they find that their "coming one" is not Jesus Christ.

To make a long story short the people don't know that they
are part of a plan designed by the "World Council of Churches"
to bring all churches together under tolerance in preparation
for the "One World Church". (unity in Diversity)

If they knew the depth of deception that has been played
upon them, sure they would run.

But, you are never going to get most to know what's going on.
Only on a one to one basis will some finally realize the problem.
But then there is their family. Todays family unit has been so
fragmented, gone is the patriarch or house head that would say
we are leaving. Today the children talk back, and say,
"No we are not going"!

Most bury their heads. Their eyes and ears have been sealed.

THEY WILL HATE YOU FOR TELLING THEM.

=======================================

How Do We Stay Strong With The Truth?

=======================================

Chris;

I was totally shocked, as I learned what was happening,
that few Church leaders understood what was happening.

Ask any Elder you choose if he is aware of the
"World Council of Churches" and their plan?
Ask any preacher the same question. Ask them if they
know why the "World Council of Churches"
was formed. It's no secret. Go to their web site.
They will tell you.

If you don't know the truth how can you evangelize against it?

The next time someone tells you that this church is not
part of some organized conspiracy, ask them if they know
who Alice Bailey was? What about the Lucifer Trust Company?
What did Alice Bailey say (in 1900) they were going to
bring in through the churches in the year 2000? Ask
them what happend in 1962 that started the "Holy Entertainment"
concept to bring new members into the church.

Their answers will tell you they don't know what's going on.
It's a conspiracy from Hell they don't know about, and in
most cases don't want to.

I see most Elders and Preachers coming out of the
destruction of todays Church, and never knowing what
actually happened. They will venture to another Church
in the same haze that caused the problems in the first
Church.

To answer your question: First we have to educate
ourselves on the problem and what the truth really is,
and then tell all who will listen.

==========================================

How do we know when it is time to just leave and
either go to another congregation or to start another?

==========================================

This is a hard one. I asked myself the same question.
If you have children that are being indoctrinated into
the "New World Order" your decision may be different
than it is if you are without children in the church.

Even if you stay, you may find it hard to worship
once you know the truth.

Everyone is going to have to wrestle with this one.
Their answer may be: Is there one more person
I can warn before I leave.

==========================================


How do we do so without damaging the newborn's faith?


==========================================

If we saw a child in the road, we would rush out to
bring it to safety before we thought about whose child is was.

If we saw a storm coming, we would warn our neighbors
regardless of their spiritual beliefs.

We can ask God to help us and forgive us in these
things we know little about.


===========================================

What is the answer to the heartbreak?

===========================================

The Heartbreak is in the physical things:
The Church building, The friends.

The hearbreak can't be with The Lord Jesus Christ,
because we have been warned of all this.



These are just my simple thoughts

Thank You

David Rhoades


Here is a link to Walter Martin's "Kingdom of the Cults"
Very good RealAudio files to listen to;
http://www.waltermartin.com/cults.html
(1)MORMONISM: CHRISTIAN OR CULT?
http://www.ericbarger.com/articles/morm ... r_cult.htm
(2) The World Council of Churches
http://www.wcc-coe.org/
(3) Catholics want their traditional mass back
http://www.traditionalmass.org/compare.html
(4) Sun Myung Moon Pushes U.N. To Establish One-World Religion
http://www.usasurvival.org/ck92402.shtml
(5) The Ecumenical Movement
http://www.acts2.com/thebibletruth/ecum ... vement.htm
(6) The History of Ecumenism
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Rhodes/ ... umnism.htm
(7)"ALL CHRISTIANS SHOULD FORGET THEIR DIFFERENCES AND JOIN FORCES TO EVANGELIZE THE WORLD BY THE YEAR 2000. WE CANNOT REACH THIS GOAL ALONE."
http://www.fundamentalbiblechurch.org/F ... cad200.htm
(8) InfoPlease Encyclopedia about the Ecumenical Movement
http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/society/A0816730.html
(9) The Ecumenical Movement is one of the most controversial subjects in this present hour
http://www.propheticrevelation.com/misc/ecumove.htm
(10) THE SHOCKING APOSTASY of the WORLD COUNCIL of CHURCHES
http://www.ivanfoster.org/page.asp?shocking
(11)“Alice Bailey, Foundress of the Lucifer Trust, the Theosophical and Satanist organization which lies behind UNESCO, predicted in 1919 the appearance of ‘a Universal Church’ of which ‘the definitive outline will appear toward the end of the century’ and which shall keep ‘the outward appearance amid the mission to strike out at the many vehicles of colloquial ecclesiastical usage.’...:
http://watch.pair.com/UR.html
(12) The One World Religion
http://watch.pair.com/
(13) U.N. plans to bring together 1,000 world religious leaders
http://www.ordination.org/together.htm
(14) Promise Keepers and the Rising Tide of Ecumenism
http://www.cnview.com/on_line_resources ... menism.htm
Last edited by ConcernedMembers on May 5th, 2003, 11:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kenneth Sublett
Kenneth Sublett

