New subregion South West

Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

May 18th, 2018, 8:17 pm #1

The West Asian Football Federation was rocked by the departure of Iran and the 'Stans a couple of years back, well now Saudi Arabia wants out from Iran's allies in the region as well.

The "SWAFF" combines South and West but leaves out Qatar, the four Levant teams, and Nepal/Bhutan. Although the Indian FA seems to think they'll stay a part of SAFF and this won't replace it.

A new club tournament has been mooted, no word on the fate of the Gulf Cup. Ultimately I'd love to see Israel feature in some kind of regional tournament, perhaps at youth level.

This comes after Saudi asked Jordan if they could move the WAFF headquarters and got a no.The Saudis already have the Arab-wide FA and the U-23 Islamic Solidarity games headquartered in Jeddah (likely at the same desk as their sports ministry).
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

May 19th, 2018, 3:26 am #2

Israel in a youth tournament: you must be joking!
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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

May 19th, 2018, 12:30 pm #3

Mostly dreaming, yes, although part of the Saudi break from Qatar/Palestine is rumoured to be the Saudi Prince's desire to develop relations with Israel and eventually recognize their legitimacy.

Of course, it could be decades before that translates to the pitch!
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

May 19th, 2018, 1:29 pm #4

themodelcitizen wrote:The "SWAFF" combines South and West but leaves out Qatar, the four Levant teams, and Nepal/Bhutan. Although the Indian FA seems to think they'll stay a part of SAFF and this won't replace it.
So theoretically, the West could keep running with 5 members and the South with a tiny 2 or 3, or perhaps the latter split off into CAFA or AFF? Or they just all go in together to form a 7 or 8-member "SAWAFF"...
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Joined: January 20th, 2009, 11:52 pm

May 19th, 2018, 2:41 pm #5

There was an article about this in the NY Times - https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/18/spor ... d-cup.html
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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

May 19th, 2018, 3:22 pm #6

I can't imagine AFC will allow the political climate to overrule geography in such a way, at least the CAFA split made some sense on a map. Qatar + four doesn't make much of a WAFF, and Nepal and Bhutan don't really fit into CAFA, the EAFF or AFF.
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

May 19th, 2018, 4:38 pm #7

themodelcitizen wrote:I can't imagine AFC will allow the political climate to overrule geography in such a way, at least the CAFA split made some sense on a map. Qatar + four doesn't make much of a WAFF, and Nepal and Bhutan don't really fit into CAFA, the EAFF or AFF.
My question is, why we’re Nepal and Bhutan left out? If Bangladesh and India were included, doesn’t make sense that those two were left out. Out of the three subregions, I think CAFF would make the most sense. Then EAFF followed by the AFF


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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

May 19th, 2018, 6:07 pm #8

All I can think is that the Saudis deemed those two Himalayan countries not worth their place from either a competitive perspective or one of geopolitical influence
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SDb
Joined: January 24th, 2013, 5:10 am

August 24th, 2018, 11:17 am #9

It seems Saudis included countries with large muslim populations and left out the two non-muslim countries. This all is nothing but political nonsense and should be put to an end by AFC.
www.soccer-db.info - football internationals
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

August 24th, 2018, 11:38 am #10

even Iran (large Muslim population) seems to be left out, or am I wrong?
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SDb
Joined: January 24th, 2013, 5:10 am

August 25th, 2018, 9:30 am #11

You haven't been following politics; Saudi and Iran are major political opponents. Iran supports Syria, Lebanon, Qatar and the Palestinians hence why they are all left out.
www.soccer-db.info - football internationals
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

August 25th, 2018, 10:20 am #12

I know, so it is 100% a political decision
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Joined: October 31st, 2006, 5:16 pm

August 28th, 2018, 9:32 am #13

I demand a Himalayan sub-confederation.

Nepal, Bhutan, Tibet, Kashmir, Sikkim and a Sherpa XI.
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Joined: January 16th, 2018, 12:58 pm

August 28th, 2018, 4:33 pm #14

Ladakh can join in as well.
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

August 28th, 2018, 8:00 pm #15

It will be a worrying development if confederations or sub-confederations are organised along non-geographical lines, based on which teams get on with each other.   Bigger members may prefer to exclude the minnows or regionally anomalous countries, or just to value members solely on a basis of revenue potential.
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

August 30th, 2018, 11:59 am #16

https://swaff.org/who-we-are/

So apparently, this federation actually got approval to start. Also if you look at the founding members part of the website, it shows Bhutan and Nepal actually are members of SWAFF. My main concern was what would happen to Bhutan and Nepal but I’m glad they were included in this.


