RMT Statement following Jean's execution

In the aftermath of the murder, a cascade of misinformation and lies from the very top down. From Metropolitan Police Commissioner Sir Ian Blair to the trigger-happy plain-clothes shooters identified only as "carrying a long-barrelled weapon", the actions that day have been exposed as a cover-up of the events that resulted in the extra-judicial execution of an innocent man.

RMT Statement following Jean's execution

Joined: Nov 25 2005, 11:41 AM

May 25 2007, 01:00 AM #1

Crow seeks further talks with Mayor after "disappointing" meeting

Publication Date: July 22 2005

JULY 22:
THE TUBE"S biggest union is seeking further urgent talks with the Mayor of London after a “very disappointing” meeting with Ken Livingstone today.

“It is extremely disappointing that at the Mayor did not give the assurances that our members are seeking on key safety and security issues,” RMT general secretary Bob Crow said today.

“We are seeking straightforward commitments to dropping plans to cut station staff and to ensuring that safety regulations for sub-surface stations remain in place, but these were not forthcoming.

“I am sure that Tube users would agree with us that we need to see more uniformed staff on stations, not fewer, and that safety regulations brought in after the Kings Cross fire should remain in place.

“In the absence of positive responses on these and other concerns we put forward, I have today requested a direct meeting with the Mayor on Monday, and will be consulting the general secretaries of our sister unions and members of our parliamentary group over the weekend.

“Our members and all LUL staff have shown immense courage and commitment through the awful events of the last two weeks, but their concerns at the way yesterday"s alert was handled are serious and there are many other issues that remain to be resolved.

“Their concerns will have been fuelled by the revelation that an innocent Tube driver today found himself with a police gun at his head during the incident in Stockwell station in which a suspect was shot dead.

“No apology could ever be enough ever take away the trauma that that driver has suffered and there should be a full inquiry into the handling of the incident,” Bob Crow said.
"The problem with always being a conformist is that when you try to change the system from within, it's not you who changes the system; it's the system that will eventually change you." -- Immortal Technique

"The media is the most powerful entity on earth. They have the power to make the innocent guilty and to make the guilty innocent, and that's power. Because they control the minds of the masses." -- Malcolm X

"The eternal fight is not many battles fought on one level, but one great battle fought on many different levels." -- The Antagonist

"Truth does not fear investigation." -- Unknown

Joined: Jan 24 2006, 10:57 PM

May 25 2007, 01:17 PM #2

More on the Tube Train driver - Gun to the Head incident at Postman Patel from July 2005.

http://postmanpatel.blogspot.com/2005/0 ... pened.html
In some ways she was far more acute than Winston, and far less susceptible to Party propaganda. Once when he happened in some connection to mention the war against Eurasia, she startled him by saying casually that in her opinion the war was not happening. The rocket bombs which fell daily on London were probably fired by the Government of Oceania itself, "just to keep the people frightened." -- George Orwell, 1984

Joined: Jan 24 2006, 10:57 PM

Jun 6 2007, 06:11 PM #3

Ramzi Mohammed is accused of being the 'failed bomber' at the Oval station incident.

This BBC report of Friday, 22 July 2005, 05:57 GMT 06:57 UK, states the following:
At Oval Tube station about 20 or 30 passengers were evacuated from a train after seeing "white smoke". The RMT union's security meeting was told the suspect used a handgun to try and detonate explosives contained in a backpack, BBC London Transport correspondent Andrew Winstanley said. There were reports that bystanders tried to tackle a man as he fled the station.

Was the 'handgun incident' of the 22nd July 2005 used as cover for the 'handgun incident' of July 21st 2005?

