Any girls here?

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Any girls here?

Lucille
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Lucille
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Joined: 24 Aug 2007, 14:39

25 Aug 2007, 16:26 #1

I just couldn't believe my luck when I found this site, and it just got better when I found out there was a forum as well - with people like me! Yay!

But... where are all the girls? The women? The ladies? The females? The chicks, the foxes, the birds? Are there any here, any at all? I've been looking around at the nicks, and to me it seems that 98% of the Prefab fan base are guys. And that raises another question - why is that?

I have never, ever in my entire life met another girl who likes Prefab Sprout. Just guys. I find that weird. Any theories?
"In real life, there is no algebra."
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Jim_Williams
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Jim_Williams
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25 Aug 2007, 20:28 #2

It's true that I always hoped I'd meet a female Sprout nut, Lucille. But I never did. I converted a few, though - females into Sprout fans, that is, not sprouts into nuts. I mean, that'd be a miracle.
I feel nothing but pride – that’s all I do feel: an empty pride, a hopeless vanity, a dreadful arrogance, a stupefyingly futile conceit. But at least it’s something to hang on to.
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Jamie
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Jamie
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25 Aug 2007, 20:51 #3

Well, this is just one of the reasons I started 'the great sprout survey.' To find out just exactly what proportion of fans are female - among some other burning questions.
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life's a miracle
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life's a miracle
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25 Aug 2007, 22:47 #4

I think Lucille, Paddy writes alot of lyrics about rebels, renegades. hooligans and people who do things against the grain. Most of his actors and heros are men. These heroes are legends.
Every boy growing up can identify with Robin Hood in "Appetite" or "Jesse James".
Elvis, a simple country boy. tossed into the lime light of fame and carried on his shoulders the whole world of music.,was a great price to pay. Paddy's resurrection of Elvis, was for him to come back as the man El wanted to be and not what the media and the control freaks wanted him to be.
And just the mere mention of the name "Steve McQueen",, even without a song attached to it, produces pure Masculinity.
I think woman like songs that give them a sense of saftey , security and sanity. :)
Music is proof that the human race is greater than it knows
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Jesse James
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Jesse James
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25 Aug 2007, 23:31 #5

I think it's all quite simple:

Women aren't naturally romantic creatures, but instead the focus of the romantic.

Men are more romantic.

Hence, Paddys songs are the idealised way men would like to express themselves, and they link in to the way men think. Paddy, whether he intends to or not (and I doubt he does) writes songs about women for men, not songs for women by a man. Because they're sensitive lovey dovey songs people erroneously assume that girls should get it, forgetting completely that women are driven in their tastes (and let's limit this to pop music) by sex. Prefabs music just isn't very sexy, and the female exceptions that are into PS invariably fancy Paddy.

That's my motherf**kin' theory ;)
Call me Dave.
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life's a miracle
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life's a miracle
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26 Aug 2007, 00:45 #6

First of all, congrats Jesse Ed James on your 1000 or more posts. Jamie should create some kind of "Wall of Fame" for poster of 1000 or more. Just for memory sake.

Not a bad point on your theory. I don't think it is a Question of who is more romantic .
The sexes do differ on this subject. For example, consider the sissy male who does the "Honey do list" for his woman because he gets a boner just to see her get all fuzzy and pats him on the head like a good little dog but a real ,real man HAS to be romantic. Do you think all them birthday cards, bed of roses , trips to the Bahamas etc. ect.ect. are done by men because they are romantic. I don't think so. the trick is to make woman think men are romantic for one thing and one thing alone. NO MAN WANTS TO GET CUT-OFF BY HIS WOMAN !. So, the trick is to make them think you are being truly sincere and romantic and I think Paddy touches on this at times and feels a lot of energy is wasted on something that men HAVE to do.

Oh ! and by the way. Your theory shouldn't be a motherf**kin theory. It should be called, fatherf**kin theory because that is who we men learn all this from. Good Ol dad.
;) :) :lol: ....................> No lie on all these faces.
Music is proof that the human race is greater than it knows
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Jesse James
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26 Aug 2007, 01:08 #7

I have to disagree completely. It's in my contract.

