PPB
PPB

September 14th, 2005, 5:33 pm #11

PPB,

The Ex-C of C site has several principal topic headings under which people may start threads, like "The Bible", "The Church," etc. (although that web site is supposedly not considered "Christian" as such). In which thread did you find Kent's post that essentially invited you to end your life?
Bill,

Under the "Bible" category. Look down towards the end of the page for "Rules of the C of Christ". Kent's little list of humor...

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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

September 14th, 2005, 9:34 pm #12

PPB,

Thanks, I found Kent's post at Ex-C of C. He definitely invited you take a flying leap off a tall building, just as you said he did.

Immediately prior to his, I noted your "guest" post concluded with this statement:

"Oh, and Kent, take a lesson from a 9 year-old, 'The only reason people use cuss words is because they aren't smart enough to have a good answer.' Out of the mouths of babes." I think that bit of profound truth caused his explosion.
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kent
kent

September 15th, 2005, 1:13 am #13

both of you are gutless.

besides, i can bounce an email address around the world 10 times and back, i dont need an isp.
what you 2 know about the net would fill a thimble.

BTW, i would never send anyone a threatning email. even i think that is vile
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Donnie Cruz
Donnie Cruz

September 15th, 2005, 10:44 am #14

<font size=3 color=indigo face=times new roman>Kent,

We’ve already learned plenty from you. Not about anything … but about you. So, I think that it’s time to get back to the substance of this thread. What is the expression “original teachings” referring to in the initial post? Would you consider “traditions” after the apostolic era part of the original teachings and of the same importance as the Holy Scripture?

Your thoughtful and biblical or well-researched response to the simple questions above will be posted below this post.

Donnie </font>
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Amazed
Amazed

January 31st, 2006, 10:35 pm #15

While perusing this train wreck also known as a website that I can't make myself look away from, I came across this encouraging thread. Seems like y'all took Kent and his postings WAY out of context. You do it to the Bible, what's to keep you from doing it to poor ole Kent?

Anyway, Donnie Boy (as Kent calls him in the Viper's Den) requested we get back to the original topic. I tried. I truly did. I began reading the "Letter to those who don't like this website" or whatever it's so eloquently called, and I got through an entire paragraph.

The first paragraph talks about false teachers. I don't have to read the rest to know what type of Christian he is talking about. If all you have to do is be ignorant to get a letter posted here, I'm surprised there aren't more. FALSE TEACHERS in the Bible, are people who deny the divinity of Christ. They ARE NOT people who worship God with instruments and clapping.

People you call change agents are not false teachers. They are people you disagree with. Big difference. I said before, call them what you want, but I feel as brothers, it is my duty to warn you that accusing someone of something that serious is a BIG-TIME sin, and I want to help keep you all fire-proof.
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Rick
Rick

February 1st, 2006, 2:16 pm #16

It's a sad commentary when the only people making sense on this thread are the ones who are considered critics. When I read the "letter" at the beginning of this thread all I could think of was, "How could they talk about Mr. Sublett this way? He's one of their own." Then I realized how blinded many of you are to your unintentional self-parody.

That is truly funny in a most ironic fashion.

Rick
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Ken Sublett
Ken Sublett

February 1st, 2006, 10:42 pm #17

Following is a letter to those who dislike this site and the men who have given their time and effort to preserving God's Truth. I am curious as to how some of you will react to what was written. I hope you will respond.

Kent, try to keep the devil in check and curtail the curse words as much as you can. As I told you on another site many months ago, I will continue to pray for you.

_____________________________________________________________________________________

"As a Christian, I am concerned with the amount of false teachers that are bringing division and inaccurate information to the Church. I hope that all of us understand that false teachers are not new to this world and have been creating problems since man began. Do we forget the sly speech of the serpent? The problem is that these false teachers are not always easy to recognize. They seem to be one of us – friendly, kind, caring.

What worries me is how many people have fallen for their flowery, but empty speeches, and will continue to do so. They have turned member against member and families against families. They discredit and openly disparage those that stand firm to the original teachings. They make the true followers appear closed-minded, legalistic and old fashioned. They laugh and shake their heads at those who abide by all of the Word, stating that times have changed and certain authorities no longer apply.

In their greed for power, they use their followers without remorse, yet sit amongst us as if our friend. They do not follow God’s will but their own desires. They applaud themselves for their large following, knowing that they lead people from the Truth. They make many promises to their followers and teach them that they have the freedom to do as they wish.

