Historically a cappella churches with instrumental services returned

Dave
Dave

December 15th, 2011, 9:50 pm #11

Historically a cappella churches with instrumental services returned to national directory

http://www.christianchronicle.org/blog/ ... directory/

This should remove any appearance of a HQ exclusion from "Churches of Christ in the United States", published by 21st Century Christian.

Good, unifying move, 21st Century Christian. It is a pity this website promotes division rather than unity.
....typical legalist....bash the denominationalists and Catholics....instead of seeking and saving the lost. A true legalist is where you seem them trying to save the already saved.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 16th, 2011, 3:03 am #12





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AM
AM

December 16th, 2011, 10:13 pm #13

Luke 8:3

Joanna the wife of Cuza, the manager of Herod's household; Susanna; and many others. These women were helping to support them out of their own means.

8:1-2 shows that them is a reference to Jesus and the Twelve.
Do you see the difference between the "providing for" and the "solicitation of"? Obviously not! Jesus was provide for and Judas was acting in the solicitation of. Do you honestly see Jesus as a Modern Preacher(beggar) that looks to gain anyway he can? Or do you see Jesus as a son that was provided for by a father through his children? Explain your position, you could be wrong!
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AM
AM

December 16th, 2011, 10:49 pm #14

Or, AM, I could give the most intellectual response that you assert....that you are big enough to conjure up that instrumental music is a sin, where the Bible doesn't. Can you give book and chapter where instrumental music is sinful? I see the sins of the flesh listed in Galatians 5
19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Do you see instrumental music listed there? So now you want to rewrite the Word and add instrumental music to the list?

Now AM, I am sure that you are shaking your head as you read this....just as I did when I read your last response.

Oh, and you stated "Honestly Jesus moved away from the King David example..."
Please help me understand what you mean there? Where do you find that? If anything I see where Jesus pushed the example of King David and showed where all men need God.. David sinned, but still God loved him because David truly loved God, and that is evident with him using even musical instruments to accompany his singing and using ALL of his talents to Glorify God.
Acts 13
20 All this took about 450 years. After this, God gave them judges until the time of Samuel the prophet. 21 Then the people asked for a king, and he gave them Saul son of Kish, of the tribe of Benjamin, who ruled forty years. 22 After removing Saul, he made David their king. God testified concerning him: I have found David son of Jesse, a man after my own heart; he will do everything I want him to do.

AM, how many other men do you hear God commending like that?
Prayer has One purpose, which I believe we all agree on. Music has many purposes and all entice the emotions, that is why the Las Vegas has the music stars highlighted on the Strip, music is an enterlude to a funeral, music for a wedding--music has not the sole purpose to worship God. Music is divisive. Music has a secular purpose not a spiritual purpose. Jesus did not use it. There was not music when he died on the cross. Jesus did not call people together to sing and make music(altough Jesus did sing with his apostle on one occassion). Yet you are bent on telling others Jesus did use music? And his Church is an example of how Jesus worshipped God with Music? Book, chapter, verse please!

If we are going to have Music don't you Think Beyonce' and her gospel music should be heard in our churchs, with her husband JayZ rapping to the beat, think of the people we would attrach! Or Lady Gaga singing amazing Grace with her synthesized chords. And don't think for a minute they would not put them on albums and sell them for a profit and profess a Christian image. Similar to what some church praise teams do, and collecting their thirty pieces.

Yes, I believe music and instruments are secular and with out God.

Dave, Why do feel instrments are so important to God? Why are you a secularist? Live the example of Jesus, it will make sense in time.

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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 17th, 2011, 1:19 am #15

I would kick out all of those limp-wristed, whiney-piney fellas and hire Willie Nelson.

Ken
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 17th, 2011, 1:35 am #16

Luke 8:3

Joanna the wife of Cuza, the manager of Herod's household; Susanna; and many others. These women were helping to support them out of their own means.

8:1-2 shows that them is a reference to Jesus and the Twelve.
Luke 8:1 And it came to pass afterward,
that he went throughout every city and village,
preaching and shewing the glad tidings of the kingdom of God:
and the twelve were with him,


A preacher must have a GO burden to be Christ Like.
The Gospel was not "just Jesus" but the good news of the KINGDOM OF GOD.
Jesus is the king and He will not tolerate queens on the throne.

Note Paul said that one is worthy of their food IF they are on the road again.

Luke 8:2 And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils,
Luke 8:3 And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herods steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance.


They took of their present funds

They didn't lay by each first day of the week: they laid by HIM or them so that they would have something "by him" to give to those in need.
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Dave
Dave

December 18th, 2011, 5:24 am #17

Historically a cappella churches with instrumental services returned to national directory

http://www.christianchronicle.org/blog/ ... directory/

This should remove any appearance of a HQ exclusion from "Churches of Christ in the United States", published by 21st Century Christian.

