1849 Liberty Seated V-5 Half Dime

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1849 Liberty Seated V-5 Half Dime

SLHDCollecter
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Joined: April 20th, 2015, 3:58 pm

February 12th, 2018, 4:13 pm #1

The following images are what I believe to be a Liberty Seated V-5 Half Dime. However, there are no reverse die cracks. Thoughts please.

Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V5 VF30 OBV BULA.jpg
Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V5 VF30 REV.jpg


Second set of images for the same coin:

Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V5 VF30 OBV 142675039877.jpg Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V5 VF30 REV 142675039877.jpg
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yosclimber
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Joined: January 22nd, 2017, 7:44 am

February 12th, 2018, 8:44 pm #2

Nice photos, Ken.

Definitely V-5.
Obverse has the correct date position, and the "Near 6" under digit is plainly visible.
Reverse does not have the V-4 cracks.
The reverse clash pattern matches the plate coin in my PDF.
Those reverse cracks to left ribbon and right stem are extremely light and only visible on a few high grade specimens.
I will update the PDF to note how these cracks are often not visible.  (It also says cracks to both ribbons, but it's really cracks to both stems).

Are you close to having all the 1849 die marriages now?

- Clint
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SLHDCollecter
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Joined: April 20th, 2015, 3:58 pm

February 13th, 2018, 12:46 pm #3

In answer to your question I currently have 22 1849 Liberty Seated Half Dimes. By my reckoning, with the aid of your "1849 Half Dime Attribution Guide", I have identified 4 examples of the V-1, 3 of the V-2, 3 of the V-3, 2 of the V-4, 3 of the V-5, 1 of the V-6, 3 of the V-8 and 3 of the V-8A. Again this is per your guide in which you have noted that the V-7 is a "deep strike of V-8" and, therefore, does not exist as a unique variety. Where as I have not "yet" acquired a coin with which to dispute this claim I do wonder about it's accuracy. Of note is that Stephen Crain in his article "A Visit with William A. Harmon and his Amazing Half Dimes" in Volume 42, Issue 127 of The Gobrecht Journal states that "... I still do not have an example of the of the 1849 V5 in my reference collection, the only 1849 marriage that I am missing ..." This statement implies, to me at least, that Mr. Crain believes that he has at least one example of the 1849 V-7 in his collection. Which, in turn, leads me to assume that the V-7 is a unique variety. Although not one that I am able to readily identify. So. on the one hand, I now have all the identifiable 1849 varieties but, on the other hand, I may be missing (or at least not able to identify) the V-7. Mr. Crain's (aka mrhalfdime) thoughts would be most appreciated at this point. 
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yosclimber
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Joined: January 22nd, 2017, 7:44 am

February 14th, 2018, 6:31 pm #4

As of 2007, MrHalfDime did not have an 1849 V-5 or V-7:
seeking-examples-of-some-half-dime-vari ... .html#p939
Of course, that may have changed in the intervening 11 years.

In addition to the V-7, there is also the V-3A (light reverse crack at left stem), which I did not find in my auction image survey.
It may exist, but the numbering suggests Valentine did not think it was a separate die marriage.

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SLHDCollecter
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Joined: April 20th, 2015, 3:58 pm

February 14th, 2018, 7:45 pm #5

So it could be that 11 years later he too does not believe it exists as a separate variety? Hopefully, he will catch this post and let us know what he believes to be the case.
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SLHDCollecter
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Joined: April 20th, 2015, 3:58 pm

February 15th, 2018, 10:24 am #6

Thank you also for bringing up the V-3A. I have been so engrossed with your attribution guide that I was not paying enough attention to Valentine's text. Upon re-examination of my V-3s I was able to determine that one of them does, in fact, have a light crack from the left stem to the denticles. It also has a much heavier crack from the right ribbon to the denticles. So now it appears I have 2 of the V-3 variety and 1 of the V-3A. 08 Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V3 F15 - OBV BULA (2).jpg 08 Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V3 F15 - REV (2).jpg 08 Seated Liberty Half Dime 1849 V3 F15 - REV cracks (2).jpg
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epc
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epc
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Joined: October 25th, 2015, 9:48 pm

February 15th, 2018, 3:25 pm #7

For the V-3A, could Valentine have meant left ribbon rather than left stem?

Alan

1849 V-3 N62 Rev crop.jpg 1849 V-3 N62 Obv crop.jpg
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yosclimber
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Joined: January 22nd, 2017, 7:44 am

February 15th, 2018, 5:55 pm #8

Ken,
Thanks for sharing your nice V-3(A?) reverse crack photos.
Those are the type of light cracks that are difficult to positively identify in a photo,
but having the coin "in hand" with high magnification and varying the lighting angle would help.
I have seen a few photos where I thought there might be a light crack to the left or right stem tip, but was not confident it was there (or just a toning artifact).

Clint
Last edited by yosclimber on February 15th, 2018, 6:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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yosclimber
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Joined: January 22nd, 2017, 7:44 am

February 15th, 2018, 5:58 pm #9

Alan,
Thanks for sharing your great photos of your V-3(A?).
Yes, that is possible.  It's also possible that the crack continues from the left ribbon to the left stem
(I'm not completely sure from the photos).

Your coin does appear to have the file marks under the foot and right of the right stars, which I find helpful to confirm the V-3 obverse (since the date position is similar to other obverses).

I checked the other V-3 photos, including 2 big ones from CoinFacts, and I don't see other examples of your curving crack under the left ribbon.
Some V-3 photos show the common wavy clash line under TESO, but I don't see this on your coin.

So perhaps the crack you found is an EDS, that became smaller later?  Or maybe the TESO clash line was lapped and your crack is an LDS?

Clint
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SLHDCollecter
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Joined: April 20th, 2015, 3:58 pm

February 15th, 2018, 8:08 pm #10

It would appear to me that we may well have 1 V-3 obverse with 2 different reverses. Certainly, the left ribbon crack on Alan's coin and the right ribbon crack on mine tell us this. Noted, as well, is that neither of these cracks are represented in Clint's excellent guide. Which just goes to show that the Liberty Seated Half Dime series is the series that just keeps on giving. 37 years of coins from multiple mints that very seriously lacks documentation.
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