What colors are these......

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Hosted by John Prigent and Steve Zaloga, this is a discussion group dedicated to the armoured forces of the many Allied nations of the Second World War.

What colors are these......

Joined: March 8th, 2005, 3:16 am

August 31st, 2011, 1:20 am #1

on the LVT(A)1 in this picture on page 56 in Concord # 7032 (US Amtracs & Amphibians '41 to '45)? I have yet to find another picture(personally)of the LVT(A)1 with 3-color camo. Also,is that a smoke-discharger on the side of the Type 95 turret? Was it on the other side? Any help with this matter would be appreciated.........Dan

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Joined: August 14th, 2006, 11:47 pm

August 31st, 2011, 5:49 pm #2

hey Dan, I think they are Black and White..........thats right.....
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Joined: April 18th, 2005, 1:15 pm

August 31st, 2011, 6:38 pm #3

on the LVT(A)1 in this picture on page 56 in Concord # 7032 (US Amtracs & Amphibians '41 to '45)? I have yet to find another picture(personally)of the LVT(A)1 with 3-color camo. Also,is that a smoke-discharger on the side of the Type 95 turret? Was it on the other side? Any help with this matter would be appreciated.........Dan

I believe that photo was taken on Peleliu, from the markings on the Type 95, which appears to be one of the Japanese tanks knocked out during the September 15, 1944 tank attack on the beachhead. If that is correct then I would say that the base color on the LVT(a)-1 is dark blue-gray -- from what I have seen, the USMC LVT(a)-1s on Peleliu were that color. It is possible that the Army 81st Division might have had some OD LVT(a)-1s on Peleliu -- the wrecked one on the island today is OD with large white stars, but I believe that is a post-way repaint job (the stars were handpainted without a stencil).

Bottom line, start with dark blue-gray and make your best guess on the camouflage -- probably the typical CB supplied colors used by the Marines: some combination of Sand, red brown, and/or dark green.
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Joined: March 8th, 2005, 3:16 am

August 31st, 2011, 11:03 pm #4

hey Dan, I think they are Black and White..........thats right.....
at least,you got the obvious out of the way. I was going to write'and please don't say black and white'. But I do appreciate your most educated guess on the 'colors',though.......Dan
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Joined: March 8th, 2005, 3:16 am

August 31st, 2011, 11:04 pm #5

I believe that photo was taken on Peleliu, from the markings on the Type 95, which appears to be one of the Japanese tanks knocked out during the September 15, 1944 tank attack on the beachhead. If that is correct then I would say that the base color on the LVT(a)-1 is dark blue-gray -- from what I have seen, the USMC LVT(a)-1s on Peleliu were that color. It is possible that the Army 81st Division might have had some OD LVT(a)-1s on Peleliu -- the wrecked one on the island today is OD with large white stars, but I believe that is a post-way repaint job (the stars were handpainted without a stencil).

Bottom line, start with dark blue-gray and make your best guess on the camouflage -- probably the typical CB supplied colors used by the Marines: some combination of Sand, red brown, and/or dark green.
kind of figured I was going to have to guess........Dan
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Joined: October 15th, 2010, 4:48 pm

August 31st, 2011, 11:41 pm #6

I believe that photo was taken on Peleliu, from the markings on the Type 95, which appears to be one of the Japanese tanks knocked out during the September 15, 1944 tank attack on the beachhead. If that is correct then I would say that the base color on the LVT(a)-1 is dark blue-gray -- from what I have seen, the USMC LVT(a)-1s on Peleliu were that color. It is possible that the Army 81st Division might have had some OD LVT(a)-1s on Peleliu -- the wrecked one on the island today is OD with large white stars, but I believe that is a post-way repaint job (the stars were handpainted without a stencil).

Bottom line, start with dark blue-gray and make your best guess on the camouflage -- probably the typical CB supplied colors used by the Marines: some combination of Sand, red brown, and/or dark green.
Naval landing craft (LCVP, LCM, etc.) were usually painted in the same colors as their mother ships. I don't know if LVT's were also painted in the same manner, but since John suggest using a dark Blue-Grey, I would guess he is referring to 5-N Navy Blue. If this is the case, I would guess that the lighter color could be 5-H Haze Grey, since this looks to be only a two color paint job (the light color on the turret is probably the same as on the hull), and these are the colors used for Measure 22. FYI, navy ship paint was mixed from 5 gallon cans of White 5-U and Blue Tinting Material 5-BTM, and stocks on both were kept on board for touch up painting. If you could find which ship this vehicle was launched from, that ship's camouflage measure may be a clue to what colors were used.

Jon
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Joined: March 8th, 2005, 3:16 am

August 31st, 2011, 11:59 pm #7

thanks for the input,but I see 3 distinct shades of color. Look to the right of the Ha-go turret and just below the top run of track. I was leaning toward the light color being Battleship Gray,but I don't know. I guess whatever colors you choose,you won't be any more wrong than the next guy,since nobody knows..........Dan
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Joined: October 15th, 2010, 4:48 pm

September 1st, 2011, 1:00 am #8

Hi Dan,

The pattern looks a little too hurried to have a third color to me. Having looked at way too many old ship pictures, there's so many possibilities that making a definitive judgment is almost impossible. For all we can tell, it may be white...

Jon
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Joined: March 22nd, 2005, 10:08 pm

September 1st, 2011, 10:12 am #9

on the LVT(A)1 in this picture on page 56 in Concord # 7032 (US Amtracs & Amphibians '41 to '45)? I have yet to find another picture(personally)of the LVT(A)1 with 3-color camo. Also,is that a smoke-discharger on the side of the Type 95 turret? Was it on the other side? Any help with this matter would be appreciated.........Dan

Amtracs were painted in 5-0 Ocean grey (a dark blue which tended to fade); a standard USN color for landing craft) until February 1944 when they switched to OD. This is amply documented in technical bulletins and has been discussed here many times in the past. Many amtracs would have remained in Ocean grey even after Feb 1944 as the TBs generally instructed that they were not to be repainted unless otherwise necessary.

David Harper did a color plate of this LVT(A)-1 in one of his publications based on interviews. If I remember right, he indicated the light color was sand, but I can't find his stuff right at the moment. Maybe somebody else can remember which book.
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Joined: March 19th, 2007, 11:57 pm

September 1st, 2011, 1:21 pm #10

on the LVT(A)1 in this picture on page 56 in Concord # 7032 (US Amtracs & Amphibians '41 to '45)? I have yet to find another picture(personally)of the LVT(A)1 with 3-color camo. Also,is that a smoke-discharger on the side of the Type 95 turret? Was it on the other side? Any help with this matter would be appreciated.........Dan

Project LVT's LVT (A) 1, 4 and 5 LP 008 is the item number.
Mr. Harper had included 3 photos of the LVT, one of which is the one you show. The one shown is known as "B-4", there were 2 others B-3 and B-5. The 3rd photo shows the crew. LVT (A) 1 "B" Company 3rd Armored Amphibian Tractor Battalion. He also stated that all the LVT's were hand me downs from unknown sources. "The green color has been applied over the original blue Finish", according to the color drawing description in the book.
Bob
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