Good, unifying move, 21st Century Christian. It is a pity this website promotes division rather than unity.
AM,
Do you hold a political position? You sound like a good politician. You said "Jesus did not call people together to sing and make music(altough Jesus did sing with his apostle on one occassion)."

If Jesus is our Example and He EVER did something, yes even one time, then it is GOOD! You just contradicted yourself. You said that Jesus did not call people to sing, ALTHOUGH Jesus sang on one occasion. If Jesus sang, at any time, then YES, He did call men to sing together.
Now Ken will tell you that singing isn't singing, but that is exactly what the passage, using the Greek translation, expresses. It says singing....>It means singing.
Don't try changing the Word of God.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 18th, 2011, 8:30 pm #18

Jesus fed Judas the SOP which has the same root as PSALLO and the DEVIL went into Judas and he went out, hanged himself, twisted in the wind, rotted and his guts fell out. Go thou and do likewise.

Jesus marked the MEN of that generation as CHILDREN. This fulfills Christ's prophecy that the effeminate and women would rule over them. They piped trying to force others to take the mark by singing and dancing. Jesus consigned them to the market place. Go thou and do likewise.

Jesus cast out the musical minstrels LIKE DUNG: more or less violently. The prophetic fulfilment was because the same official (minister) regulated the dung heap and the flute-girls a synonym for prostitute. Go thou and do likewise.

No one ever sang in a weepy-creepy, limp-wristed form. God PREVENTED that by speaking to Jesus WITHOUT METER (as the word always meant in the normal pagan worship.).

Paul said that TRUE elders will teach that which HAS BEEN TAUGHT. In the other non-instrumental sense in Romans 15 the command was to use ONE MIND and ONE MOUTH to speak that which is written. Martin Luther and all of the church fathers could read black text on brown paper.

http://www.piney.com/RefMLuthRom15.html

No, it's a lie: Martin Luther never wrote songs to be sung in church.

Next, an elder would understand that HYMNING once a hear in a home setting could never be a legalistic PATTERNISM for making noise when Jesus comes to teach where COMPETENT ELDERS taught what Jesus taught and NEVER led a superstitious Praise Singer wave a limp wrist. Even in civil society they in effect "tarred and feathered" any of the poetic-musical (hypocrites) to live in decent society.

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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

December 19th, 2011, 3:10 am #19

Historically a cappella churches with instrumental services returned to national directory

http://www.christianchronicle.org/blog/ ... directory/

This should remove any appearance of a HQ exclusion from "Churches of Christ in the United States", published by 21st Century Christian.

Good, unifying move, 21st Century Christian. It is a pity this website promotes division rather than unity.
When the overwhelming method of COMMUNICATION between God and man and man to man is to READ or SPEAK, why do you think there are so many people willing to sell their souls to say that God wants us to SING just to sing.

We know that the command to teach that which has been taught has almost been silenced by men claiming the role of mediator in their own songs and sermons: at the same time, the legalistic laws makes certain that none of the audience and supporters are branded as trouble keepers if they say something not on the outlines from college or preacher's school? They WILL hurt you?

Encarta Online

Hallel, in Jewish ritual, selection from the Psalms, chanted as part of the liturgy during certain festivals. The more frequently used selection includes Psalms 113-118 and is known as the Egyptian Hallel, presumably because Psalm 114 begins, "When Israel went out of Egypt Ö" It is sung in synagogues on the first two days of Passover, on Shabuoth, on Sukkot, on each morning of the eight days of Hanukkah, and at the close of the Seder.

Hallel

The Hallel through the generations, on specific occasions: Pesachim 117a
Hallel requires a full stomach and a satisfied spirit: Taanis 25b-26a
The reading is beloved to the people, and so they listen closely: Megillah 21b
The Hallel as an Institution of the Prophets, to use to pray for salvation from danger: Pesachim 117a
[2x]
Which occurrences mandate singing praise to Gd: Megillah 14a
Reciting Hallel for a miracle which occurred outside of Israel: Megillah 14a
Saying the Hallel daily is blasphemous: Shabbos 118b





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Dave
Dave

December 19th, 2011, 5:10 pm #20

Historically a cappella churches with instrumental services returned to national directory

http://www.christianchronicle.org/blog/ ... directory/

This should remove any appearance of a HQ exclusion from "Churches of Christ in the United States", published by 21st Century Christian.

Good, unifying move, 21st Century Christian. It is a pity this website promotes division rather than unity.
Ken, if you say that Jesus did not sing, then you are calling the Word of God a lie. Sing is still sing, no matter how hard you try to pull it out of the Greek/Latin/Hebrew/Spainish/whatever.

Matthew 26:30
When they had sung a hymn, they went out to the Mount of Olives.
"After a few hours of discussion, here perhaps abbreviated, a household would sing the remaining hymns of the Hallel (Ps 113--18), undoubtedly the hymn to which Matthew 26:30 refers (Daube 1963:45; Ellington 1979)."

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