Have you ever bid to protect your cards?

Joined: September 4th, 2007, 1:25 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:14 am #11

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Dan - and that's why I think you're in the clear.

Barry - could the same argument be made with regards to shill bidding? If you think the card you are selling is worth $1000 and it's currently at $500, why wouldn't you bid $600?
As I mentioned above, a case can be made that the only difference between the two is that you directly get the profit from shill bidding and you only indirectly get the profit when you sell your other copy with the above.





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Joined: October 19th, 2004, 12:02 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:17 am #12

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Bidding on your own card is shilling, make no mistake. But if you see a card going cheap in an auction and you already have one, why not bid on it? You are allowed to own two of the same card.
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Joined: January 27th, 2006, 3:50 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:17 am #13

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
"Dan, this is a hilarious thread, truly. The more significant question to ask is: have you ever bid on your own cards to protect your cards?"

I would think that happens more than most people think. Along those same lines, I would bet that most "sold" cards in auctions are manipulated, unsold, shilled, or never get paid for, leaving us sold prices that are not valid.
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Joined: October 30th, 2003, 9:02 pm

April 30th, 2009, 12:19 am #14

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Dan, I think a very small percentage of realized lots in both Mastro and REA will not be the result of some form of shill bidding. It's like cheating on your taxes: lots of people do it thinking that "everyone does it, so what's teh big deal?" And no one thinks they'll get caught -- until they get caught.
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Joined: September 4th, 2007, 1:25 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:20 am #15

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Barry - agreed - it's a question of intent - same as shill bidding. With shill bidding you could argue that I see a card going for half price, why not bid - I'm allowed to own that copy of that card, it just so happens that I am the seller. The issue is that with traditional shill bidding your intent is to avoid a loss - if you're bidding for that same purpose over here, then I think you're in the gray.





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Last edited by MSW1 on April 30th, 2009, 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: November 22nd, 2008, 9:29 pm

April 30th, 2009, 12:20 am #16

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Bidding to raise the price with no intention of winning is an equivalent to shilling. Bidding with the hope of winning and willingness to pay the bill is fine. What the initial poster describes deserves no apology, he has perfect right to try and win a second one.

I doubt single handedly 'propping up the market' works. The investor can't survive forever on his own bids.
Last edited by dereb12 on April 30th, 2009, 12:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: October 23rd, 2004, 6:55 pm

April 30th, 2009, 12:23 am #17

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
In Dan's case, he wants to purchase another card, so no one can accuse him of anything unethical. However, if one of the main motivations for bidding is to drive up the price of like cards, then there is certainly something wrong. I have a feeling that there is a large percentage of collectors who bid in this fashion to protect the value of cards that they own. In fact, this kind of activity by dealers and collector is probably one of the main reasons why prices for cards have not fallen dramatically in the past year.
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Joined: October 19th, 2004, 12:02 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:26 am #18

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Matt- completely agrre, it is a matter of intent and good faith. If you don't own a card and are an eligible bidder, you are free to bid on it for any reason whatsoever, and no auction house will ask you to explain why you are doing so.
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Joined: September 4th, 2007, 1:25 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:27 am #19

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
"If you don't own a card and are an eligible bidder, you are free to bid on it for any reason whatsoever, and no auction house will ask you to explain why you are doing so."

I'm sure you also agree that just because the house lets you doesn't make it ethical.

Had to write that just for Jeff





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Joined: March 19th, 2002, 2:59 am

April 30th, 2009, 12:29 am #20

I just placed a bid (in one of the current auctions) on a card similar to a card I currently own. I did this because it is currently too cheap and I would be delighted to own another at its current price. How many times do you find yourself bidding in an auction to protect a card you own? By the way, I did not do this to run up the price, rather to own another and cost average my investment. If I don't end up with it, then I guess I helped myself anyway.
Hi Matt,
Jeff went to Duke.... He has no ethics....

Be well Brian


PS Jeff knows I'm kidding.... Go Heels
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