Matching or Non Matching preA ....

Matching or Non Matching preA ....

tomele
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tomele
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Joined: June 15th, 2008, 6:42 pm

February 24th, 2012, 3:00 pm #1

according the best experts of the preV and preA period concerning the non matching and matching dial : they can only be seen on the 201/A and 202/A.

i quote Mister Dirk G.

"I invented a couple of references in 2001, including 'pre-A' (no-one else had ever noticed the differences between the T-SWISS-T and regular A/B series dials at that time) and 'non-matching dial' vs 'matching dial'. The non-matching dial reference was much easier to say than "5218-201/A and 5218-202/A (small matriculation numbers only for the latter, of course - first batch of 90 pcs) early production watches where the varnish on the dial caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood(y) orange..."

That's why I make the rules here.
You're 99% correct - The term "non matching dial" is STRICTLY reserved for 5218-201/A and 5218-202/A early production watches where the varnish did not properly protect the underlying Tritium from aging...
or better 'where the varnish caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood-orange within weeks'
(see picture of that MM).

All the rest have just nicely aged tritium of the indexes on the dials... (5218-201/A, 5218-202/A, 5218-203/A, SlyTech Sub, OP6500 and OP 6502 pre-A and OP6502 A+B series)... but you're not allowed to call that 'non-matching'.


Cheers,
The Supreme Court on this has spoken,
Dirk "

So let me share with you some pics of a preA 002 .
The dial turns to orange like the non matching preV even the hands .
Is it simply an amazing aged tritium of the indexes and the hands ? !

Any thoughts are welcome;

cheers ,

TOMI













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panerimo
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panerimo
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Joined: October 9th, 2006, 11:09 am

February 24th, 2012, 7:26 pm #2

Salut Tomi,

A titre peronnel, je n'ai jamais vu cette configuration.
Is it some "paint" on the minutes hand ?
The hands are steel ?

Here are some pics of what i always seen on a preA 2

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]



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tomele
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tomele
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Joined: June 15th, 2008, 6:42 pm

February 24th, 2012, 9:01 pm #3

i will start to believe " she ' s unique ".

I think the hands are steel and especially FULL tritium !!!

I appreciate your pics , fine comparison : your preA 002 looks like Matching 201/A;

cheers ,

tomi
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tchoo
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tchoo
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Joined: December 27th, 2004, 12:44 pm

February 25th, 2012, 1:48 pm #4

according the best experts of the preV and preA period concerning the non matching and matching dial : they can only be seen on the 201/A and 202/A.

i quote Mister Dirk G.

"I invented a couple of references in 2001, including 'pre-A' (no-one else had ever noticed the differences between the T-SWISS-T and regular A/B series dials at that time) and 'non-matching dial' vs 'matching dial'. The non-matching dial reference was much easier to say than "5218-201/A and 5218-202/A (small matriculation numbers only for the latter, of course - first batch of 90 pcs) early production watches where the varnish on the dial caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood(y) orange..."

That's why I make the rules here.
You're 99% correct - The term "non matching dial" is STRICTLY reserved for 5218-201/A and 5218-202/A early production watches where the varnish did not properly protect the underlying Tritium from aging...
or better 'where the varnish caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood-orange within weeks'
(see picture of that MM).

All the rest have just nicely aged tritium of the indexes on the dials... (5218-201/A, 5218-202/A, 5218-203/A, SlyTech Sub, OP6500 and OP 6502 pre-A and OP6502 A+B series)... but you're not allowed to call that 'non-matching'.


Cheers,
The Supreme Court on this has spoken,
Dirk "

So let me share with you some pics of a preA 002 .
The dial turns to orange like the non matching preV even the hands .
Is it simply an amazing aged tritium of the indexes and the hands ? !

Any thoughts are welcome;

cheers ,

TOMI












are in a similar shade as the markings. Varnish as well?

As imo said, other Pre A2s are very different.

Man, but I can't take my eyes off that dial

Cheers!

TC
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clifW
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clifW
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Joined: January 25th, 2005, 7:19 pm

February 25th, 2012, 4:24 pm #5

according the best experts of the preV and preA period concerning the non matching and matching dial : they can only be seen on the 201/A and 202/A.

i quote Mister Dirk G.

"I invented a couple of references in 2001, including 'pre-A' (no-one else had ever noticed the differences between the T-SWISS-T and regular A/B series dials at that time) and 'non-matching dial' vs 'matching dial'. The non-matching dial reference was much easier to say than "5218-201/A and 5218-202/A (small matriculation numbers only for the latter, of course - first batch of 90 pcs) early production watches where the varnish on the dial caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood(y) orange..."

That's why I make the rules here.
You're 99% correct - The term "non matching dial" is STRICTLY reserved for 5218-201/A and 5218-202/A early production watches where the varnish did not properly protect the underlying Tritium from aging...
or better 'where the varnish caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood-orange within weeks'
(see picture of that MM).

