Follow up to the PreV buckle and strap request

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Follow up to the PreV buckle and strap request

sqrl
Paneristi
sqrl
Paneristi
Joined: February 20th, 2005, 9:31 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 6:43 am #1

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
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Like
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Jpvfx
Paneristi
Jpvfx
Paneristi
Joined: April 8th, 2006, 1:23 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 7:07 am #2

Gee Covac you sure have some material now!

Jp
Makes my single pic's look very lame
Nice one Nick!


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Jason-PAM
Paneristi
Jason-PAM
Paneristi
Joined: June 4th, 2006, 8:11 am

June 2nd, 2008, 7:48 am #3

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
nt

PAM64, PAM170, PAM10B-T

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MauritsB
Paneristi
MauritsB
Paneristi
Joined: January 25th, 2005, 8:12 am

June 2nd, 2008, 8:00 am #4

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl

The history of the Logo-buckles is becoming documented better and better...

I will add some stuff to the buckle info soon too, with pics from Vanni's wonderful collection...

Cheers mate, Maurits




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Like
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Mignatta
Paneristi
Mignatta
Paneristi
Joined: October 12th, 2005, 8:07 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 8:09 am #5

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Indeed straight to the archives.. Thanks a lot for all your trouble posting this
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Like
Share

expat-oz
Paneristi
expat-oz
Paneristi
Joined: April 30th, 2006, 7:08 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 8:25 am #6

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
that's stellar! thanks for the post, the pics, the insights, and the time you took to put this together.

now i'm REALLY hankerin' for more PreV stuff.

bo

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Like
Share

GatsbyTheRat
Paneristi
Joined: November 15th, 2006, 7:44 am

June 2nd, 2008, 8:40 am #7

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Brilliant post!

Cheers,
Gatsby DU

"Courage is the first of human qualities, because it is the quality which guarantees all others" - Winston Churchill


Quote
Like
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ewit
Paneristi
ewit
Paneristi
Joined: January 2nd, 2006, 8:07 am

June 2nd, 2008, 9:18 am #8

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Very much appreciated, Nick.

Thank you !



Quote
Like
Share

pampamkuku
Paneristi
Joined: June 2nd, 2006, 1:56 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 9:50 am #9

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
great post !
Quote
Like
Share

JohnSim
Paneristi
JohnSim
Paneristi
Joined: January 1st, 2005, 8:27 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 10:02 am #10

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
.

----------------
"Everyone's got a plan until they get punched in the face."
--Karl Koschnitzke

Quote
Like
Share

mmomar
Paneristi
mmomar
Paneristi
Joined: February 3rd, 2005, 2:36 am

June 2nd, 2008, 11:01 am #11

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
nt
Quote
Like
Share

otisDU
Paneristi
otisDU
Paneristi
Joined: January 21st, 2007, 1:16 am

June 2nd, 2008, 12:09 pm #12

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Thanks Nick, just great stuff here.

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pant.o.
Paneristi
pant.o.
Paneristi
Joined: June 26th, 2004, 12:23 am

June 2nd, 2008, 1:05 pm #13

Very informative to say the least, thanks for sharing that with us.
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eddieng
Paneristi
eddieng
Paneristi
Joined: July 29th, 2004, 5:01 am

June 2nd, 2008, 4:51 pm #14

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Wow! amazing collection
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Paul-Belgium
Paneristi
Joined: January 30th, 2005, 7:07 pm

June 2nd, 2008, 7:13 pm #15

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Greetings

Polleke

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samen
Paneristi
samen
Paneristi
Joined: January 25th, 2005, 9:39 am

June 3rd, 2008, 2:20 am #16

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
Quote
Like
Share

hadrianuspanerai
Paneristi
Joined: December 9th, 2009, 4:53 am

November 17th, 2010, 4:26 am #17

This is a follow up pictorial to the PreV straps and buckles request
I have TWO types of PreV steel buckle

Two examples of one – on black straps with single keepers (they came to me as 201A straps, but could have been from Slytech designs) – followed by an original 201A buckle (the strap was replaced by Dirk), a PAV 0098 buckle and a brushed Dirk buckle (my favourite brown shark).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

It is clear that Panerai and the logo fonts are finer compared to the 201A and PAV 0098, but not like the rougher thin etching on Dirks. The 201A and PAV 0098 buckles are the same as the one on a thin long 201A strap in the pic below (I no longer have this for a close-up). The thin 201A straps were made by Ornil.

