Touchy subject--family member with ethical issues...

Touchy subject--family member with ethical issues...

Joined: November 27th, 2011, 4:22 pm

January 13th, 2012, 4:05 am #1

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
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Joined: December 21st, 2011, 7:41 pm

January 13th, 2012, 4:17 am #2

To be blunt, that sucks - so sorry. My best advice is just to be proud of your choice, and not let his views make you feel badly. His views are so extreme I honestly wouldn't even bother asking for citations or engaging in discussion - his mind is made up. He obviously doesn't approve of IVF, and that's fine for him - he doesn't have to do IVF. But he should refrain from passing judgement on your decisions and if you have to say anything, I would just ask that he respect your choices for family planning, despite not agreeing. He doesn't get a vote in how your child is conceived

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Anon
Anon

January 13th, 2012, 4:43 am #3

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
Asking to these studies about children born to IVf questioning their origin? I'm not sure I believe that to be true, or if their are studies, he may be believing them to say something that they aren't really quite saying. Also, just block him out!!!! He's a man and future priest. He has NO idea what you are going through and won't ever! Maybe, just maybe, after years of being a priest, he may be a little more liberal in his feelings after seeing so many people seeking advice for their suffering. Sorry for what you are going through.
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Joined: July 10th, 2009, 8:18 pm

January 13th, 2012, 5:08 am #4

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
I think that no matter how a child comes into this world, it is a miracle of creation, so how could an IVF baby be any different? As a matter of fact, most IVF children have been so long wanted and hard fought for, I dare say they are often more loved, more wanted than many naturally conceived children are. I am not Catholic but do have a strong Christian faith and I do not think God would have given me these tools to use unless he wanted me to use them. I am so sorry that your over zealous relative cannot see the forest for the trees. Again, I am not Catholic, but I thought I heard on the news that the Vatican had recently eased up on their stance on reproductive medicine. I think that at the end of the day, follow your own heart. I, personally, would kindly thank my relative for his opinion and then ask him as a Christian to honor and respect your wishes, to pray for you, and to be happy for your success. Let he without sin cast the first stone, right?

Be happy and proceed with your dream of motherhood. Let the naysayers say what they may. At the end of the day, you will be a better person for it. Good luck to you and wishing you much success!
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Joined: December 8th, 2006, 11:41 pm

January 13th, 2012, 12:25 pm #5

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
I was brought up a catholic but have lapsed over the years. I agree with all the comments from the previous responders but wanted to add my support for you here also. We are no tell, even with family, for precisely the reason that not everyone will 'understand'. I use the word 'understand' rather than agree or disagree because this path is difficult in so many ways and we all come to this path from different experiences that it would be naive to think that everyone we tell will understand and feel the way we do when they haven't had the same journey as us. Factor on top of this the thinking and brain control resulting from seminary training and the strong self-righteousness that many a young person without life experiences has, then you are just beating yourself up for no reason if you are looking for this future priests understanding at this stage. He will not change his views until years of life have mellowed him and possibly until the catholic church bucks up and modernises (depending on how progressive he will be as a priest). So don't waste your time engaging in conversation and debate, don't ask for citations, why do you need them? He simply cannot understand at this stage in his life so there is no point in engaging on this and making yourself unhappy. The next time it comes up, then tell him politely that you do not wish to hear his views any more and walk away. Do not be drawn into the religion debate, its never going to be a win win, so why bother.

Just know that you understand that he doesn't understand!

Wishing you peace Leigh.

Aoife

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Joined: September 26th, 2008, 9:06 pm

January 13th, 2012, 12:26 pm #6

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
He's young and obviously extremely dedicated to (blindly?) following the teachings of the Catholic church. Normally, I would think that he might become more tolerant as he grows older, but if he becomes a priest he may not, as he'll be surrounded by others who share his view.

I think I'd make up my mind right now never to consult him again about anything, but that's just the way I think. (not saying you should) I'd decide right here that my best interests are not what is most important to him and disregard any future advice about ANYTHING.

Your child will be a child. Children are NEVER an abomination. That line of thought doesn't seem very Christ-like to me.

(( ))
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BlessedThistle
BlessedThistle

January 13th, 2012, 12:43 pm #7

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
just like IVF kids. If the one is not an abomination, neither is the other.
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Joined: September 26th, 2008, 9:06 pm

January 13th, 2012, 12:53 pm #8

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
There is an article in a CATHOLIC newspaper claiming that IVF kids question their existance, BUT even the article itself admits there are no studies on this. They took a study on donor-sperm conceived children and quoted from it a bit, but generally the writer was making claims that he couldn't susbtantiate.

I'll bet your relative is quoting this article as if it were practically scripture, since it matches his ideas.
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Joined: September 24th, 2001, 3:32 am

January 13th, 2012, 2:06 pm #9

Hi ladies. This has been an incredibly rough day for me and I'm really just looking for support. I never expected this process to be easy, but I also didn't expect some of the horrible drama it's causing. I don't know what to do right now...

In brief, I have a close family member who's in the seminary studying to become a Catholic priest. He's young and zealous and is extremely passionate about his faith and his church. Before I go any further, please do not interpret any of this as being anti-Christian or anti-Catholic...but I'm so mad and so hurt I could scream! His objections to IVF are absolute--the strict Catholic view is that fertilization occurring outside the body is unnatural and a sin against God. Even if we agree to implant any and all embryos that result from fertilization, in his view, it is still a dire sin and a baby born in this way is an abomination. Among other things, he cited evidence that children born of IVF question their origin as young adults and have a very hard time with the method in which they were conceived. I was too shocked to ask for citations here, but now I wish I had.

It goes without saying that I do not share his beliefs, but this hurts me tremendously. Being raised in a Catholic family and trained as a scientist, I am very familiar with the religious and ethical issues surrounding this issue, but I was not expecting his condemnation. I guess I just thought everyone would be supportive if they knew our situation and understood how much we wanted a baby... How very naive of me!

Has anyone else experienced this? Any advice?
Thank you,
Leigh
said that her priest told her that the surgical table was her marriage bed. Wonderful guy.

Love BT's come-back!




Keiki's Makuahine (Keiki's Mom) 51, dh 52
Keiki: b. 2002 after 3 months bedrest
Natural conception following ZIFT/chem. pg

Olivia: b. 1999 d. 1999
28-week preemie, ptl cause unknown
Natural conception after 1 mc

ttc since 1998
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MacRita
MacRita

January 13th, 2012, 2:53 pm #10

just like IVF kids. If the one is not an abomination, neither is the other.
Brilliant...and now so obvious!
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