All the rest have just nicely aged tritium of the indexes on the dials... (5218-201/A, 5218-202/A, 5218-203/A, SlyTech Sub, OP6500 and OP 6502 pre-A and OP6502 A+B series)... but you're not allowed to call that 'non-matching'.


Cheers,
The Supreme Court on this has spoken,
Dirk "

So let me share with you some pics of a preA 002 .
The dial turns to orange like the non matching preV even the hands .
Is it simply an amazing aged tritium of the indexes and the hands ? !

Any thoughts are welcome;

cheers ,

TOMI












________________________
Cliffy

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panerimo
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panerimo
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Joined: October 9th, 2006, 11:09 am

February 25th, 2012, 6:09 pm #6

i will start to believe " she ' s unique ".

I think the hands are steel and especially FULL tritium !!!

I appreciate your pics , fine comparison : your preA 002 looks like Matching 201/A;

cheers ,

tomi
What i was saying about minutes hand is the paint that i can see on the edges.
Hands are as if they had been "painted" with the same unique color. I mean if it was patina, the excess tritum on the edges may not have took the same patina as on the center of the hands ?

Whatever we call matching or non matching, the hands never take the same patina as the indexes. Maybe because of the small amount of tritium paint on the back compared to the indexes and their curve design and tritium filled in. I also saw whitish/cream at dark and greenish when at the sun.

For sure this is an unique configuration in my small book. This is a pre360

Here are some other close up of my preA1 and what i always saw on preV or preA. But i'm sure you already know that

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

________________
Gora PBk
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hawaiiantimer
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Joined: September 29th, 2008, 10:07 pm

February 25th, 2012, 7:59 pm #7

according the best experts of the preV and preA period concerning the non matching and matching dial : they can only be seen on the 201/A and 202/A.

i quote Mister Dirk G.

"I invented a couple of references in 2001, including 'pre-A' (no-one else had ever noticed the differences between the T-SWISS-T and regular A/B series dials at that time) and 'non-matching dial' vs 'matching dial'. The non-matching dial reference was much easier to say than "5218-201/A and 5218-202/A (small matriculation numbers only for the latter, of course - first batch of 90 pcs) early production watches where the varnish on the dial caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood(y) orange..."

That's why I make the rules here.
You're 99% correct - The term "non matching dial" is STRICTLY reserved for 5218-201/A and 5218-202/A early production watches where the varnish did not properly protect the underlying Tritium from aging...
or better 'where the varnish caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood-orange within weeks'
(see picture of that MM).

All the rest have just nicely aged tritium of the indexes on the dials... (5218-201/A, 5218-202/A, 5218-203/A, SlyTech Sub, OP6500 and OP 6502 pre-A and OP6502 A+B series)... but you're not allowed to call that 'non-matching'.


Cheers,
The Supreme Court on this has spoken,
Dirk "

So let me share with you some pics of a preA 002 .
The dial turns to orange like the non matching preV even the hands .
Is it simply an amazing aged tritium of the indexes and the hands ? !

Any thoughts are welcome;

cheers ,

TOMI












Dials are one thing... Hands are another...

And aren't we talking about 3-4 years after the fact of the "dodgy" varnish was discovered and done for?

If this can somehow be clarified... It would explain the dial... But the hands??

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tomele
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tomele
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Joined: June 15th, 2008, 6:42 pm

February 25th, 2012, 9:57 pm #8

the only explanation is the application of the same " dodgy" varnish on the dial and the hands

cheers

tomi

OT : watch that

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Asimut
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Asimut
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Joined: July 3rd, 2004, 6:04 am

February 26th, 2012, 6:18 am #9

as this happened only with the first shipments of 201/A and 202/A watches.

If that's the real colour and was not artificially enhanced, it is a very extreme example of patina. I have never seen it go that far.


Here, BTW is a patina'd PAM 40, enhanced. The hands in case you wonder, are SLN.

Ah, the magical saturation button,,,,,






Cheers and best from the holyland,

~Asi~



<a href="http://s67.photobucket.com/albums/h306/ ... d.jpg"></a>
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tomele
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tomele
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Joined: June 15th, 2008, 6:42 pm

February 26th, 2012, 7:25 am #10

it is not a bad joke .I do not want to waste your time with manipulated pics.
here is ,for example, the same pics with and w/o saturation
cheers,
tomi
with

w/o ( no retouch)

with

w/o(no retouch)
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Asimut
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Asimut
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Joined: July 3rd, 2004, 6:04 am

February 26th, 2012, 7:42 am #11

I guess it can happen then.

Cheers and best from the holyland,

~Asi~



<a href="http://s67.photobucket.com/albums/h306/ ... d.jpg"></a>
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kevin5
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kevin5
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Joined: January 16th, 2007, 7:22 pm

February 26th, 2012, 1:07 pm #12

according the best experts of the preV and preA period concerning the non matching and matching dial : they can only be seen on the 201/A and 202/A.

i quote Mister Dirk G.

