Mrs. McIrish -- you can ignore this but had to write (stuff ment)

Mrs. McIrish -- you can ignore this but had to write (stuff ment)

Joined: July 29th, 2009, 6:13 pm

February 19th, 2013, 3:16 am #1

My heart is breaking for you. It is so unfair. While I know that nothing is going to help you feel better right now, I wanted to write this before you signed off the boards. I think you may check back tomorrow and if you do please take this note not as advice but as something to think about as you start adjusting your life.

I know that you have said if this cycle did not work, this was the end of the line. I completely understand this line of thought but there could be a chance that you and your DH reconsider at some point especially since you were dealt a crappy hand and unfortunately never really got to play the game. I won't bore you with all the details but I was in a similar position just about 4 years ago. 2 failed DE cycles after which my then RE tried to blame my uterus -- when the first failed cycle was a trisomy (with DE!) and in the 2nd they oversuppressed my donor.

There are others who kept falling on the wrong side of the odds. I am not sure if you have ever ventured to the green board but that was my safe place. Anyway, after that horrible 2nd cycle, we were done with TTC. We were going to pursue adoption but I found that overwhelming too. Our ages were stacked against us so international was out and domestic has its own issues.

Gradually, my heart opened to another DE cycle but DH would only consider a guarantee program and for him I had to NOT travel. My earlier DE cycles had entailed traveling. And he said we had to take a break. In the end, we took about 6 months off. However, during those 6 months we did have our consult at SG. I wanted to see what they thought. A quick review of my files and my RE said "well I see no reason why we can't get you pregnant." Once he said that, it was easy to take the rest of the summer off. We told no one that we were going to cycle again. It was during that time that I started posting here -- so nice to be able to talk about it. I eventually had to tell my sister since she had DE twins and still looks in here from time to time and I did not do enough to disguise who I am -- she kept the secret from the rest of the family. It was easier to do since I was more relaxed. The fact that I had 6 cycles to get pregnant OR I WOULD GET 100% of my money back -- well what a stress reducer. I got pregnant with my DD almost exactly 1 year after my disasterous cycle at my old clinic. I was certainly older than you since I was 46 when I conceived and 47 when I had her. DH is a year older than me. I know your DH is in his mid-40s. My DH was a bit concerned with the age thing but now he is not. Anyway, I just wanted to tell you from somebody who has been there that some time away will probably be healthy but I hope that you will revisit this at some point since I don't think you really got a fair shake. And let me tell you, it was so fun to call my mother at 7:30 one morning and say "I'm pregnant" and her response was "Are you sure?"

I know I am a SG fan but I have to say going there was freeing for me -- even DH said so. I decided to turn it over to them during the first cycle. They would make most of their money if I got pregnant that cycle so I thought "have at it". They don't really do things outside their norm and they did shoot down a couple of my requests (no lovenox but did write a prescription for higher dosage of folic acid -- I have MTHFR) but I decided to chill since they do get many women pregnant each year. I basically knew the max I would have to pay to have a baby which relaxed me. I am a financial analyst and figured out that once a DE recipient goes beyond 2 cycles, they lose money under the guarantee program -- so it is definitely in their best interest to get you pregnant ASAP. Also, I think I would have found traveling to SG much more palatable than my old clinic because they don't require a monitoriing visit from recipients the day before retrieval and they are happy to use frozen sperm. My old clinic made me get there early the day before retrieval and then DH would come down later that day (he tried to minimize the days away from the office) and then he typically had to go back before tx. With SG, OOT recipients go for 1 big consult day and DHs can provide a sperm sample then. We even did that and we were local since traffic can be an issue in the morning near SG's main office. Anyway, that means that you would just need to know if it was a 3 day or 5 day tx -- with you in the NYC area, it would be easy to book a train (vs. flight) to get here.

SG might not be for you but I do know that it CAN be a different experience at the right place. If you do try again, the thing you might need is a higher success rate -- maybe San Diego or Portland are your answers there. I can't remember anybody saying anything bad about those clinics -- I think that might be a real benefit to you after what you have gone through. Maybe you and DH could use a trip to San Diego as a vacation?? Birdy does not post anymore but I know money was an issue for them but they went to San Diego and got pregnant on cycle one and I believe she got pregnant again on a FET from the same fresh cycle.

I just had to put it out there since I know I was right where you are not too long ago. I am thinking of you and sending good thoughts that whatever is right for you is what happens.
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Anonymous
Anonymous

February 19th, 2013, 5:17 am #2

Mrs. McIrish I think from what you said the issue is your DH doesn't want to go forward. It is really difficult to keep TTC so it is very understandable to feel like that.

