2019 Copa America

Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

April 27th, 2017, 3:09 pm #1

So international tournaments are getting a bit like an Oprah audience... You get an expansion! You get an expansion! You get an expansion!
This one seems a bit much even for me, 2016's Centenario was supposed to be a one-off. I'm guessing unless they want to complicate things that the extra 4 spots will take it up to 6 invited teams, there are of course the usual suspects from North America that they can fall back on but also rumours that they might look to Europe for some of the old colonial masters etc to take part.
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Joined: February 9th, 2011, 2:58 pm

April 28th, 2017, 5:36 am #2

mattsanger92 wrote:
but also rumours that they might look to Europe for some of the old colonial masters etc to take part.
Seconding the "back to the origins" proposal, then they could invite also the main African territories the Afro-Brazilians come from (Angola and Congo, for example). It would be a way of not forgetting the past and highlighting the strong links between Africa and Brazil.
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

April 29th, 2017, 11:15 am #3

I think with the whole invitees concept they have precedent to invite pretty much anyone at this point - they had to decline but I'm not sure what ties China have to South America. Of course there are ones who make more sense than others (North America, Latin European nations, Africa, etc.) but it's clear that their primary motivator in this situation is $/€/¥/£ (on a football history basis England and Scotland could be plausible guests for their role in the early days)...
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

April 29th, 2017, 1:39 pm #4

Hmm, I see you are envisioning it being something like the Brazil anniversary tournament in 1972.

As it is entirely about making money, they will only invite teams which add to the marketability.
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Joined: October 31st, 2006, 5:16 pm

May 4th, 2017, 8:52 am #5

I was hoping for Guyana, Suriname, French Guiana, Easter Island, Falkland Islands and South Georgia.
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

May 4th, 2017, 9:10 am #6

or to take the opportunity to play every 4 years a real America cup in stead of two expanded separate competitions.....(or every two years if they think it is not enough...) the lowest ranked S.American teams can play qualifiyng matches with CONCACAF...  
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Joined: February 9th, 2011, 2:58 pm

May 5th, 2017, 3:48 am #7

TheRoonBa wrote:
I was hoping for Guyana, Suriname, French Guiana, Easter Island, Falkland Islands and South Georgia.
Considering that Panama is cut by the Canal, also the Panamanians born in the South American zone might form a national team and get a wild card...
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

March 10th, 2018, 5:43 am #8

they will invite UEFA, CAF and CONCACAF teams to make the number (16)
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

March 10th, 2018, 12:28 pm #9

pieter wrote:they will invite UEFA, CAF and CONCACAF teams to make the number (16)
Really hope they invite the USA to this. We really really need some meaningful games against top competition since we missed out on the World Cup


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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

March 10th, 2018, 2:40 pm #10

USA plays too many games.  Marathon qualification campaigns, and dull friendlies vs uninspiring European teams which often send a second-string lineup.   Some sort of quality control might be better. 

Also there are still relatively few Americans in the top-level Euroleagues, at big clubs.   Addressing that must be a real priority, if they want to step up a level.

Most of that applies to Mexico too.
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

March 10th, 2018, 3:18 pm #11

nfm24 wrote:USA plays too many games.  Marathon qualification campaigns, and dull friendlies vs uninspiring European teams which often send a second-string lineup.   Some sort of quality control might be better. 

Also there are still relatively few Americans in the top-level Euroleagues, at big clubs.   Addressing that must be a real priority, if they want to step up a level.

Most of that applies to Mexico too.
I️ totally agree with you. It doesn’t help playing Bosnia and Ireland with our B teams that mostly has older players. We don’t have a lot of older guys in the top European leagues but the next generation are getting top league contracts by the boat load.

We really need to start using and incorporating our youth to build for the future.

We don’t have any meaningful games until the 2019 Gold Cup, so to be able to play against South American teams would definitely be nice.