I cannot find any other references to this BBC reported 'handgun incident' of 21st July. Also note that no mention of handguns has been made in any of the reports of the trial of the J21st accused (Ramzi Mohammed has already been in the dock).
In some ways she was far more acute than Winston, and far less susceptible to Party propaganda. Once when he happened in some connection to mention the war against Eurasia, she startled him by saying casually that in her opinion the war was not happening. The rocket bombs which fell daily on London were probably fired by the Government of Oceania itself, "just to keep the people frightened." -- George Orwell, 1984

Joined: Jan 24 2006, 10:57 PM

Oct 31 2008, 04:38 PM #4

The transcript of the Jean Charles de Menezes Inquest day of of 16th October 2007 is presented as evidence on the 30 October 2008:

Code: Select all

On Page 170 onwards, there is mention of the Train Driver having a gun pointed at him, as he escaped down the tube tunnel:[quote=""WILLIAM at the JCdM Inquest 16th October 2007""]

Page 170
22 Q. Now, I don't want to take you, please, through the
23 events in the carriage. The jury have heard several
24 accounts now of what occurred. I just want you to tell
25 the jury, please, about an incident that happened after

Page 171
1 Mr de Menezes was shot and you were on the Tube
2 platform. If it helps you, I'm looking towards the
3 bottom of page 259 of your statement. Did you assist in
4 clearing the carriages to make sure that everybody, ie
5 passengers, were off the train?
6 A. Yes, I did.
7 Q. And what about the driver of the train?
8 A. As I was going through the carriages I had noticed that
9 there were two other plain clothes officers with
10 baseball caps on on the carriageway -- on the platform,
11 and I instructed them that I needed to clear the
12 carriages, to make sure there were no persons left on
13 board. When I got to the end of the carriages I asked
14 them about the train driver, whether he had left the
15 front of the train or not.
16 Q. Did you notice someone in the tunnel?
17 A. I did. As I got to the Tube, I looked up towards the
18 stairs, which were at the end of the platform.
19 I noticed a dark figure running away up the tracks.
20 Q. And what did you do?
21 A. I shouted "Armed police, stand still".
22 Q. Where was your weapon at this point?
23 A. That was drawn and up into the aim.

24 Q. Can you just indicate for the jury what position that
25 means?

Page 172
1 A. That means the weapon is a good eyesight between the
2 fore sight, rear sight, your eye, and the subject you
3 are looking at. The target you are looking at.
4 Q. Can you just cock your fingers and demonstrate?
5 A. It would be like that (Indicates). That was the aim.
6 So good eye relief between the subject, front sight,
7 rear sight and your eye.
8 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: You were pointing your gun at the
9 driver.
10 A. I believed he was a member of the public. Not the
11 public; an unknown quantity, a threat.
At that time,
12 I believed the driver had gone on to the platform and
13 gone away with the rest of the public, as instructed by
14 the other officers.
15 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: Of course, I'm not saying that
16 critically. The fact of the matter is that was what was
17 happening.
18 A. That is what was happening, yes.
19 MR KNOWLES: Where was your trigger finger at this point?
20 A. It was on the trigger.
21 Q. Sorry, I'm not sure whether you have told us this: you
22 pointed your weapon, did you say anything?
23 A. I shouted, "Stand still, armed police".
24 Q. Was there any response that you could see?
25 A. No, the gentleman went and hid between the wall which

Page 173
1 connects the two tracks together.
2 Q. So what did you do, please?
3 A. I continued to shout, put my tactical illuminator onto
4 my weapon, illuminated the tunnel and continued to
5 shout.
6 Q. What could you see?
7 A. I could see the head of this male down the Tube line
8 bobbing out of the -- from the wall.
9 Q. Just tell us, please, how this incident unfolds. You
10 are there with your weapon pointing and he is bobbing
11 his head out.
12 A. The gentleman is bobbing his head out from the wall
13 where the two tracks meet. I'm left handed; I'm at the
14 head wall of the train track. This affords me no
15 ballistic cover at all, being left handed, so
16 I addressed back to the front carriage of the Tube train
17 where it afforded me a little bit more ballistic
18 protection, not a lot, because of the construction of
19 the track -- the train itself. And I continued to shout
20 from there.
21 Q. Were you joined at some stage by another colleague?
22 A. I was indeed.
23 Q. And was that Sam?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. What happened after you were joined by Sam?