"I invented a couple of references in 2001, including 'pre-A' (no-one else had ever noticed the differences between the T-SWISS-T and regular A/B series dials at that time) and 'non-matching dial' vs 'matching dial'. The non-matching dial reference was much easier to say than "5218-201/A and 5218-202/A (small matriculation numbers only for the latter, of course - first batch of 90 pcs) early production watches where the varnish on the dial caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood(y) orange..."

That's why I make the rules here.
You're 99% correct - The term "non matching dial" is STRICTLY reserved for 5218-201/A and 5218-202/A early production watches where the varnish did not properly protect the underlying Tritium from aging...
or better 'where the varnish caused the underlying Tritium to turn blood-orange within weeks'
(see picture of that MM).

All the rest have just nicely aged tritium of the indexes on the dials... (5218-201/A, 5218-202/A, 5218-203/A, SlyTech Sub, OP6500 and OP 6502 pre-A and OP6502 A+B series)... but you're not allowed to call that 'non-matching'.


Cheers,
The Supreme Court on this has spoken,
Dirk "

So let me share with you some pics of a preA 002 .
The dial turns to orange like the non matching preV even the hands .
Is it simply an amazing aged tritium of the indexes and the hands ? !

Any thoughts are welcome;

cheers ,

TOMI












faster and more extreme? I've heard this a few times. It could be possible that this PreA 002 spent the first few years of it's life tucked away in a closet or a safe? Anyhow, that is a gorgeous piece!!!

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hongT
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hongT
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Joined: June 8th, 2004, 1:04 pm

February 26th, 2012, 4:56 pm #13

What i was saying about minutes hand is the paint that i can see on the edges.
Hands are as if they had been "painted" with the same unique color. I mean if it was patina, the excess tritum on the edges may not have took the same patina as on the center of the hands ?

Whatever we call matching or non matching, the hands never take the same patina as the indexes. Maybe because of the small amount of tritium paint on the back compared to the indexes and their curve design and tritium filled in. I also saw whitish/cream at dark and greenish when at the sun.

For sure this is an unique configuration in my small book. This is a pre360

Here are some other close up of my preA1 and what i always saw on preV or preA. But i'm sure you already know that

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

________________
Gora PBk
Cheers
HongT

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clifW
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clifW
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Joined: January 25th, 2005, 7:19 pm

February 26th, 2012, 6:58 pm #14

faster and more extreme? I've heard this a few times. It could be possible that this PreA 002 spent the first few years of it's life tucked away in a closet or a safe? Anyhow, that is a gorgeous piece!!!

Esp varnish defect 201/A and 202/A

________________________
Cliffy

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kevin5
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kevin5
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Joined: January 16th, 2007, 7:22 pm

February 26th, 2012, 8:26 pm #15

What're you thoughts on this PreA 002? Is that what you think happened? I've never seen one with this much Patina!

Next question and completely OT...

Given the current market if you were going to buy a vintage Rolex from the 70s.......

5513 or 1665?




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tomele
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tomele
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Joined: June 15th, 2008, 6:42 pm

February 26th, 2012, 8:28 pm #16

faster and more extreme? I've heard this a few times. It could be possible that this PreA 002 spent the first few years of it's life tucked away in a closet or a safe? Anyhow, that is a gorgeous piece!!!

hi Kevin ,
Your theory is a possibility.
Because my English is bad , i give you the explaination about this .
I found this on P.com and saved it to my archives.
"A heavily patina'ed tritium dial will lose maybe some, or even all it's color if exposed long enough to sunlight. This process is called photobleaching. Basically, the molecules that produce the color you see are broken down by the sunlight and become basically white in color. The only real way to preserve the color is to keep the watch in the dark. "

"PS. Humidity is not really a factor in producing or removing the patina (other then the corrosion you see on the metal parts of a watch). The patina comes from the conversion of white phosphorus (which is a main ingredient in the tritium paint) to red phosphorus, which is partially a photolytically driven process. So the same thing that helps create the patina will eventually destroy the patina. Funny how nature works, huh? "

Hope this helps

cheers

tomi
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clifW
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clifW
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Joined: January 25th, 2005, 7:19 pm

February 27th, 2012, 4:03 pm #17

What're you thoughts on this PreA 002? Is that what you think happened? I've never seen one with this much Patina!

Next question and completely OT...

Given the current market if you were going to buy a vintage Rolex from the 70s.......

5513 or 1665?




I think this PreA 2 is lovely, like Asi, I am perplexed at the hands. But never say never, Hitman's 2A of a few years back had the same thing going on.

 

As for Rolex 1665 Sea Dweller all day long, followed by a nice 5512.


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Cliffy

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kevin5
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kevin5
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February 27th, 2012, 7:53 pm #18



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