May 6th, 2003, 12:38 am #4

Mr Rhoades, you know very well that when I mention some unmentionable facts known to all but MYTH-FED latter day religionists, I just have to spend all day picking out viper fangs.

I told them about the DIONYSUS initiation they tried to force on Jesus and they put the cobras to my breast.

So, I remember something about Hiram the architect's MOLTEN SEA mounted on twelve bulls in the MOST HOLY PLACES of Mormonism and it is hard to believe. Maybe you could be brave enough to seek out the rumors about INITIATION in all of the orifices?

Well, the message of all priesthoods of pagan religion is about the same. How about a large group maybe having to declare bankruptcy and still claim to be ruled by the Vicar of Christ?

Well, I say this to cast doubt on all of the latter day saints (apostles) who believe that the church is a HOLY TAVERN instead of a sheepfold for guarded safety.

Maybe some DEPROGRAMMED Mormon would chime in.

Ken
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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

May 6th, 2003, 6:37 pm #5

There has been much talk about the problems that exist at Madison and that are filtering into other places. What has been lacking is the answer to the question, "How do we fix it?" I am a firm believer in God and His truth (The Bible) and know that the inventions into worship, that have crept up, are damning and very dangerous.
There are those in almost any congregation that would like to see these changes (I think). But aside from teaching, which works, what can we do to thwart the onslaught of so many souls.

It is good to identify the problems, but a solution to them is better (if there is one).

How do we change minds?
How do we stay strong with the truth?
How do we know when it is time to just leave and either go to another congregation or to start another?
How do we do so without damaging the newborn's faith?
What is the answer to the heartbreak?

Please help me with some answers!
Chris,

One word really struck me in Ray Pippin's response: "consensus." Assuming that you attend the Madison Church, Mr. Pippin has invited you to meet with him and the elders to try to reach some sort of "consensus" about the "problems" there.

Whether by design or unwittingly, Mr. Pippin seems to have invited you to a close encounter with the Hegelian Dialectic process, by which means the change agents are implementing changes in the Church today. Given that this meeting comes to pass, you will present your opinions (thesis), the Madison elders will present theirs which allegedly differ from yours (antithesis), then both of you will try to find points on which you both agree (synthesis, also known as CONSENSUS). Both sides will need to make some consessions (compromises) in order to reach a mutual agreement. In the Church, this usually means sacrificing a few "insignificant" biblical principles here and there to maintain "peace and harmony" with the group. In the Church, reaching "consensus" does not work any other way, and this is the Hegelian Dialectic in practice.

So Chris, beware of anyone in the Church today (whether they're at Madison or anywhere else) who invites you to any meeting for the purpose of reaching a "consensus." You may end up compromising more than you realize.
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Kenneth Sublett
Kenneth Sublett

May 6th, 2003, 11:35 pm #6

There has been much talk about the problems that exist at Madison and that are filtering into other places. What has been lacking is the answer to the question, "How do we fix it?" I am a firm believer in God and His truth (The Bible) and know that the inventions into worship, that have crept up, are damning and very dangerous.
There are those in almost any congregation that would like to see these changes (I think). But aside from teaching, which works, what can we do to thwart the onslaught of so many souls.

It is good to identify the problems, but a solution to them is better (if there is one).

How do we change minds?
How do we stay strong with the truth?
How do we know when it is time to just leave and either go to another congregation or to start another?
How do we do so without damaging the newborn's faith?
What is the answer to the heartbreak?

Please help me with some answers!
----How do we change minds?