If it is primarily a financial choice and you are open to donor embryos they are much more affordable than donor eggs. Sometimes you can get a larger set and then you may have more than one shot. You don't pay for any of the embryos so you are only paying for thawing, your meds and transfer.

A guarantee program seems worth the risk and money. After what you've been through no one could blame you for throwing in the towel but also we all hope that you will get what you want.

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Joined: October 9th, 2008, 2:53 am

February 19th, 2013, 5:35 am #3

Many a lady here I am quite sure has thought seriously about throwing in the towel. I know I did. I really did. When a donor did not stim properly and we did not end up with even a transfer I looked back and just thought 'ok thats it I'm done'.
It was at this point we opted for surrogacy but even that didnt work so... 'I'm SO done now its unreal'. I was done too. I really was.
However, there was a little glimmer of hope flickering away. I had met someone who knew a fabulas donor and so that was in the background. But I was so overwhelmed by years of failure I needed to stop. So we stopped.
We stopped for two full months before making any other inquiries. During that time we rarely mentioned anything about ttcing. It was terrific. It was like taking a fabulas holiday. After two months I suggested to my husband we look into the donor we were told about... and so we did.
I was so sure I would fail that I even told the doctor 'if I have to take steroids I"m not doing it and we will go to surrogacy right away'. He said I did not have to take them so...
Another month and half to organise our donor, take the meds, and general stuff.
Mid April 2010 I had a transfer and November 2010 we had out boy. It all sounds so easy... but my journey began in early 2005 and I did two OE, five DE, one surrogacy, and then another DE and then he arrived.
At the end of 2009 though I was done with all of it...
Just something to think about... best, THK
Last edited by perthkitty on February 19th, 2013, 5:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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BlessedThistle
BlessedThistle

February 19th, 2013, 6:14 am #4

Mrs. McIrish I think from what you said the issue is your DH doesn't want to go forward. It is really difficult to keep TTC so it is very understandable to feel like that.

If it is primarily a financial choice and you are open to donor embryos they are much more affordable than donor eggs. Sometimes you can get a larger set and then you may have more than one shot. You don't pay for any of the embryos so you are only paying for thawing, your meds and transfer.

A guarantee program seems worth the risk and money. After what you've been through no one could blame you for throwing in the towel but also we all hope that you will get what you want.
I can understand if even under the best of circumstances you don't find appeal in this choice. But it was a very special, meaningful path for me to take. I would not have any children other than these two. Every loss, all the disappointments...they were worth my kids.

I hope you stay around, even if just on the green board, even if just for support from those who have been in the very painful place you are now.

And I hope the proverb that kept me going through cycle after cycle, loss after loss also helps you: Fall down seven times, stand up eight. I am sure it feels like down is as up as you can manage now, but pray that changes soon and you can begin pondering your next steps, wherever they should lead.
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Joined: December 9th, 2008, 6:13 pm

February 19th, 2013, 3:01 pm #5

My heart is breaking for you. It is so unfair. While I know that nothing is going to help you feel better right now, I wanted to write this before you signed off the boards. I think you may check back tomorrow and if you do please take this note not as advice but as something to think about as you start adjusting your life.

I know that you have said if this cycle did not work, this was the end of the line. I completely understand this line of thought but there could be a chance that you and your DH reconsider at some point especially since you were dealt a crappy hand and unfortunately never really got to play the game. I won't bore you with all the details but I was in a similar position just about 4 years ago. 2 failed DE cycles after which my then RE tried to blame my uterus -- when the first failed cycle was a trisomy (with DE!) and in the 2nd they oversuppressed my donor.

There are others who kept falling on the wrong side of the odds. I am not sure if you have ever ventured to the green board but that was my safe place. Anyway, after that horrible 2nd cycle, we were done with TTC. We were going to pursue adoption but I found that overwhelming too. Our ages were stacked against us so international was out and domestic has its own issues.

Gradually, my heart opened to another DE cycle but DH would only consider a guarantee program and for him I had to NOT travel. My earlier DE cycles had entailed traveling. And he said we had to take a break. In the end, we took about 6 months off. However, during those 6 months we did have our consult at SG. I wanted to see what they thought. A quick review of my files and my RE said "well I see no reason why we can't get you pregnant." Once he said that, it was easy to take the rest of the summer off. We told no one that we were going to cycle again. It was during that time that I started posting here -- so nice to be able to talk about it. I eventually had to tell my sister since she had DE twins and still looks in here from time to time and I did not do enough to disguise who I am -- she kept the secret from the rest of the family. It was easier to do since I was more relaxed. The fact that I had 6 cycles to get pregnant OR I WOULD GET 100% of my money back -- well what a stress reducer. I got pregnant with my DD almost exactly 1 year after my disasterous cycle at my old clinic. I was certainly older than you since I was 46 when I conceived and 47 when I had her. DH is a year older than me. I know your DH is in his mid-40s. My DH was a bit concerned with the age thing but now he is not. Anyway, I just wanted to tell you from somebody who has been there that some time away will probably be healthy but I hope that you will revisit this at some point since I don't think you really got a fair shake. And let me tell you, it was so fun to call my mother at 7:30 one morning and say "I'm pregnant" and her response was "Are you sure?"

