Graves again...

Graves again...

Joined: January 13th, 2001, 8:30 am

February 9th, 2009, 2:45 am #1

From the news letter I just received in the FAQs section:
The action of hitting down on the ball pinches the golf ball between the club face and ground, this "pinching" action creates spin on the golf ball - the spin creates the lift.

LOL, the only shot that pinches the golf ball between the club face and ground is one that you most assuredly do not want to hit.

Regards, Herbert
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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

February 9th, 2009, 1:59 pm #2

high speed video of impact falls into the same category as science - it's 'bad' and ignored if it doesn't agree with their opinion. Too bad someone in this small community of SA golf is publishing clearly false information.

Peter
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Joined: October 11th, 2001, 7:22 pm

February 9th, 2009, 9:19 pm #3

When someone with "credentials" or is a noted "authority", I have noticed that they often take liberties with "TRUTH" that normal people don't. And when their "science" is called into question, they are indignant and shocked that you would dare to question them. Todd had a long and intimate association with Moe, and he has the blessings of Moe's family, so certainly he must know how Moe swung, and this gives him authority to declare things to his "disciples" without regard for their validity. Those in the camp simply line up to drink the kool-aid.

The global warming debate is a good example of this same type of thinking.
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Joined: April 22nd, 2004, 9:58 pm

February 9th, 2009, 9:26 pm #4

You mean there is no global warming!!??

There is however a pro named Todd Graves who teaches people
to play good golf and if they are on greens and in fairways
they probably don't care whether or not he is a scientist.
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Joined: January 22nd, 2009, 4:38 am

February 9th, 2009, 10:04 pm #5

When someone with "credentials" or is a noted "authority", I have noticed that they often take liberties with "TRUTH" that normal people don't. And when their "science" is called into question, they are indignant and shocked that you would dare to question them. Todd had a long and intimate association with Moe, and he has the blessings of Moe's family, so certainly he must know how Moe swung, and this gives him authority to declare things to his "disciples" without regard for their validity. Those in the camp simply line up to drink the kool-aid.

The global warming debate is a good example of this same type of thinking.
unless someone is correct 100% of the time they are "kool aid Salesmen" --- a reference that itself doesnt have any specific meaning ---- In fact it is very clear that the man this site is dedicated to had many discrepancies from what he said and actually did. ??????
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Joined: September 3rd, 2004, 7:57 pm

February 9th, 2009, 10:07 pm #6

From the news letter I just received in the FAQs section:
The action of hitting down on the ball pinches the golf ball between the club face and ground, this "pinching" action creates spin on the golf ball - the spin creates the lift.

LOL, the only shot that pinches the golf ball between the club face and ground is one that you most assuredly do not want to hit.

Regards, Herbert
do enlighten us on what cause spin and then lift on an iron shot.

If we are publishing "false" information, then we need to be corrected in our information so we can publish information that is true and reliable.

Thanks,
Scott
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Joined: March 6th, 2002, 12:22 am

February 9th, 2009, 11:04 pm #7

From the news letter I just received in the FAQs section:
The action of hitting down on the ball pinches the golf ball between the club face and ground, this "pinching" action creates spin on the golf ball - the spin creates the lift.

LOL, the only shot that pinches the golf ball between the club face and ground is one that you most assuredly do not want to hit.

Regards, Herbert
While I agree that the ball is not actually "pinched" between the club head and the turf and that the rotation of the ball is caused by the loft angle of the club head. However, would it be correct to say that a descending blow would cause the ball to compress slightly more than a blow that is moving on the same plane that the ball is resting on--no divot? It seems to me that on a descending blow the turf would add some resistance albeit very little.

John Spain
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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

February 10th, 2009, 3:49 am #8

unless someone is correct 100% of the time they are "kool aid Salesmen" --- a reference that itself doesnt have any specific meaning ---- In fact it is very clear that the man this site is dedicated to had many discrepancies from what he said and actually did. ??????
Everything I've heard Moe say that did not tally with reality was about what HE did. I never heard one of those statements say that EVERYONE does. In that regard you can accept it as his 'feeling' and go from there in interpreting the real meaning of the statement.

Peter
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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

February 10th, 2009, 4:03 am #9

While I agree that the ball is not actually "pinched" between the club head and the turf and that the rotation of the ball is caused by the loft angle of the club head. However, would it be correct to say that a descending blow would cause the ball to compress slightly more than a blow that is moving on the same plane that the ball is resting on--no divot? It seems to me that on a descending blow the turf would add some resistance albeit very little.

John Spain
Compression of the golf ball is proportional to cluhead speed at impact and centered contact (assuming clean contact i.e. little ball before big ball). The angle of attack does not affect the amount of compression except to the extent that there is a change in the effective loft at impact a result.

Peter
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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

February 10th, 2009, 4:19 am #10

do enlighten us on what cause spin and then lift on an iron shot.

If we are publishing "false" information, then we need to be corrected in our information so we can publish information that is true and reliable.

Thanks,
Scott
Assuming you mean aerodynamic lift, that is a result of backspin on the ball.

Spin is a result of the tangential forces during impact due to the fact that the clubface is not perpendicular to the path:

It[the ball] is slowed down by the tangential force due primarily to friction [with the club face] which begins the creation of backspin.

Gobush - Titleist golf - 'Impact force measurements on golf balls'

Peter
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