A. You will never change minds; you must hope that these people move on to a better "venue for Rock and Roll." There is a very common theme in the bible. It proves that in all of the MUSICAL passages people already knew the truth and rebelled against it. For instance, God rescued Israel because they were polluting His name in Egypt and He had made a promise. He gave them a Covenant of Grace, they rose up to play which is "musical idolatry," and God turned them over to worship the starry hosts. There was no redemption for most of them and they self-destructed at the temple with music "persecuting" a type of Jesus Christ.

B. "God will come with ten thousand of His saints" points directly to the message in The Book of Enoch. Satan seduced the people away from the Living Word with music. They had come down from God's presence and could never get up. They were reserved for now to let them work out their own destruction in the end times effort to destroy the written Word. Apollo or Abaddon or Apollyon and his muses resurrected as locusts or musical performers have landed and are SEPARATING and PUNISHING those with the music MARK and just driving those with the MARK of the Word out of the path of self destruction.

----How do we stay strong with the truth?

A. In all churches confiscated by a clergy staff you WILL NEVER get the whole truth. For instance, the plan to TITHE is based on a lie. It removes you back beyond the cross of Christ. Therefore, there will be no public teaching of the entire Bible in a "school of the bible." You must take personal responsibility for your own DISCIPLESHIP. You cannot rise above the lack of Biblical knowledge and integrity of your teachers. You have the same charge as the unauthorized preacher: go teach the Word. And for heaven's sake don't fall for the BIGGEST SCAM called the Law of Giving or the Law of Tithing. You must remove the loaded guns from infants: immediately. Paul said that falling away from the Word was an UNFORGIVABLE SIN.

B. Believe me that they are ABSOLUTELY SELF DECEIVED because of preacher-induced ignorance. They cannot and will not defend their position because the Jubilators have convinced them that they have the separated Holy Spirit in their bodies. That means that they are GOD INCARNATE and a gas pain will be interpreted as a message from the "spirit." They are as self-deluded as Jim Jones. The nerve connections between CARNAL FEELINGS and SPIRITUAL WORSHIP seem to be instantly HARD WIRED. They have taken the wrong turn at the crossroads and they can never return. As in the ancient stories like Enoch their only temporary comfort is to SEDUCE more people to share the misery. But their "praise chants" are the lost wailings echoing down through the corridors of history because they can see the END from the beginning. As Donnie reports the songs I see people into self-induced hysteria and it appears that most are just looking wide-eyed like owls on a log watching the a coonie mating dance.

------How do we know when it is time to just leave and either go to another congregation or to start another?

A. The intent of the New Style Worship is to drive away those faithful to the Word as soon as the THEATER is safely financed. You read of invitations to leave quite often in this forum. Sometimes you have to grasp that your "house" has been stolen by bandits and move on. Don't expect much better. Paul told you that if you want to meet Jesus you have to go "outside the camp or city." He DOES NOT dwell in houses made by hands or worshiped by human hands (as in clapping as an insult throughout the Bible."

-----How do we do so without damaging the newborn's faith?

A. You cannot blame yourself unless you lack the courage to question "god's celestial beings."

If the newborns are being led to Canaan land as its IDOL be assured that they are being fed a mixture of Canaanite Baalism. The pillars, Easter eggs and Christmas are all efforts to BLEED OFF attention from Christ who contrary to some of the change agents did not hatch out of a cosmic or Max Lucado's VIAL OF LIGHT.

B. The singing of hypnotic (voodoo) songs with the clapping puts you into the presence of those who from the beginning in the person of Judas in Psalm 41 are trying to MUSICALLY MOCK Jesus Christ to death or panic Him into running. If you run outside of the mega-temple that will be EXACTLY where you will find Jesus. Because He had an encounter with the SOOTHSAYING or NECROMANCERS as Musical Worship Teams He gave us a visual aid: He cast them out more or less violently as one ejects DUNG. That is a fact. They are smearing it in your face.

C. One doubts that people are so terminally ignorant of the Bible and the universal view of history when they claim MUSIC as their god. The other option is that some agents are terminally evil and are intentionally trying to destroy the body of Christ.

What is the answer to the heartbreak?

A. It is tough to get RUN OVER AND RUN OUT of your own "church house of widows" by the same family of Pharisees. I am overly liberal but I feel like I have been raped when someone cheats me out of something. The only Christian thing to do is to go up front and give him your coat also. The word STRIKE you is related to "stretching your hide on a drum frame and beating you to death."