[/IMG]

So, there are at least 2 types of PreV steel buckle – but the situation may be more complicated, from information I pieced together some time ago from posts by Maurits, Dirk and Yves :-

PAVs 0090, 0091 and 0099 were made by Cuoierie Meccaniche Brelli in 1995-1996 and PAVs 0093 and 0098 possibly by another company in Milan (suggested by Yves). They had a fixed and sliding keeper (“the 90/98 and 99 straps were all produced in early 1995 for the aftermarket demand through Panerai's Italian dealer-network - that's why they choose to fit the straps with a second fixed loop for more versatility”).

The original batch of 24mm preV steel buckles was running out by 1995, so that the PAV 0093 and 0099 used 22mm Mare buckles. However, new 24mm buckles were approved when the go ahead was given for the Slytech project in 1995-6. New buckles were made from 316 steel, because the early buckle materials did not meet EEC regulations due to their high nickel content.

However, there may have been three black/beige stitch PAV 0098 versions :-

One was bought from Panerai PreV stock (“that Black SWP Calf with beige stitching - PAV 0098 - was a Stallone request after he purchased his first Luminor - probably a non-matching dial - while paying his first visit to the Cine-Cita studios in Rome”); one strap was made (possibly different manufacturer?) using early PreV buckles; one was made after the buckle manufacturer changed in 1997. This buckle had “longer arrow legs and larger "O" in the logo” and the font was “less sharp and precise than the OP Firenze buckles”. “Plus the tip of the strap was rounded, instead of pointed”.

This suggests there may be another buckle type, since the two that I have similar logo dimensions, although one type is finer.

The following picture comparisons are between preV PVD and PAV Rodiatura buckles on the PAV 0090 and 0099. Rodiatura is a galvanic process, not PVD, and the buckles mark more easily. It is also obvious that the 202A calf and the shark buckle are different and I am not sure why. Can’t be absolutely certain the buckle on the shark is original, or if additional straps were made as replacements – I would welcome seeing other examples.

PreV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The black/black straps and PAV 0099 are Vero Cuoio. My info is that the width of the Vero Cuoio stamp should be 39mm (hide pic plus words) and the "i" between the "O"s is a little elongated. Vero Cuoio straps have a “waffle” texture and central raised portion, whereas the Original Kodiak straps are flat. This is easier to see on the black than the tan PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

Original Kodiak stamps (PAV 0090, 0098), preV and Dirk Vero Squalo stamps - which one is backwards?.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

On the PreV, PAV (24/24) and Dirks, the double grooves just outside the stitches extend to the underside of the buckle end. This is not the case on the PAV 0099.

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

PAV 0099
[/IMG]

They all have a double stitch in the top left corner (and luckily sometimes a PAM attached).

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

The other point worth noting is that the keepers on Dirk’s straps are narrower than on PreV and PAVs. This may differentiate some of the earliest Dirk’s using left over OP stock buckles (and straps he replaced on PreV buckles) from original PreV straps. This can be seen clearly in the following picture.

[/IMG]

The middle and right sharks are Dirk’s.


Overall, this is what I have put together in my own head, so it could be as daft as some of my other ideas. I would certainly bow to the knowledge of people involved at the time, or who have seen a lot more straps over the years than me. Anyway, it was a pleasure to have some time to take pictures this Sunday. You see a lot more glue in macros than you might expect!

Nick / sqrl
killer post! awesome...
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