I'm not talking about wine and chocolates here.

Ok, women are partly designed to give birth and rear children.That's the gritty, earthy side of things. As a result, they are far tougher in sensibility, or perhaps the right term is realistic. They're not soppy creatures and if a woman happens to be encouraging you to treat her it's more for pragmatics than romantic craving. Also, I believe that when it comes to popular cultural things like pop music, there is a strong sexual components for women. It's a different kind of 'love' for men, often far more a version of hero worship (another romantic trait that women seem to lack)

Bit of a cliche, but Barry White doesn't melt womens hearts as much as he gets them racing.

Also, take something like Bridgette Jone's Diary. Haven't read it, but from what I've seen of the serialisations way back when, it's a load of to do lists and ways to lose weight, gain partner, get job, ect ect. It's not the sort of high flown romantic stuff that males are often attracted to.

Anyway, I know, I know the cliche of the soppy romantic woman and the absent hearted dope down the shed, but it's a myth. The bloke is building (in his head) some amazing piece of furniture which he imagines adorning some palace hall, or being passed down from generation to generation, whilst the lass is inside clearing up shit and wondering what's so important about a lousy cupboard and what time x and y have to be done.

Or another way to put it is that, in romantic terms, men can be asexual (if that's the right word) in their romantic scope (like Prefab Sprouts music is) whilst women always seem to have a strong sexual element with their romance, something more tangible perhaps.

And maybe something like the paradox of how stupidly romantic you'd have to be to either plan or lead a war might help. Can you imagine many women thinking a full scale invasion, for instance, made one iota of sense? Let alone planning one.

Anyway, moan, criticise, point up sweeping generalisations, but it's the truth. ;)

I know, if this post is followed up, I'll get "But my friend Susan" , and "What do you mean by asexual :rolleyes: ??" or perhaps more intelligent criticism like "It sounds as if you're in fact just saying that women are less imaginative than men whilst pretending to praise them for their unsung strength and pragmatism."

Now that is a good point
Do you think all them birthday cards, bed of roses , trips to the Bahamas etc. ect.ect. are done by men because they are romantic. I don't think so. the trick is to make woman think men are romantic for one thing and one thing alone. NO MAN WANTS TO GET CUT-OFF BY HIS WOMAN !. So, the trick is to make them think you are being truly sincere and romantic
Yeah, but Paul, for all the tricks and the motions you say you go through you also adore the (and I almost quote you) sentimental nostalgic journey of something like 'Andromeda Heights'. I can't imagine a real equivalent for a woman. Perhaps I haven't expressed myself brilliantly, but I think that if you scratch below the surface of these "woman are romantics, men are feet on the ground" I believe that almost the opposite would be true. I think that explains something like why most woman don't find Prefab Sprout as appealing as men do. Women, I imagine, would want something more direct, more sexual.

Paddys voice is too sweet for women as well.
Call me Dave.
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Jim_Williams
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26 Aug 2007, 08:03 #8

life's a miracle @ Aug 25 2007, 10:47 PM wrote: I think women like songs that give them a sense of saftey , security and sanity. :)
Ouch! When it comes to being patronising, that's pretty much off the scale; and there's a few women down my way that'd like to give you a good slap. That said, a great many women, let alone men, would nod in agreement with you. It seems to ring true in a world of 'chick flicks' and undemanding, but reassuring pop music. I still don't think it is true, though.
I feel nothing but pride – that’s all I do feel: an empty pride, a hopeless vanity, a dreadful arrogance, a stupefyingly futile conceit. But at least it’s something to hang on to.
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Jamie
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Jamie
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26 Aug 2007, 09:27 #9

Some of this stuff is treading pretty close to the line! At least Lucille has got the answer to her question of why there aren't any women on the forum. They've all been scared away!

All I have to say is, I wish I could meet some of these 'women driven by sex' Jesse describes. :D
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Lucille
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Lucille
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Joined: 24 Aug 2007, 14:39

26 Aug 2007, 10:37 #10

Sweet Prefab heaven - I've created a monster!
First of all, I respect your point of views ('cause you're all Prefab-fans and I love you), and it is an interesting discussion this whole male/female thing you all got going here, but I think it's completely, compleeeetely wrong.