If you are going to live a godly life you must get used "suffering persecution." And the persecution of Jesus and Paul came from the religionists of the world. Psalm 41 prophesied that it would be with the warrior's musicians. Don't be a chicken and get confused by a fox in the hen house.

Invite your inviter to post his defense of MUSIC in any form as opposed to teaching the Word. If he will not then you know that you are venturing into mind control grounds.

Ken
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Anonymous
Anonymous

May 7th, 2003, 2:43 pm #7

Chris,

One word really struck me in Ray Pippin's response: "consensus." Assuming that you attend the Madison Church, Mr. Pippin has invited you to meet with him and the elders to try to reach some sort of "consensus" about the "problems" there.

Whether by design or unwittingly, Mr. Pippin seems to have invited you to a close encounter with the Hegelian Dialectic process, by which means the change agents are implementing changes in the Church today. Given that this meeting comes to pass, you will present your opinions (thesis), the Madison elders will present theirs which allegedly differ from yours (antithesis), then both of you will try to find points on which you both agree (synthesis, also known as CONSENSUS). Both sides will need to make some consessions (compromises) in order to reach a mutual agreement. In the Church, this usually means sacrificing a few "insignificant" biblical principles here and there to maintain "peace and harmony" with the group. In the Church, reaching "consensus" does not work any other way, and this is the Hegelian Dialectic in practice.

So Chris, beware of anyone in the Church today (whether they're at Madison or anywhere else) who invites you to any meeting for the purpose of reaching a "consensus." You may end up compromising more than you realize.
Your message is a prime example of how conversing on a web site, especially one that is moderated and slanted, can lead to very erroneous conclusions.

I know Ray Pippin very well. He is not a relative, but someone I have known for many years as a fellow member of the Madison Church of Christ.

Ray is all the things I have seen written POSITIVELY about on his site (though positive writings are hard to find). He is retired from employment as a preacher, but spends enormous amounts of time AS A VOLUNTEER, preaching to those that many would forget about. He goes to retirement homes and low income housing and spreads the gospel. He does this without fanfare and without asking for credit or seeking attention from anyone. He is grounded in God's word and is loved by people of all ages. He is one of those I believe the writer was talking about in the verses below:

Matthew 5
8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

If Ray has offered to meet with someone or answer their questions, I would be quite sure he has no other motive than to be helpful and to create unity. Can you or anyone else who posts here say the same?



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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

May 8th, 2003, 1:51 pm #8

Dear "Anonymous":

It's nice that you have faith in Mr. Pippin as a pillar in the Church and the community, but lauding him only evades the issue at hand.

The fact remains that Mr. Pippin has invited "Chris" to a meeting with the Madison elders for the purpose of reaching a "consensus" over the alleged problems at Madison. "Consensus" is identical with "compromise" in the Hegelian Dialectic (not "dialect") technique of brainwashing.

Let's give Mr. Pippin and the Madison elders the benefit of the doubt and assume that they would never compromise or "revise" biblical truths and principles just to satisfy all parties involved. If that's the case, Mr. Pippin should choose his words more carefully and refrain from using "consensus," which is a red flag that implies actions that subvert the Word of God.

By the way, Anonymous, why do you conceal your identity? Your message will carry far more weight and credibility if you do not hide yourself.
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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

May 8th, 2003, 3:32 pm #9

Dear Chris,
I read with great interest your inquiry concerning the problems that exist at Madison and are filtering into other places.

You ask the question “How do we fix it?”

You do appear to have some serious questions and seem to be asking them in sincerity and any sincere question deserves a sincere answer.

You said, “It is good to identify the problems, but a solution to them is better (if there is one). And then you list five other questions.

First, let me ask; are you a member at Madison and do you attend? This is very important because if not and you have just been listening to the talk that has been going around, you may very well not have a accurate account of the problems you speak of.

Second, we do need to determine just what the problem is, instead of what someone may be grumbling about. There are some things, which cause weak brothers to really stumble, and then there are other things which some use to grumble about. I think there is a big difference.

If you are a member at Madison, that is attending, and you have some serious problem with what is going on, I would like to meet with you and talk (seriously) about it. I can’t guarantee that you and I can solve it, but I will do everything I can, and will go to the elders with you to see if some kind of consensus can be reached. I don’t think it can be done on this website.