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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

August 30th, 2018, 6:46 pm #17

It might be worth checking someone the statutes (I can't be bothered at the moment) - can an arbitrary subset of national associations combine together to form a new grouping, or do they need approval first?   

Not necessarily a sub-confederation, as it could be transcontinental, e.g. suppose all the Francophone FAs formed a group, or the Commonwealth, or all countries beginning with 'M' or something.

Obviously, they would need approval to hold competitions, but is there anything blocking the principle?
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

September 1st, 2018, 8:28 am #18

nfm24 wrote: It might be worth checking someone the statutes (I can't be bothered at the moment) - can an arbitrary subset of national associations combine together to form a new grouping, or do they need approval first?   

Not necessarily a sub-confederation, as it could be transcontinental, e.g. suppose all the Francophone FAs formed a group, or the Commonwealth, or all countries beginning with 'M' or something.

Obviously, they would need approval to hold competitions, but is there anything blocking the principle?
Is approval even needed to hold their own tournaments/matches? Of course it's required in order for the match to count in rankings/official records, guarantee player release and all that, but I doubt the guest teams playing the Spanish regional sides are needing to ask permission each time, if the likes of Catalonia can secure a venue then beyond that there's nothing really stopping the guest from playing.

But yes, let's see some more arbitrary groupings, not as a replacement for what already exists mind.
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

September 4th, 2018, 8:44 pm #19

You do need permission (on paper at least) to arrange any sort of international match, but within that there are different categories and statuses, which involve e.g. different percentage of levies.
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

September 5th, 2018, 5:34 pm #20

nfm24 wrote:You do need permission (on paper at least) to arrange any sort of international match, but within that there are different categories and statuses, which involve e.g. different percentage of levies.
I'm too tired right now, what levies are these?
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

September 5th, 2018, 5:44 pm #21

Why is it so many people on this forum expect me to look up things for them...
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Joined: October 31st, 2006, 5:16 pm

September 5th, 2018, 6:38 pm #22

nfm24 wrote: Why is it so many people on this forum expect me to look up things for them...
Aren't you the internet?
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

September 5th, 2018, 6:39 pm #23

No, because I have much more offline content than online.
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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

September 15th, 2018, 1:02 pm #24

My understanding is that it was only approved as an inter-confederation type thing like the Islamic Solidarity Games or, as mentioned, la Francophonie. Doesn't displace the existing AFC subconfederations and there's a full-house WAFF Cup scheduled for Iraq later this year.
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

September 15th, 2018, 1:39 pm #25

It can't be an inter-confederation thing because all the members of SWAFF are also members of AFC.

Examples like the Islamic Solidarity Games and the Francophone Games are inter-confederation (or intercontinental*), albeit youth competitions.  Other inter-confederation examples include the Arab Cup/Games or the Copa América Centenario.

* Pedantic note: intercontinental is different from inter-confederation because confederations don't equate bijectively to continents, e.g. Kazakhstan in UEFA etc.
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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

September 15th, 2018, 3:35 pm #26

Fair enough, think of it as more along the lines of the Windward Islands Football Association but if they somehow had Belize or someone from outside CFU. The point is, the territorial integrity of AFC's subzones is supposed to be protected despite SWAFF's "approval".
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

September 15th, 2018, 4:55 pm #27

Yes and FIFA would probably prefer that the subconfederations formed a partition of the confederation, i.e. each member of a confed is a member of one and only one subconfed, with no overlap and nobody left out.

This hasn't been strictly the case before anyway, e.g. when Zambia and Zimbabwe were in CECAFA and COSAFA.
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Joined: February 9th, 2011, 2:58 pm

September 16th, 2018, 5:22 am #28

nfm24 wrote: It can't be an inter-confederation thing because all the members of SWAFF are also members of AFC.

Examples like the Islamic Solidarity Games and the Francophone Games are inter-confederation (or intercontinental*), albeit youth competitions.  Other inter-confederation examples include the Arab Cup/Games or the Copa América Centenario.

* Pedantic note: intercontinental is different from inter-confederation because confederations don't equate bijectively to continents, e.g. Kazakhstan in UEFA etc.
And, if I remember correctly, the Indian Ocean Island Games, in which teams from Asia and Africa take part.
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