Most of your theories are clichés, but then again, we live in a world full of stereotypes, and there are probably women who would agree with your ideas. I'm not one of them. But then again, I'm not your "average woman" (whatever that is), but for me that means that I don't think having children, making apple pie, matching the curtains with the sofa and so on is the meaning of life. For me it isn't, anyway.

You have to be both clever and strong to see through all of that and carve your own identity and decide who you want to be, regardless of stereotypes and expectations of how you should be or behave. I think I managed to do just that, so my input might be slightly different.

Jesse James:
"...the female exceptions that are into PS invariably fancy Paddy."
I can only speak for myself, and I would be into the music even if Paddy looked like Shane McGowan x 10. You make it sound like women can't be really into music unless there's a hottie singing it. Well, you're dead wrong.

Life's a miracle:
"I think women like songs that give them a sense of saftey, security and sanity."

Haha. What? No, they don't. Please don't boil it down to just gender, it's not that simple. I like Tom Waits, Sex Pistols, Thin Lizzy, John Lee Hooker, Neil Young, Nine Inch Nails, The Cramps, Beaste Boys, NWA etc etc. Not very "safe" and "sane" music. And I hate chocolate and roses, but even more I hate Bridget Jones' Diary, I drink stout and Guiness (can't stand wine) etc etc.
I think what kind of music you like simply is a result of your upbringing and childhood. My dad was really into music, good music, he was passionate and taught me to appreciate the likes of John Lee Hooker, John Mayall and the Bluesbreakers, Stones, Beatles, and so on. He's the one responsible for my gigantic passion for music, and the female music nerd is as common as the male one, and if you have a true passion for music you don't - you can't - limit yourself.

Then of course, we have females who like Barry White, Ronan Keating, James Blunt and whatever, who like really emotional and soppy music, but hey, guys do that too (they just won't admit it). We're all different and there are both guys and girls at both ends of the scale, so I think gender has nothing what so ever to do with your musical preferences.

So I say it's the stereotypes. The guys really take on to the whole "rebels, renegades, hooligans and people who do things against the grain", Steve McQueen and machinegun Ibiza 'cause that's how it's supposed to be, right? And the girls continue to spill white wine on their short skirts, listening to sexy sexyman Barry White thinking that Prefab Sprout, nah, that's just for the guys, hihi.
"In real life, there is no algebra."
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Jim_Williams
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Jim_Williams
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26 Aug 2007, 11:17 #11

Lucille @ Aug 26 2007, 10:37 AM wrote: Sweet Prefab heaven - I've created a monster!
First of all, I respect your point of views ('cause you're all Prefab-fans and I love you), and it is an interesting discussion this whole male/female thing you all got going here, but I think it's completely, compleeeetely wrong.

Most of your theories are clichés, but then again, we live in a world full of stereotypes, and there are probably women who would agree with your ideas. I'm not one of them. But then again, I'm not your "average woman" (whatever that is), but for me that means that I don't think having children, making apple pie, matching the curtains with the sofa and so on is the meaning of life. For me it isn't, anyway.

You have to be both clever and strong to see through all of that and carve your own identity and decide who you want to be, regardless of stereotypes and expectations of how you should be or behave. I think I managed to do just that, so my input might be slightly different.

Jesse James:
"...the female exceptions that are into PS invariably fancy Paddy."
I can only speak for myself, and I would be into the music even if Paddy looked like Shane McGowan x 10. You make it sound like women can't be really into music unless there's a hottie singing it. Well, you're dead wrong.

Life's a miracle:
"I think women like songs that give them a sense of saftey, security and sanity."