To you who post on this site, please don’t take personal offense to this, but with so many different ones trying to put their two cents worth in, and will not allow a civil discussion to take place between two individuals, is not a good forum for the resolution of such problems.

What is a serious problem to one person may not be a problem at all to some others who post on this site. Others will not stick to the issue at hand but will cut in with their agenda, which is usually something else.

I take you at your word that you are a firm believer in God and His truth..... And I promise you that I will show you every courtesy, if you are interested in having serious discussions on this matter. You may contact me after the second service.

I am usually around for a few minutes after.
Or, you may e-mail me personally and we will set up a time and place for discussion.

May God bless you and others that have a sincere interest in coming to a working solution to whatever the real problem may be.

For the Glory of our Crucified and Risen Lord,
Ray Pippin.......
E-mail lrp6628.30@juno.com
Dear Ray,

You seem to be a sincere person in inviting "Chris" to meet with you and the elders about the alleged problems at Madison Church. But are you really sure that you mean for everyone involved to reach a "consensus" as you put it? You also appear to be a learned man, so I trust that you are quite familiar with the Hegelian Dialectic technique of brainwashing. In that scheme, reaching "consensus" is identical to reaching "compromise." Surely you don't imply that you, "Chris," and the Madison elders will all sit down and, through much dialogue, eventually compromise God's Word until all parties involved "feel good again" about the situation, because in the Church, that's exactly what the Hegelian Dialectic accomplishes.

If you and the Madison elders honestly plan to resolve differences with "Chris" by means other than through compromise (which involves tweaking God's Word to suit your purposes), then please don't use the word "consensus." It is a red flag. However, if reaching a "consensus" is truly your intent, then I refer you to Galatians 1:8-10.
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Anonymous
Anonymous

May 8th, 2003, 5:38 pm #10

Dear "Anonymous":

It's nice that you have faith in Mr. Pippin as a pillar in the Church and the community, but lauding him only evades the issue at hand.

The fact remains that Mr. Pippin has invited "Chris" to a meeting with the Madison elders for the purpose of reaching a "consensus" over the alleged problems at Madison. "Consensus" is identical with "compromise" in the Hegelian Dialectic (not "dialect") technique of brainwashing.

Let's give Mr. Pippin and the Madison elders the benefit of the doubt and assume that they would never compromise or "revise" biblical truths and principles just to satisfy all parties involved. If that's the case, Mr. Pippin should choose his words more carefully and refrain from using "consensus," which is a red flag that implies actions that subvert the Word of God.

By the way, Anonymous, why do you conceal your identity? Your message will carry far more weight and credibility if you do not hide yourself.
Let's give Mr. Pippin and the Madison elders the benefit of the doubt and assume that they would never compromise or "revise" biblical truths and principles just to satisfy all parties involved. If that's the case, Mr. Pippin should choose his words more carefully and refrain from using "consensus," which is a red flag that implies actions that subvert the Word of God.
*********
By the way, Anonymous, why do you conceal your identity? Your message will carry far more weight and credibility if you do not hide yourself.
**********
Answer to point #1 above:
Not everyone seems to have studied the "red flag" issue and so are unaware of "hidden" meanings of words, especially in regard to subverting the Word of God.
******
To answer to point #2, I will first refer you to a quote from the moderators of this site regarding an interview published by them some months ago:

A well respected Elder and Godly man gives us insider information on what's going though the eyes of an Elder involved with the current crisis in the Church.

Elder-X has chosen to remain anonymous. There is nothing wrong with that. We need the information. We need the truth, nothing but the truth, and put to us in a candid and frank manner.

Elder-X has been through a Church split at his Church and is ready to spill the beans!

----- If it is okay for Elder X, I believe it is perfectly fine for me. I do not see that it lessens my credibility at all as I can give you any amount of documentation that you require to establish my veracity in this particular post

----- If I choose a name other than my legal one for posting purposes, historically, it has been used as a pun or as a way to ridicule by other posters on this site and that diversionary tactic has gotten more than a little old.

----- Regarding evasiveness, please note that "Chris" never has answered the question of whether or not he is a member of, or has even ever attended services at the Madison Church of Christ. So, to borrow another frequently used tactic by other posters on this site, "That dog won't hunt."

Have a nice day!




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