You will know them by their emotional speeches which are empty of Truth. Their “truth” is intended to mislead and fulfill the emotional and physical needs of the people. They do NOT teach God’s Will but instead, seek to meet the worldly needs of the people, thereby leading large numbers of people down the path of sin. They have turned their backs on the Word of God and fail to teach it as it was written. God has said that it would be better for their followers to have never known the Truth than to have known it and been led astray. For only punishment awaits those that fall from righteousness.

What about the false teachers’ souls? God has stated that he has prepared retribution for them. Did you think that the God who flooded earth and destroyed Sodom and Gomorrha would forget those who failed to obey his Word? Did you think that because we are under a new law that he will be kinder to those that disobey his commands? Surely you have read the New Testament and the words of Jesus and the Apostles? No such kindness will be given to those who fail to follow ALL his commandments.

As Christians, we have been given a job to do. God has clearly stated that being steadfast in our beliefs is paramount. This means we are to be steadfast in teachings and behaviors. We are not to change our beliefs to fit our World because we are not to be of our world. We are to follow the will of the Lord and not our own. The path will not be easy. We were warned that false teachers would come and lead many astray. Why are we so shocked that God’s Truth has come to pass?

Remember, these false teachers are unable to fully understand Paul’s and the Apostles’ writings. Instead, we should remember that judgment day is coming and that this earth will pass away. Even though God does not want to lose even one soul, He understands that most will turn away from Him. He waits patiently but painfully for the time when Jesus will return like a thief in the night. We must wait patiently and knowingly for that day. We must NOT lose faith in the Truth. We must follow ALL of the writings of the Apostles as the Lord commanded. Not part, but all. We must not let the sinful world lead us away from the One path. We must continue to believe and grow in grace and knowledge.

Sincerely,

Name withheld at this time"


A false teacher is someone who teaches something Jesus DID NOT teach, the Apostles DID NOT TEACH and is therefore NOT necessary to carry on the EKKLESIA. Those who ADD something not absolutely necessary to the pose of Christ deliberately SOW DISCORD and that is why they are called SECTARIAN or HERETICS. Amazingly amazing (meaning out of your wits) the predominant HERESY method was arousing EXCITEMENT in the ekklesia which is defined as TEACHING THE WORD. The METHOD of arousal was exciting forms of SINGING and the people who introduced the HERESY were called DEMAGOGUES and the motive is explained by the word KLEPTOMA.

GOD HAS ALREADY "HELPED" US BY SENDING HIMSELF AS LIVING WORD AND HE PROMISED TO GUIDE THE APOSTLES INTO ALL TRUTH.
  • <font color=blue>Is.8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

    Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.</font>
Is the New Testament less inspired than the Old Testament?

"Teaching the Word as it has been taught" is a MARKER by which false teachers can be identified. If the church does not leave the WORD just where inspiration placed it there is NO WAY we can tell whether someone is a Shepherd or a Wolf. ALL who claim some supernatural guidance ALL differ with EVERYONE ELSE. So, why accuse the Spirit of Christ with being incompetent?
  • <font color=blue> 2 Pet 1:1 SIMON Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

    2 Pet 1:2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

    2 Pet 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
    • Lu.1:77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

      Ju.1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
    2 Pet 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

    2 Pet 1:5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue, knowledge;

    2 Pet 1:6 And to knowledge, temperance; and to temperance, patience; and to patience, godliness;

    2 Pet 1:7 And to godliness, brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness, charity.

    2 Pet 1:8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    2 Pet 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

    2 Pet 1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

    2 Pet 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

    2 Pet 1:12 Wherefore I will not be negligent to put you always in remembrance of these things, though ye know them, and be established in the present truth.

    2 Pet 1:13 Yea, I think it meet, as long as I am in this tabernacle, to stir you up by putting you in remembrance;

    2 Pet 1:14 Knowing that shortly I must put off this my tabernacle, even as our Lord Jesus Christ hath shewed me.

    2 Pet 1:15 Moreover I will endeavour that ye may be able after my decease to have these things alway in remembrance.

    2 Pet 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

    2 Pet 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

    2 Pet 1:18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.

    2 Pet 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
    • 2Co.3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
    2 Pet 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. </font>
That means FURTHER EXPOUNDING: even if an Angel from heaven tells you something different.
  • <font color=blue>2 Pet 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
    • 1 Pe 1:11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
    2 Pet 2:1 BUT there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

    2 Pet 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

    2 Pet 2:3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not. </font>
Why take a chance: don't fail to JUSTIFY Christ by denying that he had the SPIRIT WITHOUT MEASURE which means that he spoke the WORDS OF GOD FULLY.

