Sd.Kfz 222 steering

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Sd.Kfz 222 steering

Joined: March 6th, 2011, 10:36 am

May 29th, 2012, 6:35 am #1

I'm building the Tristar kit(35043) and I must confess to a little head scratching.

I think I'm right when I say the 222 was four wheel steer, so I decided to put a little turn radius into the model. All the steering arms and linkages were assembles as per the instructions and working from a fixed wheel hub (cemented) I installed them only to discover that all four wheels were facing the same way (the vehicle would have 'crabbed' sideways staying parallel- but nearer to the kerb).
I've viewed Jamie Tainton's build log and with a certain: Right...if that moves that way - this moves forward; then that'll move left... sort of approach I believe his model would do the same.
So beware if you require your steering to function.

Tom
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Joined: March 3rd, 2010, 9:07 pm

May 29th, 2012, 8:41 am #2

I found the same thing with the Tristar kit. Nice kit but they got that wrong. Since the vehicle could be operated both 2 and 4 wheel steering I just turned the front wheels.
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Joined: March 11th, 2011, 5:58 am

May 29th, 2012, 8:58 am #3

... that both Tristar and even Bronco´s Sdkfz 221 are wrong with their rear steering system.
Both modelproducers shows the Horch chassis 801, where the rear steering linkeage is behind the rear axle, below the oil cup.
In fact they have reproduced the rear steering of the later, reinforced Horch chassis 801V(verstärkt = reinforced) put in production in May 1942, where the rear steering linkeage is in front of the rear axle. So probably thats the reason why it dont works properly.

I am just collecting all technical datas to start with the Tristar and Bronco Sdkfz 221, so have not yet checked this detail about the wrong steering angle.

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Joined: February 24th, 2007, 11:45 am

May 29th, 2012, 11:34 am #4

I'm building the Tristar kit(35043) and I must confess to a little head scratching.

I think I'm right when I say the 222 was four wheel steer, so I decided to put a little turn radius into the model. All the steering arms and linkages were assembles as per the instructions and working from a fixed wheel hub (cemented) I installed them only to discover that all four wheels were facing the same way (the vehicle would have 'crabbed' sideways staying parallel- but nearer to the kerb).
I've viewed Jamie Tainton's build log and with a certain: Right...if that moves that way - this moves forward; then that'll move left... sort of approach I believe his model would do the same.
So beware if you require your steering to function.

Tom
Hi Tom,

Erich is correct about the confused positions of the main steering linkage. If you want to model all the steering link bars in the correct, sequence, orientation and length etc on your Sd.Kfz.222 I would advise you to study Panzer Tracts No.13-1. In this book Hilary Doyle has drawn a great comparison page of the main features of bare front, side and top views of two types of chassis (s.Pkw.I Fahrgestell Typ 801 used for the Ausf.A vehicles compared to the s.Pkw. I Fahrgestell Typ 801v used for the Ausf.B). This is a very important comparison as we seldom can see the chassis in normal photos. Attached is a sketch from one of the manuals on the Ausf.A chassis which will help the orientation of the wheels on your model.


Sd.Kfz.221

Erich you mention that you are collecting data before also starting the Bronco Sd.Kfz.221 so be aware that the steering is the least of the challenges that you will face. When you read the Panzer Tracts text and look at Doyles other comparison drawings of the Panzeraufbau for the various types of armoured car you can see that the main difference between an Sd.Kfz.221 and all the other cars was that the lower armoured body meets the INSIDE of the chassis frame NOT the outside. This allowed a smaller armoured body and reduced the weight of this scout car version by about 1 ton. It is only when you know about this fundamental difference that you notice it on photographs as the chassis is always in the shade. As far as I can see this problem has not been picked up by any of the reviews of the kit.

A friend undertook the correction of this Bronco kit but it was real modelling feat. He had to remove and remake the chassis frame as this is exposed all along the sides. When he corrected the slope of the lower side armour plates meant modelling new mudguards, bin etc. so you certainly will need your Panzer Tracts for support.

Hope this helps

Fred


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Joined: March 11th, 2011, 5:58 am

May 29th, 2012, 1:11 pm #5

Hi Fred,

Thanks for your infos and the attached drawing
I have the new Panzer Tracts and studied it from front till end and back...

I am even surprized that none of the kit revwiers and modellers has mentioned this wrong steering system of the Bronco and Tristar kits (but maybe I have overseen one who has mentioned this), because besides Panzer Tracts, this pic. shows the rear steering "how it should be" for a Horch chassis 801 (= Typ "A")


Source: Museum Roscoff
Clearly visible, that the steering components for the rear axle are behind the rear axle system and below of the oil cup, so the long rear steering rod on Bronco and Tristar has to be mirrored from left to right (as it would be correct for the later chassis 801V)

I have some of there kits now in my stash and be just in the phase of collecting all parts to build at least a "mechanical" correct SdKfz 221 from Bronco and 222 from Tristar, (which has even a lot of other wrong components for a Typ A) and even a 223 based on the Sdkfz 222 from Tristar, all of them as a "Typ A" as used witht he DAK int he Western desert, but as I am actually just working on a ICM Stoewer Kfz 2/40 as a "kleiner Instandsetzungskraft-wagen (Kfz. 2/40) mit Einheitsfahrgestell I", I have not yet started the build of one of this 221/222.

Therefore I have not yet checked the Bronco hull for the shape where it meets the chassis
But compared to Panzer Tracts, in general the Bronco hull seems to be ok for the "visible" areas.

What I have noticed immediately on all the Bronco kits is, that Bronco has "created" a suspension, which has never been produced in reality, because all Bronco Sdkfz 221 versions shows a lower suspension arm (and tube shocks in coil spring) as used for the Horch 801v chassis and an upper suspension arm as used for the Horch 801 chassis.
In fact all Sdkfz 221 has been produced with the Horch chassis 801 (or Typ A) and should look like this:


Source: Museum Roscoff

To correct this I will use Tamiya´s Horch 1a for the lower supension arms and make some lever-shock absorbers to correct the Bronco suspension + do a correction of the steering system.

For specific parts I will use the Hobby Boss 222/223 as spares, because even as they are mechanicall quite correct, their dimensions of the hulls are totally wrong (wide by 3,2 mm too small, horizontal area starts 2 mm too far behind, resulting in too small turrets).

What I was not able to find out, and I would thanks if someone could help me, because I want to make a full engine cormpartement on a tristar 222, is how the fuel tank filler necks has been fitted on all the 221/222/223. The 2 fuel tanks are in the engine compartement, beside the water cooler. The filler necks should be below ot the small square openings on the hull mesh (correct ?), but this are in front of the rear bulkhead.
As I have not been able to find a interior picture which shows where the filler neck goes in the fuel tank, how (or where) they have been filled with fuel ?

Furthermore: How has been integrated the tropical pre-filters (in combination witht he tank filler), for which all pictures shows that their pipes enters in this 2 square openings to meet the air filter system, which are (probabaly ?) even used to fill-in the fuel.

Erich

Last edited by trex10 on May 29th, 2012, 1:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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