I know I am a SG fan but I have to say going there was freeing for me -- even DH said so. I decided to turn it over to them during the first cycle. They would make most of their money if I got pregnant that cycle so I thought "have at it". They don't really do things outside their norm and they did shoot down a couple of my requests (no lovenox but did write a prescription for higher dosage of folic acid -- I have MTHFR) but I decided to chill since they do get many women pregnant each year. I basically knew the max I would have to pay to have a baby which relaxed me. I am a financial analyst and figured out that once a DE recipient goes beyond 2 cycles, they lose money under the guarantee program -- so it is definitely in their best interest to get you pregnant ASAP. Also, I think I would have found traveling to SG much more palatable than my old clinic because they don't require a monitoriing visit from recipients the day before retrieval and they are happy to use frozen sperm. My old clinic made me get there early the day before retrieval and then DH would come down later that day (he tried to minimize the days away from the office) and then he typically had to go back before tx. With SG, OOT recipients go for 1 big consult day and DHs can provide a sperm sample then. We even did that and we were local since traffic can be an issue in the morning near SG's main office. Anyway, that means that you would just need to know if it was a 3 day or 5 day tx -- with you in the NYC area, it would be easy to book a train (vs. flight) to get here.

SG might not be for you but I do know that it CAN be a different experience at the right place. If you do try again, the thing you might need is a higher success rate -- maybe San Diego or Portland are your answers there. I can't remember anybody saying anything bad about those clinics -- I think that might be a real benefit to you after what you have gone through. Maybe you and DH could use a trip to San Diego as a vacation?? Birdy does not post anymore but I know money was an issue for them but they went to San Diego and got pregnant on cycle one and I believe she got pregnant again on a FET from the same fresh cycle.

I just had to put it out there since I know I was right where you are not too long ago. I am thinking of you and sending good thoughts that whatever is right for you is what happens.
I too found solace on the Green Board as I was just one of those unlucky ones as well. If you click on the Green board and then go to role call you can see our complete stories.

But I was in the same boat as you. We thought there was no way we could cycle again (financial constraints) but I thought it wouldn't hurt to get other consults with different clinics. And after doing the one day work up at SG we decided we would try one last time, and we refinanced our house... (that is not something I've ever shared here, but we wanted just one decent cycle, and this was the only way to find the extra $30,000) I won't go into the rest of our story here, but the bottom line is this...

You have never had a fair chance. You've had just one thing after another sabotage your cycles. (as did I) I know how I felt, so I know why you and your DH are feeling done by all this. Give yourselves some time. We took 10 months off and then gave it one last go at a pricier, very good clinic. And I tell you it was the best decision of our lives. (my other clinic had offered us a cycle at over 50% off, but after everything that had happened I couldn't waste the emotional toll of going there again.)

I'm thinking of you today and hoping you get resolution on this cycle. And please feel free to go to the Green board if you want to post or vent. Us green girl vets check it frequently.

((hugs))

ks
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Julie
Julie

February 19th, 2013, 3:20 pm #6

I know that you found it relatively easy to cycle at SG OOT. And look, here you are -- after being on the bad side of the odds so many times, pregnant with #2 from the same fresh cycle!!

I remember when you were offered that 50% off -- was that ever the right move to NOT take it!
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Mrs. Mc Irish
Mrs. Mc Irish

February 19th, 2013, 11:21 pm #7

My heart is breaking for you. It is so unfair. While I know that nothing is going to help you feel better right now, I wanted to write this before you signed off the boards. I think you may check back tomorrow and if you do please take this note not as advice but as something to think about as you start adjusting your life.

I know that you have said if this cycle did not work, this was the end of the line. I completely understand this line of thought but there could be a chance that you and your DH reconsider at some point especially since you were dealt a crappy hand and unfortunately never really got to play the game. I won't bore you with all the details but I was in a similar position just about 4 years ago. 2 failed DE cycles after which my then RE tried to blame my uterus -- when the first failed cycle was a trisomy (with DE!) and in the 2nd they oversuppressed my donor.