Haha. What? No, they don't. Please don't boil it down to just gender, it's not that simple. I like Tom Waits, Sex Pistols, Thin Lizzy, John Lee Hooker, Neil Young, Nine Inch Nails, The Cramps, Beaste Boys, NWA etc etc. Not very "safe" and "sane" music. And I hate chocolate and roses, but even more I hate Bridget Jones' Diary, I drink stout and Guinness (can't stand wine) etc etc.
I think what kind of music you like simply is a result of your upbringing and childhood. My dad was really into music, good music, he was passionate and taught me to appreciate the likes of John Lee Hooker, John Mayall and the Bluesbreakers, Stones, Beatles, and so on. He's the one responsible for my gigantic passion for music, and the female music nerd is as common as the male one, and if you have a true passion for music you don't - you can't - limit yourself.

Then of course, we have females who like Barry White, Ronan Keating, James Blunt and whatever, who like really emotional and soppy music, but hey, guys do that too (they just won't admit it). We're all different and there are both guys and girls at both ends of the scale, so I think gender has nothing what so ever to do with your musical preferences.

So I say it's the stereotypes. The guys really take on to the whole "rebels, renegades, hooligans and people who do things against the grain", Steve McQueen and machinegun Ibiza 'cause that's how it's supposed to be, right? And the girls continue to spill white wine on their short skirts, listening to sexy sexyman Barry White thinking that Prefab Sprout, nah, that's just for the guys, hihi.
Hear! Hear! The reply I prayed for. Jim shakes Lucille firmly by the hand, pours her a pint of his beloved Guinness and boasts of his 100 hour-plus Tom Waits collection. And the Pistols, Thin Lizzy, John Lee Hooker and Neil Young? I think you're the girl I dreamt of. :rolleyes:
I feel nothing but pride – that’s all I do feel: an empty pride, a hopeless vanity, a dreadful arrogance, a stupefyingly futile conceit. But at least it’s something to hang on to.
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Lucille
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Lucille
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26 Aug 2007, 11:25 #12

Jim:
Haha, bless your heart - thanks! Great minds think alike, I always say.
Cheers!
"In real life, there is no algebra."
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Jamie
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Jamie
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26 Aug 2007, 11:26 #13

Hehe, you told them Luce! Although, to answer your original question, there is actually another female regular - she was the one with the tattoo.
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Jesse James
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Jesse James
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26 Aug 2007, 16:06 #14

Most of your theories are clichés
Less cliched than your conclusion that "everyone is different" though ;)

Anyway, if you think that I was suggesting that all women like Bridgette Jones Diary then I apologise. I wouldn't be so cruel!!!
Please don't boil it down to just gender, it's not that simple
In all fairness, you did pose a question about gender and musical preference.
I think what kind of music you like simply is a result of your upbringing and childhood. My dad was really into music, good music, he was passionate and taught me to appreciate the likes of John Lee Hooker, John Mayall and the Bluesbreakers, Stones, Beatles, and so on. He's the one responsible for my gigantic passion for music
Ahhh well, there you go then: you inherited the 'male mindset' :P
So I say it's the stereotypes. The guys really take on to the whole "rebels, renegades, hooligans and people who do things against the grain", Steve McQueen and machinegun Ibiza 'cause that's how it's supposed to be, right? And the girls continue to spill white wine on their short skirts, listening to sexy sexyman Barry White thinking that Prefab Sprout, nah, that's just for the guys, hihi.
Well, you're kind of mixing two different points up here. I'm not sure how wine and short skirts came to feature in this chat. This comment maybe? :-
I'm not talking about wine and chocolates here.
Call me Dave.
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Lucille
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Lucille
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26 Aug 2007, 18:02 #15

Jesse James:

I know I did ask a question about gender and musical preference, then I said "don't boil it down to just gender, it's not that simple". Haha. Annoying, isn't it?
Anyway, the point I was trying to make is that maybe the cliché theories are correct when it comes to the relationship women/Prefab Sprout, but when you tried to make some assumptions about what kind of music women tend to like, and why, it all went dead wrong and I couldn't agree less.

I wouldn't call it a "male mindset", as much as my dad's. But I know what you're trying to say, and sure. I've heard it before. I'm not the girly type. More often I prefer to be around men and male friends, 'cause there's this no-nonsense factor... anyway. That's a whole new topic.
"In real life, there is no algebra."
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