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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

March 10th, 2018, 6:12 pm #12

It would be better than space-filler friendlies designed just to sell tickets/shirts/beer.    One advantage the US and Mexico have (or should have) is more "tournament experience" than some of the teams from Europe say.   But there is a quality vs quantity aspect, so I agree, competing in/with South Americans is the best you can aim for.
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

March 11th, 2018, 7:14 am #13

Eagles19 wrote:
pieter wrote:they will invite UEFA, CAF and CONCACAF teams to make the number (16)
Really hope they invite the USA to this. We really really need some meaningful games against top competition since we missed out on the World Cup
Speaking of, whatever happened to the "$ore Losers Cup"? The USA's schedule for 2018 is looking decidedly un-tournamenty right now...
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

March 11th, 2018, 2:04 pm #14

USA are planning a World Cup hosting bid, so doing anything that would piss off FIFA is probably unwise.
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

March 16th, 2018, 5:31 pm #15

The identity of the 6 invitees taking a bit more shape - it will be 3 from North America and 3 from Asia.

Mexico and USA apparently almost certain to take 2 of those spaces, a number of candidates for the rest including (and some of you'll get a real kick out of this) Qatar... Australia also being considered because Eurovision wasn't enough horizon-expanding for them...
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

March 16th, 2018, 5:56 pm #16

I guess the choice of invitees is based partly on trying to get votes for the 2030 World Cup being held in Uruguay (and Argentina) as CONMEBOL wants. 
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

April 7th, 2018, 12:04 pm #17

Qatar will be one of the participating teams
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

April 7th, 2018, 1:07 pm #18

Any chance of Morocco being invited?
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

April 7th, 2018, 1:50 pm #19

nfm24 wrote: Any chance of Morocco being invited?
Seems there will only be Asian and CONCACAF teams....
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

April 12th, 2018, 3:30 pm #20

pieter wrote:Seems there will only be Asian and CONCACAF teams....
Current confirmed invitees: 🇲🇽🇺🇸🇯🇵🇨🇳🇶🇦. Final participant probably from North America.

Also, Brazil apparently thinking 69 years is the right amount of time for a curse to disappear...
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

April 12th, 2018, 3:33 pm #21

mattsanger92 wrote:
pieter wrote:Seems there will only be Asian and CONCACAF teams....
Current confirmed invitees: 🇺🇵. Final participant probably from North America.

Also, Brazil apparently thinking 69 years is the right amount of time for a curse to disappear...
My guess would be Costa Rica or Panama. Should actually make for a pretty competitive tournament


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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

April 12th, 2018, 4:02 pm #22

Eagles19 wrote:
mattsanger92 wrote:
pieter wrote:Seems there will only be Asian and CONCACAF teams....
Current confirmed invitees: 🇺🇵. Final participant probably from North America.

Also, Brazil apparently thinking 69 years is the right amount of time for a curse to disappear...
My guess would be Costa Rica or Panama. Should actually make for a pretty competitive tournament


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And some auto-reformatting job in your reply means that USA and Japan have somehow been replaced by Norway...
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

April 12th, 2018, 4:11 pm #23

mattsanger92 wrote:
Eagles19 wrote:
mattsanger92 wrote: Current confirmed invitees: 🇺🇵. Final participant probably from North America.

Also, Brazil apparently thinking 69 years is the right amount of time for a curse to disappear...
My guess would be Costa Rica or Panama. Should actually make for a pretty competitive tournament


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And some auto-reformatting job in your reply means that USA and Japan have somehow been replaced by Norway...
Huh?


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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

April 12th, 2018, 4:19 pm #24

This once again shows the ongoing foolishness of small flag icons instead of words.
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

April 12th, 2018, 4:25 pm #25

Eagles19 wrote:My guess would be Costa Rica or Panama. Should actually make for a pretty competitive tournament
Panama are a bit weak.  I'd prefer Vanuatu instead of Panama.
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Joined: April 5th, 2012, 10:54 am

April 12th, 2018, 4:30 pm #26

mattsanger92 wrote: And some auto-reformatting job in your reply means that USA and Japan have somehow been replaced by Norway...
You'll be happy to know that's actually the Svalbard & Jan Mayen emoji. Who I'd prefer to see over Vanuatu, incidentally.
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

April 12th, 2018, 4:52 pm #27

Judging from recent tournaments, the football potency of Nordic teams is inversely proportional to their population, so I would expect Svalbard to beat Greenland in the next Copa América final.
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