The DIRECT COMMAND is NOT to pleasure which connectes to the heresy, lifting, music, demagogue and kleptoma sequence of words WELL CONNECTED for the reader.

The direct command is to use ONE MIND and ONE MOUTH and speak THAT WHICH IS WRITTEN which Paul "further expounds" by calling it SCRIPTURE. The other "singing" passages which are not musical directly command the same INSPIRED TEXT.

The purpose was to EDIFY or EDUCATE and GLORIFY GOD. If JESUS PAID IT ALL then there is no TASK nor FUNDING for anyone who does not "teach that which is written" or "teach that which has been taught." The PATTERNISM was given to Timothy to "give attendance" (the only worship word) to the PUBLIC reading of the WORD and to admonishing that we all OBSERVE it and explain the DOCTRINAL content. That is what PAUL did when he went OUT as a missionary. We have EXAMPLES of him conducting EKKLESIA. No sanging, clanging or getting paid for human philosophy or teaching FALSE SCIENCE.

Peter has laid down a MARK: if they do not speak that which has been revealed and validated by GOD INCARNATE they are a FALSE TEACHER. Case closed. Anyone who thinks that loud singing and intruments are NOT condemned at every opportunity in the Bible and church history is truly AMAZED which was the ALTERED STATE the musicators performed to pick your pockets. John points directly to the holy whore under APOLLO or Abaddon or Apollyon documented and avaliable unless you have been brain damaged by a PhDuh in "bible."
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PPB
PPB

February 2nd, 2006, 2:25 am #18

While perusing this train wreck also known as a website that I can't make myself look away from, I came across this encouraging thread. Seems like y'all took Kent and his postings WAY out of context. You do it to the Bible, what's to keep you from doing it to poor ole Kent?

Anyway, Donnie Boy (as Kent calls him in the Viper's Den) requested we get back to the original topic. I tried. I truly did. I began reading the "Letter to those who don't like this website" or whatever it's so eloquently called, and I got through an entire paragraph.

The first paragraph talks about false teachers. I don't have to read the rest to know what type of Christian he is talking about. If all you have to do is be ignorant to get a letter posted here, I'm surprised there aren't more. FALSE TEACHERS in the Bible, are people who deny the divinity of Christ. They ARE NOT people who worship God with instruments and clapping.

People you call change agents are not false teachers. They are people you disagree with. Big difference. I said before, call them what you want, but I feel as brothers, it is my duty to warn you that accusing someone of something that serious is a BIG-TIME sin, and I want to help keep you all fire-proof.
Amazed,

How sad for you. That "letter" you so rudely and arrogantly dismissed is an actual letter written by the Apostled Peter and recreated in today's verbage - keeping to the original content and correct translation.

So, I guess you need to have a little talk with God on how he let his "ignorant" apostles run amok and how they didn't know the difference between a "false teacher" and a "change agent".

The fact of that letter also makes Rick look...well...pathetic.

But then, that's how I expected those who didn't truly know the Bible and were unwilling to give up their own personal wants for God's.

Thanks or making my point.
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Dr. Bill Crump
Dr. Bill Crump

February 2nd, 2006, 6:16 am #19

As best I can determine, the letter which heads this thread is a compact, modernized version of 2 Peter, chapters 2 and 3. It very well nails false prophets and false teachers, even pointing out how they will bring in their heretical teachings "privily" (by stealth, secretly, as is the motive of the Change Movement). This section of Peter's epistle not only describes those whom we would now label as "change agents" of his day but also those to come, who, with pleasant and enticing words, will CHANGE the Gospel, the New Testament, and the Church to suit their own agenda and preferences. These false teachers/change agents will initially enjoy a large following (just as they now do in the Change Movement), yet they ultimately will meet with destruction:

"But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not" (2 Peter 2:1-3 KJV).

Discerning readers will be able to see the parallels between the modernized letter above and Peter's epistle. Change agents and other supporters of the Change Movement will only scoff at and deny the parallelism.
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Rick
Rick

February 2nd, 2006, 3:35 pm #20

A false teacher is someone who teaches something Jesus DID NOT teach, the Apostles DID NOT TEACH and is therefore NOT necessary to carry on the EKKLESIA. Those who ADD something not absolutely necessary to the pose of Christ deliberately SOW DISCORD and that is why they are called SECTARIAN or HERETICS. Amazingly amazing (meaning out of your wits) the predominant HERESY method was arousing EXCITEMENT in the ekklesia which is defined as TEACHING THE WORD. The METHOD of arousal was exciting forms of SINGING and the people who introduced the HERESY were called DEMAGOGUES and the motive is explained by the word KLEPTOMA.

