Grace Centered Magazine Forum: LABOR and heavy LADEN imposed.

Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 15th, 2011, 8:32 pm #21

All of the rhetoric, singing, instrument playing and acting is imposing the BURDEN Jesus died to remove.

Said I "said someone was under the influence of Lucifer because they disagreed with me."

I think someone has a reading or bias problem.
Even if there was any command for instruments, this is the way it would sound: Psallo permits plucking with the FINGERS and never with a PLECTRUM. So, they lie, lie, lie.

Enough! Enough!
Last edited by Ken.Sublett on April 19th, 2011, 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Rocnar
Rocnar

April 16th, 2011, 4:17 am #22

If you believe the BIBLE is the INSPIRED WORD OF GOD please continue and take the link. If you don't believe the Bible is INSPIRED you might as well take a nap.


(speakers on)

http://www.kingjamesbibles.com/psalms_150.html

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Rocnar
Rocnar

April 16th, 2011, 6:47 am #23

If you took the nap you might want to hear this.



(speakers on)


http://www.kingjamesbibles.com/2_timothy_3.html
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Joined: January 2nd, 2005, 6:45 am

April 16th, 2011, 9:11 am #24

If you believe the BIBLE is the INSPIRED WORD OF GOD please continue and take the link. If you don't believe the Bible is INSPIRED you might as well take a nap.


(speakers on)

http://www.kingjamesbibles.com/psalms_150.html
[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]II Tim. 3:16 -- "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness."[/color]
  • Inspired: Psalm 150 [your reference]

    </li>
  • Inspired: II Samuel 6:

    [14] And David danced before the LORD with all his might; and David was girded with a linen ephod.
    [15] So David and all the house of Israel brought up the ark of the LORD with shouting, and with the sound of the trumpet.
    [16] ... Michal Saul's daughter looked through a window, and saw king David leaping and dancing before the LORD; and she despised him in her heart.
    [17] ... David offered burnt offerings and peace offerings before the LORD.
    [20] Then David returned to bless his household. And Michal the daughter of Saul came out to meet David, and said, How glorious was the king of Israel to day, who uncovered himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly uncovereth himself!

    Commanded by God in the assembly [???]: being girded [???]; leaping and dancing [???]; shouting and sounding the trumpet [???]; offering burnt and peace offerings [???]; uncovering self in the gathering [???]

    </li>
  • Inspired: Gen. 4:[8] And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.

    </li>
  • Inspired: Jer. 29:[23] Because they have committed villany in Israel, and have committed adultery with their neighbours' wives, and have spoken lying words in my name, which I have not commanded them; even I know, and am a witness, saith the LORD.

    </li>
[color=#0000FF" size="3" face="times]So, what is your point? That Psalm 150 is inspired [no disagreement there] and is, therefore, commanded by God? I think not. There is not a single passage that indicates that God has ever commanded to use musical devices in the assembly of saints.[/color]
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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

April 16th, 2011, 1:26 pm #25

The following is from the INSPIRED Word of God:

"And if [any] mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, Burning for burning, wound for wound, stripe for stripe" (Exodus 21:23-25 KJV).

And so is this:

"Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also" (Matt. 5:38-39 KJV).

Psalm 150 is inspired and so is this:

"Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord" (Eph. 5:19 KJV).

And so is this:

"Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord" (Col. 3:16 KJV).

Here we have passages from the inspired Old Testament, followed by passages from the inspired New Testament that tell us to do something different from what is stated in the Old Testament. One OT passage tells us to repay hurt with hurt, whereas Jesus says to turn the other cheek. Another OT passage tells us to praise God with musical instruments, whereas Jesus through Paul tells us to sing and make melody in our hearts to God. Not one instrument is mentioned.

The point is that, although the OT and NT are both inspired, the NT now overrules the OT. In Col. 2:13-14 (KJV), Paul tells us that the ordinances of the Mosaic Law were nailed to the cross of Christ:

"And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross."

The writer of Hebrews says the same thing: "In that he saith, A new [covenant], he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old [is] ready to vanish away" (Heb. 8:13 KJV).

We must follow the principles and commandments of the New Testament and not "justify" our worldly desires in worship by running back and selecting things like instrumental music from the Old Testament that suit us. That is an abuse of inspired Scripture.


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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 16th, 2011, 5:05 pm #26

All of the rhetoric, singing, instrument playing and acting is imposing the BURDEN Jesus died to remove.

Said I "said someone was under the influence of Lucifer because they disagreed with me."

I think someone has a reading or bias problem.
See First Samuel Eight

http://www.piney.com/First-Samuel-Eight.html



#15 is Halal 150: not a psalm. Kings and Levites made boast songs to make war: 150 is inspired in that it is an accuraterecord. It is not inspired as a pattern for the School of what Jesus commanded to be taught.



While you are "sanging and clanging" Twila Paris, you MISSED the fact that Christ spoke only through the prophets and apostles to the godly classes. You sing Halal 150 only if you plan to make yourself vile pretending to be God standing in the holy places.

http://www.piney.com/MuEMailPs149-150.html

lur-aoidos A.one who sings to the lyre, harmonia meaning: In music, stringing, of bows and lyres, musical scale, generally music: rhythm, acting, dancing.
hudr-aulês one who plays the water organ


If you use Halal 150 as a patternism for church when David wanted to play and dance in the firmament you stand judged if you do NOT dance naked just like David.

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Rocnar
Rocnar

April 16th, 2011, 5:58 pm #27

The Bible writers claimed repeatedly that they were transmitting the very Word of God, infallible and authoritative in the highest degree.