April 12th, 2018, 5:10 pm #28

Does Bouvet Island count as Nordic?
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

April 12th, 2018, 5:47 pm #29

Not in its own right.  As part of Norway, yes.  Although perhaps it is more suited to tournaments in the Southern hemisphere.   If they take part, then the final will be
Bouvet NaN-NaN Jan Mayen (possibly after penalties).
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Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:43 am

April 13th, 2018, 7:52 am #30

nfm24 wrote:
Eagles19 wrote:My guess would be Costa Rica or Panama. Should actually make for a pretty competitive tournament
Panama are a bit weak.  I'd prefer Vanuatu instead of Panama.
Why not just get Easter Island too?


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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

May 23rd, 2018, 2:42 am #31

It's only 2 invitees for 12 teams in total now, Qatar and Japan. Japan have a history of invites and some surprising cultural links with South America, as for Qatar it might be a trade-off so the Qataris support CONMEBOL's proposal to expand the World Cup early?
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

May 23rd, 2018, 11:18 am #32

You're telling me Sebastian Soria and Emerson Sheikh aren't enough of a cultural link? 😉

While everyone else is riding off their established relationships, Qatar are busy out there making their connections...
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Joined: January 16th, 2018, 12:58 pm

May 24th, 2018, 5:12 am #33

Not forgetting, of course, Pedro "RoRo" Correia, Fabio Cesar, Marconi Amaral, Luiz Martín and Rodigo Tabata, all fine upstanding Qatari citizens.
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Joined: November 21st, 2013, 5:20 am

July 18th, 2018, 11:46 pm #34

A good opportunity for Qatar to compete against South American teams to begin preparations for the World Cup 2022. I guess, Japan will send a U23-Team in view of the Olympic Games 2020.

I hope, this will be the last Southamerican Copa America. The future is the Panamerican Copa America or Panamerican Gold Cup or Toyota North-South-America Futbol Cup or however they like to name.  
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

July 19th, 2018, 1:10 pm #35

Phistra wrote:I hope, this will be the last Southamerican Copa America. The future is the Panamerican Copa America or Panamerican Gold Cup or Toyota North-South-America Futbol Cup or however they like to name. 
Call me an optimist but I think there's plenty of room for all 3 on the calendar, no need to get rid of anything.

Having just a "Copa Panamerica" every 4 years (presumably at 16 teams) severley reduces the opportunities the smaller North American countries get, better just to keep it around as a bonus for teams like Haiti that manage to do well enough to qualify.
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Joined: November 21st, 2013, 5:20 am

July 19th, 2018, 2:32 pm #36

mattsanger92 wrote:
Phistra wrote:I hope, this will be the last Southamerican Copa America. The future is the Panamerican Copa America or Panamerican Gold Cup or Toyota North-South-America Futbol Cup or however they like to name. 
Call me an optimist but I think there's plenty of room for all 3 on the calendar, no need to get rid of anything.

Having just a "Copa Panamerica" every 4 years (presumably at 16 teams) severley reduces the opportunities the smaller North American countries get, better just to keep it around as a bonus for teams like Haiti that manage to do well enough to qualify.
Regardless of the calendar has room, i think the general interest of Gold Cup have to improve. To me it is the second-least interesting continental competition, as of 90 % the winner is USA or Mexico and the host nation is 100 % the USA. 
The Copa America is a competition of high tradition, but it is  boring to see the 324th duel of Argentina - Uruguay. 

Maybe a interconfederational qualifier would be nice, so that everyone has the a chance to qualify. 
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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

July 26th, 2018, 2:59 pm #37

They should scrap one of the Gold Cups (two every four years is too much) as well as the Confederations Cup, and with the free summer have a 24-team Copa America in the US and/or Mexico. Invite Japan, a West African team, etc for competitive purposes.
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Joined: October 31st, 2006, 5:16 pm