There are others who kept falling on the wrong side of the odds. I am not sure if you have ever ventured to the green board but that was my safe place. Anyway, after that horrible 2nd cycle, we were done with TTC. We were going to pursue adoption but I found that overwhelming too. Our ages were stacked against us so international was out and domestic has its own issues.

Gradually, my heart opened to another DE cycle but DH would only consider a guarantee program and for him I had to NOT travel. My earlier DE cycles had entailed traveling. And he said we had to take a break. In the end, we took about 6 months off. However, during those 6 months we did have our consult at SG. I wanted to see what they thought. A quick review of my files and my RE said "well I see no reason why we can't get you pregnant." Once he said that, it was easy to take the rest of the summer off. We told no one that we were going to cycle again. It was during that time that I started posting here -- so nice to be able to talk about it. I eventually had to tell my sister since she had DE twins and still looks in here from time to time and I did not do enough to disguise who I am -- she kept the secret from the rest of the family. It was easier to do since I was more relaxed. The fact that I had 6 cycles to get pregnant OR I WOULD GET 100% of my money back -- well what a stress reducer. I got pregnant with my DD almost exactly 1 year after my disasterous cycle at my old clinic. I was certainly older than you since I was 46 when I conceived and 47 when I had her. DH is a year older than me. I know your DH is in his mid-40s. My DH was a bit concerned with the age thing but now he is not. Anyway, I just wanted to tell you from somebody who has been there that some time away will probably be healthy but I hope that you will revisit this at some point since I don't think you really got a fair shake. And let me tell you, it was so fun to call my mother at 7:30 one morning and say "I'm pregnant" and her response was "Are you sure?"

I know I am a SG fan but I have to say going there was freeing for me -- even DH said so. I decided to turn it over to them during the first cycle. They would make most of their money if I got pregnant that cycle so I thought "have at it". They don't really do things outside their norm and they did shoot down a couple of my requests (no lovenox but did write a prescription for higher dosage of folic acid -- I have MTHFR) but I decided to chill since they do get many women pregnant each year. I basically knew the max I would have to pay to have a baby which relaxed me. I am a financial analyst and figured out that once a DE recipient goes beyond 2 cycles, they lose money under the guarantee program -- so it is definitely in their best interest to get you pregnant ASAP. Also, I think I would have found traveling to SG much more palatable than my old clinic because they don't require a monitoriing visit from recipients the day before retrieval and they are happy to use frozen sperm. My old clinic made me get there early the day before retrieval and then DH would come down later that day (he tried to minimize the days away from the office) and then he typically had to go back before tx. With SG, OOT recipients go for 1 big consult day and DHs can provide a sperm sample then. We even did that and we were local since traffic can be an issue in the morning near SG's main office. Anyway, that means that you would just need to know if it was a 3 day or 5 day tx -- with you in the NYC area, it would be easy to book a train (vs. flight) to get here.

SG might not be for you but I do know that it CAN be a different experience at the right place. If you do try again, the thing you might need is a higher success rate -- maybe San Diego or Portland are your answers there. I can't remember anybody saying anything bad about those clinics -- I think that might be a real benefit to you after what you have gone through. Maybe you and DH could use a trip to San Diego as a vacation?? Birdy does not post anymore but I know money was an issue for them but they went to San Diego and got pregnant on cycle one and I believe she got pregnant again on a FET from the same fresh cycle.

I just had to put it out there since I know I was right where you are not too long ago. I am thinking of you and sending good thoughts that whatever is right for you is what happens.
I really appreciate everyone taking their time to write such lovely messages to me about your experiences. I guess the biggest lesson I have learned from my IF experience is to never say "never". No one knows what the future will bring and people change their minds when faced with decisions they never imagined being faced with. But for now, DH and I are stopping treatment. We are in tough spot right now as our insurance coverage is expiring with no time left to cycle. I got laid off my job at the end of 2012 as my dept closed. I really have not been in a mindset the past few months to look for a new job. I do have the luxury of a severance so it, at least, has allowed me to not have to work during this last cycle. I don't think I would have been able to function with work stresses on top of this insane cycle's events. We also decided to sell our house that is too expensive without my job and DH wants to return to his home city (he moved for me when we got married as he could commute and I had the better paying job). With my job no longer in the picture he does not want to stay here. We will likely take a hit on selling the house with the real estate market so financially I just cannot take on the debt on a guarantee program.

