strange photo

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strange photo

Joined: April 19th, 2005, 10:03 am

August 30th, 2011, 7:56 pm #1



Please have a look at the photo. Please look at the third tank for the right. It looks to me to have a 75mm mount but the barrel is very long for a 75mm? Any info would be great.



http://www.737thtankbattalion.org/Victory/ortenburg.htm

Ian.
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Joined: April 19th, 2009, 1:09 am

August 30th, 2011, 9:53 pm #2

I know the gun was a 76 on the tank but going with the movie dialouge.
Ken
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Joined: May 16th, 2008, 10:31 pm

August 30th, 2011, 11:24 pm #3



Please have a look at the photo. Please look at the third tank for the right. It looks to me to have a 75mm mount but the barrel is very long for a 75mm? Any info would be great.



http://www.737thtankbattalion.org/Victory/ortenburg.htm

Ian.
there are a couple of fuzzy photos of these around they are super rare and they never saw combat.

http://freespace.virgin.net/shermanic.firefly/home1.htm

this link should take you to a site that discusses these rare vehicles

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Joined: April 24th, 2005, 12:23 am

August 31st, 2011, 1:19 am #4

Given that they never saw combat (and that is documented in that reference given) and the picture is post war Ortenburg it is pretty certain this is not a Firefly. I personally think it is a standard 75 and the photo is an optical illusion looking like a long barrel (possibly something across the glacis.
The other alternative is an E4(?) conversion of a standard M4A3 75 as I believe a few of these were done in Europe very late in the war.
Cheers
Al
Last edited by Al Bowie on August 31st, 2011, 1:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: May 16th, 2008, 10:31 pm

August 31st, 2011, 6:47 am #5

seems to me there are a couple of things that make me think it is a firefly, first the protective collar at the base of the gun tube where it meets the mantlet appears to be missing. that is something that you only see on firefly mantlets as the E4 still retained the collars. Als the muzzle brake is too small to be an E4 as those 76mm had a wider more prominent design than the 17 pounder. this photo has been discussed here before.

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Joined: January 9th, 2006, 10:46 am

August 31st, 2011, 7:35 am #6

I think it is more likely that the middle Sherman with the long 17 pounder like barrel is a a US Firefly..look at the smooth mantlet without the rectangular strips at the side of the barrel of the gun which was normal for a 75mm vheicle...

Leslie
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Joined: April 24th, 2005, 12:23 am

August 31st, 2011, 10:35 am #7

seems to me there are a couple of things that make me think it is a firefly, first the protective collar at the base of the gun tube where it meets the mantlet appears to be missing. that is something that you only see on firefly mantlets as the E4 still retained the collars. Als the muzzle brake is too small to be an E4 as those 76mm had a wider more prominent design than the 17 pounder. this photo has been discussed here before.

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having blown the picture up the resolution is not good enough to positively determine whether the mantlet has the collars or not to my eyes (and magnifying glass). The blown up image does reveal a long tube so it is not a 75 as I first thought and I can see no muzzle break which would be present on a Firefly. Given there is documented proof that the US upgunned some 75's to 76 in theatre I'm going to err on the side of probability that it is a US 76 in a 75 turret. There is not enough detail in the photo to be positive but going off the known info on US fireflies in service I'll stick to believing that this isn't one particularly as the angle of the photograph would show at least part of the Radio Box at the turret rear which does not appear to be there in this photo.
If you could find an original of the photo in a higher resolution you may be able to positively ID and if it is a Firefly then you have found a very rare beast indeed.
Cheers
Al

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Joined: April 18th, 2005, 12:57 pm

August 31st, 2011, 1:06 pm #8

I tend to agree with you Al. This looks like a field upgrade to a 76. To me the mantlet looks like a standard M34A1 Mantlet. The apparent bulge on the end of the gun barrel being the protective thread sleeve and/or muzzle cover.

Oh and Oddball actually refers to his gun as a 76mm and the extra tube makes it look like a 90mm.
Last edited by jabarry on August 31st, 2011, 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: April 3rd, 2006, 8:08 pm

August 31st, 2011, 2:42 pm #9



Please have a look at the photo. Please look at the third tank for the right. It looks to me to have a 75mm mount but the barrel is very long for a 75mm? Any info would be great.



http://www.737thtankbattalion.org/Victory/ortenburg.htm

Ian.
is known to have completed at least one conversion in February 1945 and possibly others. I can't see them changing the tanks back after all that hard work. The vehicles must have gone somewhere!

The 737th was attached to the 3rd Army for a large portion of the war, so there is some logic to this.

Pat
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Joined: April 19th, 2005, 10:03 am

August 31st, 2011, 6:35 pm #10

Thank you all for your input on the picture. I'm sure it is an up gunned 75 with a 76 barrel.
Would have been nice to find a firefly. Never give up hope.

Ian.
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