GOD HAS ALREADY "HELPED" US BY SENDING HIMSELF AS LIVING WORD AND HE PROMISED TO GUIDE THE APOSTLES INTO ALL TRUTH.
  • <font color=blue>Is.8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

    Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.</font>
Is the New Testament less inspired than the Old Testament?

"Teaching the Word as it has been taught" is a MARKER by which false teachers can be identified. If the church does not leave the WORD just where inspiration placed it there is NO WAY we can tell whether someone is a Shepherd or a Wolf. ALL who claim some supernatural guidance ALL differ with EVERYONE ELSE. So, why accuse the Spirit of Christ with being incompetent?
  • <font color=blue> 2 Pet 1:1 SIMON Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

    2 Pet 1:2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

    2 Pet 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
    • Lu.1:77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

      Ju.1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
    2 Pet 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

    2 Pet 1:5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue, knowledge;

    2 Pet 1:6 And to knowledge, temperance; and to temperance, patience; and to patience, godliness;

    2 Pet 1:7 And to godliness, brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness, charity.

    2 Pet 1:8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    2 Pet 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

    2 Pet 1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

    2 Pet 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

    2 Pet 1:12 Wherefore I will not be negligent to put you always in remembrance of these things, though ye know them, and be established in the present truth.

    2 Pet 1:13 Yea, I think it meet, as long as I am in this tabernacle, to stir you up by putting you in remembrance;

    2 Pet 1:14 Knowing that shortly I must put off this my tabernacle, even as our Lord Jesus Christ hath shewed me.

    2 Pet 1:15 Moreover I will endeavour that ye may be able after my decease to have these things alway in remembrance.

    2 Pet 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

    2 Pet 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

    2 Pet 1:18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.

    2 Pet 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
    • 2Co.3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
    2 Pet 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. </font>
That means FURTHER EXPOUNDING: even if an Angel from heaven tells you something different.
  • <font color=blue>2 Pet 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
    • 1 Pe 1:11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
    2 Pet 2:1 BUT there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

    2 Pet 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

    2 Pet 2:3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not. </font>
Why take a chance: don't fail to JUSTIFY Christ by denying that he had the SPIRIT WITHOUT MEASURE which means that he spoke the WORDS OF GOD FULLY.

The DIRECT COMMAND is NOT to pleasure which connectes to the heresy, lifting, music, demagogue and kleptoma sequence of words WELL CONNECTED for the reader.

The direct command is to use ONE MIND and ONE MOUTH and speak THAT WHICH IS WRITTEN which Paul "further expounds" by calling it SCRIPTURE. The other "singing" passages which are not musical directly command the same INSPIRED TEXT.

The purpose was to EDIFY or EDUCATE and GLORIFY GOD. If JESUS PAID IT ALL then there is no TASK nor FUNDING for anyone who does not "teach that which is written" or "teach that which has been taught." The PATTERNISM was given to Timothy to "give attendance" (the only worship word) to the PUBLIC reading of the WORD and to admonishing that we all OBSERVE it and explain the DOCTRINAL content. That is what PAUL did when he went OUT as a missionary. We have EXAMPLES of him conducting EKKLESIA. No sanging, clanging or getting paid for human philosophy or teaching FALSE SCIENCE.

Peter has laid down a MARK: if they do not speak that which has been revealed and validated by GOD INCARNATE they are a FALSE TEACHER. Case closed. Anyone who thinks that loud singing and intruments are NOT condemned at every opportunity in the Bible and church history is truly AMAZED which was the ALTERED STATE the musicators performed to pick your pockets. John points directly to the holy whore under APOLLO or Abaddon or Apollyon documented and avaliable unless you have been brain damaged by a PhDuh in "bible."
PPB,

I just noticed that you mentioned me a few posts back when you wrote, "The fact of that letter also makes Rick look...well...pathetic."

You obviously have great powers of logic, reasoning and rhetoric. In case you didn't catch it, I agreed with the letter to which you refer. What I found so ironically humurous was the fact that you couold not see how it applies to Mr. Sublett.

Now, I don't mind being called pathetic. I've been called far worse by smarter people than you. I would just like you to explain how that letter makes me look pathetic.

Your fsithful correspondent,
Rick
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