I know many of you are older than me but I am concerned with our ages. DH's parents were "older" than most parents of his day, especially for the 1960s. My DH is turning 45 in a few weeks and my FIL just turned 90 last week; my MIL is 84. They are in decent shape for their ages but it is challenging having older parents. Add in young babies and it does scare me. I hope no one takes offense to this-- I'm just not sure I see us coming back to cycle in a few years when money is not at the forefront.

So for now, we are stopping. We've been cycling non-stop since we got married 3 yrs ago. It's been hard on our relationship. We never got to be happy newlyweds. I just have to step back from all the sadness and try to play the cards I was dealt. I still have no idea why we keep getting bad embryos-- it is a mystery and my current doctors say nothing about it. We've had every sperm test there is and all were normal. DH doesn't want to pursue donor embryos. I don't really get why not since he would adopt if we were younger but he isn't budging at this point. I don't think I could endure getting more bad embryos or another loss, especially like this current one. I really cannot help but think that the universe is interfering here--that it knows something I don't. We've had every roadblock imaginable in every single cycle and I just feel to my core that a higher power is stopping this. I don't know the reason and I doubt I ever will. I just hope that "someone" knows better than me and that is why this is happening.

I truly appreciate all of you so much. I really didn't share this cycle with people IRL so having your support, no matter what, has touched my heart more than you will ever know.
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Julie
Julie

February 20th, 2013, 1:16 pm #8

If so I can forward to you an agency that works with older parents. We might use them if we go for a second. I will post my email if you are interested. Avg wait is less than a year?
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Joined: September 6th, 2007, 1:40 am

February 20th, 2013, 2:45 pm #9

I really appreciate everyone taking their time to write such lovely messages to me about your experiences. I guess the biggest lesson I have learned from my IF experience is to never say "never". No one knows what the future will bring and people change their minds when faced with decisions they never imagined being faced with. But for now, DH and I are stopping treatment. We are in tough spot right now as our insurance coverage is expiring with no time left to cycle. I got laid off my job at the end of 2012 as my dept closed. I really have not been in a mindset the past few months to look for a new job. I do have the luxury of a severance so it, at least, has allowed me to not have to work during this last cycle. I don't think I would have been able to function with work stresses on top of this insane cycle's events. We also decided to sell our house that is too expensive without my job and DH wants to return to his home city (he moved for me when we got married as he could commute and I had the better paying job). With my job no longer in the picture he does not want to stay here. We will likely take a hit on selling the house with the real estate market so financially I just cannot take on the debt on a guarantee program.

I know many of you are older than me but I am concerned with our ages. DH's parents were "older" than most parents of his day, especially for the 1960s. My DH is turning 45 in a few weeks and my FIL just turned 90 last week; my MIL is 84. They are in decent shape for their ages but it is challenging having older parents. Add in young babies and it does scare me. I hope no one takes offense to this-- I'm just not sure I see us coming back to cycle in a few years when money is not at the forefront.

So for now, we are stopping. We've been cycling non-stop since we got married 3 yrs ago. It's been hard on our relationship. We never got to be happy newlyweds. I just have to step back from all the sadness and try to play the cards I was dealt. I still have no idea why we keep getting bad embryos-- it is a mystery and my current doctors say nothing about it. We've had every sperm test there is and all were normal. DH doesn't want to pursue donor embryos. I don't really get why not since he would adopt if we were younger but he isn't budging at this point. I don't think I could endure getting more bad embryos or another loss, especially like this current one. I really cannot help but think that the universe is interfering here--that it knows something I don't. We've had every roadblock imaginable in every single cycle and I just feel to my core that a higher power is stopping this. I don't know the reason and I doubt I ever will. I just hope that "someone" knows better than me and that is why this is happening.

I truly appreciate all of you so much. I really didn't share this cycle with people IRL so having your support, no matter what, has touched my heart more than you will ever know.
IF and treatment and cycles and losses takes such a horrible toll on a person.

Everything happened for me much later no doubt because I had to take long breaks. I would never really think of them as breaks. I was so weary from it that it felt like I was still trying but I would mess things up and I think it was probably because I couldn't face the continual rigor of it--so they were breaks. I just wasn't one of those people who could go non-stop with this.

It sounds like you are going through a bunch of stuff that has to be worked through first. I will be thinking of you and hoping everything happens in a way that will lead to your happiness.

I think it is wise and right to look at what's happened to you and think about maybe there is a reason and accept things as they are. I wish you peace.

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Joined: September 6th, 2007, 1:40 am

February 20th, 2013, 2:47 pm #10

If so I can forward to you an agency that works with older parents. We might use them if we go for a second. I will post my email if you are interested. Avg wait is less than a year?
I'm not doing that now but I may eventually.
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