If the greatest and most influential book of the ages, containing the most beautiful literature and the most perfect moral code ever devised, was partially written by deceiving fanatics, then what hope is there for ever finding meaning and purpose in this world?

If one will seriously investigate Biblical evidences, he will find that their claims of Divine Inspiration were amply justified.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 16th, 2011, 6:32 pm #28

All of the rhetoric, singing, instrument playing and acting is imposing the BURDEN Jesus died to remove.

Said I "said someone was under the influence of Lucifer because they disagreed with me."

I think someone has a reading or bias problem.
Acts 7 says that because of musical idolatry at Mount Sinai, God turned them (Levi tribe) over to worship the starry host.

"What are the names of the gods they worshipped?

What gods do you worship under Sabazianism or worship of the wandering stars?

That's as simple as "who was buried in Abraham Lincoln's tomb?"

And yet it fools MOST of the people MOST of the time especially if they are latter day sorcerers.


http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso ... 05245.html

Jewish Virtual Library: DIONYSUS, CULT OF, the cult of the Greek god of wine and fertility. The non-Jews of Alexandria and Rome alleged that the cult of Dionysus was widespread among Jews. Plutarch tarch gives a Bacchanalian interpretation to the Feast of Tabernacles:

"After the festival called 'the fast' [the Day of Atonement], during the vintage, the Jews place tables laden with different fruits in booths of thickets woven from vines and ivy. Their first festival is called by them Sukkah (). A few days later, the Jews celebrate another festival, which one may simply call a Bacchanalian festival. For this is a festival on which the Jews carry fig branches and sticks adorned with ivy and carry them into the Temple. One does not know" adds Plutarch "what they do in the Temple. It seems reasonable to suppose that they practice rites in honor of Bacchus. For they blow small horns as the people of Argos do during the festival of Dionysus, and call upon their god. Others, who are called Levites, walk in front, either in allusion to Lysios () perhaps 'the god who attenuatescurses' or because they call out 'Euius,' i.e., Bacchus."


They piped hoping that Jesus would sing or lament and dance the Dionysus initiation into the gay brotherhood.

The Scribes (speakers, singers, instrument players, composers) kept the record of the NOT-commanded King, kingdom, temple, sacrificial system and exorcism music. The Scribes DESCRIBE but do not PRESCRIBE.

The church is built upon the foundation of the Prophets (by Christ) and the Apostles who were eye-- and ear-- witnesses of the risen Christ. You SPEAK the Word to TEACH the Word: you do not turn a DISCIPLE TO CHRIST school of the Word into a Warrior's Boast song.

If God abandoned the Jacob-cursed Levi tribe to worship the starry host.
What god did the Levi tribe worship?

Answer that and we will put a gold star on your card.

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Rocnar
Rocnar

April 16th, 2011, 8:27 pm #29

#15 is Halal 150: not a psalm. Kings and Levites made boast songs to make war: 150 is inspired in that it is an accuraterecord. It is not inspired as a pattern for the School of what Jesus commanded to be taught.

*******************************************************************************

Just as I thought. You don't believe it to be the Inspired Word of God. I think we are done here.
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Joined: July 29th, 2010, 2:32 pm

April 16th, 2011, 11:15 pm #30

The exodus from Egypt is an inspired record: it is not inspired as prescriptive for us. I assume that most people can grasp that.

The building of the Ark is an inspired record: it is not inspired as a command for us to build an ark.

If David wanted to halal or make himself vile as a warrior that has no recommendation to us unless we want to be thick headed and praise God that He let him put our boot on the heads of the unwashed.

Chorus Echo, the nymph of Cithaeron, returns thy words, which resound beneath the dark vaults of the thick foliage and in the midst of the rocks of the forest; the ivy enlaces thy brow with its tendrils charged with flowers.

"cymbalum': cymbala were hollow hemispheres of metal a few inches in diameter, held one in each hand by the aid of small rings or thongs attached to the center of their convex surfaces. Struck together, they gave a sharp, clanging sound that fitted well with that of the tympana and tibiæ; cf. Catul. 64.262 ``tereti tenuis tinnitus ære ciebant''; Ov. Fast. 4.184 ``æra tinnitus ære epulsa dabunt''; Ov. Fast. 4.189 ``sonus æris acuti''; Aus. Epist. 24.23 ``tinnitus atinnitus aëni.eumlaut;ni.'' Symbol of the effeminate.

Echeo (g2278) ay-kheh'-o; from 2279; to make a loud noise, i.e. reverberate: - roar, sound.

Echos (g2279) ay'-khos; of uncert. affin.; a loud or confused noise ("echo"), i.e. roar: fig. a rumor: - fame, sound.

"It was probably usual to welcome a king or general with music and dancing...The distinctly religious dance is more frequently mentioned. The clear instances of it in the Bible are the dance of the women of Israel at the Red Sea, headed by Miriam with her tambourine (Ex 15:20); the dance of the Israelites round the golden calf (32:19); the dance of the maidens of Shiloah at the annual feast (Jgs 21:19 ff); the leaping or limping of the prophets of Baal round their altar on Carmel (1 K 18:26); and the dancing of David in front of the ark (2 S 6:14-16) (Int. Std. Bible Ency., p. 1169-70).

"This membranophone, translated in the AV as 'timbrel' and 'tabret,' was not permitted in the Temple, although it was mentioned in the Psalter and in religious hymns" (Ps 150:4; Jer. 31:4) Harrison, Into to OT, p. 988).


We make allowances for the brightest of the theologians in that none of them grasp that NO one played instruments IN THE TEMPLE.
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