July 26th, 2018, 9:08 pm #38

themodelcitizen wrote: They should scrap one of the Gold Cups (two every four years is too much) as well as the Confederations Cup, and with the free summer have a 24-team Copa America in the US and/or Mexico. Invite Japan, a West African team, etc for competitive purposes.
They shouldn't invite any teams from outside the region.  A true continental tournament does not need invited teams.  If there aren't enough competitive teams, reduce it to 20 instead of 24.
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Joined: October 31st, 2006, 5:16 pm

July 26th, 2018, 9:15 pm #39

Phistra wrote:
mattsanger92 wrote:
Phistra wrote:I hope, this will be the last Southamerican Copa America. The future is the Panamerican Copa America or Panamerican Gold Cup or Toyota North-South-America Futbol Cup or however they like to name. 
Call me an optimist but I think there's plenty of room for all 3 on the calendar, no need to get rid of anything.

Having just a "Copa Panamerica" every 4 years (presumably at 16 teams) severley reduces the opportunities the smaller North American countries get, better just to keep it around as a bonus for teams like Haiti that manage to do well enough to qualify.
Regardless of the calendar has room, i think the general interest of Gold Cup have to improve. To me it is the second-least interesting continental competition, as of 90 % the winner is USA or Mexico and the host nation is 100 % the USA. 
The Copa America is a competition of high tradition, but it is  boring to see the 324th duel of Argentina - Uruguay. 

Maybe a interconfederational qualifier would be nice, so that everyone has the a chance to qualify. 
The reason for the host being USA is to maximise profits and play in good stadiums and conditions.  As for the finalists being USA and Mexico - it is up to the other teams to get better.  Panama has reached the final a few times.  It's just the way CONCACAF is - there are 2 or 3 biggish teams (Mexico, USA, Costa Rica), a few average teams (Panama, Canada, Jamaica, etc.) and then everyone else.  The best teams tend to reach the final - and it is no coincidence that the best teams often do (USA and Mexico).

If you think about it, the World Cup has had only 8 different winners in 21 editions (and only 13 different finalists).

Only 2 of the finals (2010 and 2018) have not contained one of the big 4 of Brazil, Argentina, Germany/West Germany or Italy.
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

July 27th, 2018, 2:34 am #40

or a 16 team tournament with qualification rounds just like in other continents....USA, Mexico, Brasil and Argentina could be free of this ...
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

July 27th, 2018, 11:29 am #41

TheRoonBa wrote:
Phistra wrote: the host nation is 100 % the USA.
The reason for the host being USA is to maximise profits and play in good stadiums and conditions.
For what it's worth they are opening it up a little now... a handful of matches will be held in other countries at next year's tournament, like a lopsided version of the Euro 2020 plan.
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Joined: November 3rd, 2006, 11:49 am

July 27th, 2018, 12:16 pm #42

so: the nations league qualifiers are also the GC qualifiers....(I hope this time I have it right)
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Joined: July 4th, 2011, 6:46 am

July 27th, 2018, 1:53 pm #43

pieter wrote:so: the nations league qualifiers are also the GC qualifiers....(I hope this time I have it right)
Pretty much, yep.
  • 6 Teams Qualified Already (The 'Hex' teams from World Cup Qualifying): 🇲🇽🇨🇷🇵🇦🇭🇳🇺🇸🇹🇹
  • Other 10 Teams: Top 10 of this
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Joined: October 5th, 2014, 1:11 pm

July 29th, 2018, 5:26 pm #44

Generally agreed about continental competitions, but the Copa América is a special case. (Nominally at least) it represents the entire Américan continent, and if Mexico had won in 2001 it wouldn't have been considered a travesty like if, say, Colombia had won the Gold Cup in 2000.

Also the alternative of an 8 or 10-team based edition doesn't work.

My suggestion for another US-based intercalated edition would invite Japan or an east Asian team to reflect the CONMEBOL tradition of doing so, and a west African invitee would reflect the centuries of cultural interchange (being generous with my wording) between that region and the Americas.

With 24 teams we even have room for the Guianas to auto-qualify and the winner of the ABCS Tournament to reflect their unique status in and out of South America.
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Joined: April 7th, 2007, 12:28 pm

August 11th, 2018, 11:13 am #45

What has the Falklands got to do to get an invite!

How about using the existing Copa (South) América as regional qualifying for the new expanded Copa (all) América.
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