Page 174
1 A. This male then moved out into the tracks himself and
2 into my vision fully. I shouted at him to show me his
3 hands and walk towards the light. He put his hands up
4 and said he was the driver.
5 Q. What state was he in?
6 A. When he came out on to the platform, very shocked,
7 I suggest.
8 Q. What else did the driver say?
9 A. The driver said he had nearly electrocuted himself as he
10 jumped off the train and would not drive again.
11 Q. And thereafter, did you assist in post-incident
12 procedures dealing with explosives officers and matters
13 of that type?
14 A. That's correct, my Lord.
15 Q. Yes, thank you. Just wait there, please.
16 MR THWAITES: Does your Lordship wish me to start?
17 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: Well, entirely up to you,
18 Mr Thwaites. We've really heard all this before, but
19 I --
20 MR THWAITES: I am not going through it in extenso. Perhaps
21 I can start and finish.
22 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: I thought so. We are really pretty
23 familiar with this scenario.
24 Cross-examination by MR THWAITES
25 MR THWAITES: Yes, I just want to collect from you some new

Page 175
1 details that we haven't had --
2 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: Yes, of course.
3 MR THWAITES: -- from the Nightingale briefing. Can you go
4 to the part of your statement, please; in my version it
5 is page 3 of 6 of your first statement.
6 A. Do you mean the briefing at Nightingale Lane itself?
7 Q. Nightingale Lane, the briefing. I am only going to pick
8 out things which are new or different from what we have
9 had, do you follow me?
10 A. Yes.
11 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: Page 256, probably.
12 MR THWAITES: You have it, have you? It's 189 in mine.
13 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: 256, "When we arrived at
14 Nightingale Lane we made our way to the briefing room".
15 MR THWAITES: Right. I'm looking on a little bit further
16 than that, about ten lines further on, after the name
17 "Omar" appears at the end of a sentence and then it
18 continues:
19 "This vehicle and our subjects were concerned in a
20 previous intelligence operation in Cumbria ... "
21 I think that is a reference to Omar.
22 A. Yes, that's correct.
23 Q. Then I want to continue:
24 " ... along with some other persons connected with
25 7th July."

Page 176
1 So there is a linkage in the briefing?
2 A. That is correct, I mean --
3 Q. Between Omar, one of the people connected to
4 Scotia Road, and people connected with the 7th July
5 bombings.
6 A. That's correct, my Lord.
7 Q. That's what you are being told. Then:
8 "He then carried on giving us information about the
9 make up of the bombs on both dates and the methods of
10 detonation. The bombs were very volatile made up of
11 HMTB and easy to initiate by lighting fuses or by using
12 a light bulb with two wires and a battery."
13 A. That is correct, my Lord.
14 Q. Did he also tell you in the briefing that a converted
15 firearm had been recovered?
16 A. That's correct.
17 Q. Which would suggest or may suggest that the terrorist,
18 in addition to having bombs, had guns capable of being
19 fired?
20 A. That is correct.
21 Q. Then I go on to after the reference to the persons being
22 well prepared, deadly and determined and up for it, with
23 no regard to life, theirs or others:
24 " ... C12 asked if the types of bombs were easy to
25 conceal around the body and easy to detonate, and Silver

page 177
1 said 'yes'."
2 Then this question:
3 "C11 asked, if the bombs on 21st had detonated
4 correctly, would the results have been the same as the
5 7th ... "
6 A. That's correct.
7 Q. " ... 7/7, and Silver again said 'yes'."
8 A. That's correct, my Lord.
9 Q. So you understood from your second main briefing that
10 you were dealing with terrorists who had tried to
11 accomplish as much murder and mayhem as that caused by
12 the 7/7 bombings.

13 A. That's correct.
14 Q. "D3 asked if it is safe to assume that the subjects
15 still have ready access to explosives and they can be
16 easy to detonate and Silver said it could not be
17 discounted."
18 A. That is correct.
19 Q. I think without indulging in the horrors of repetition,
20 that is all I want to ask you.
21 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: Thank you very much. Thank you.
22 MR KNOWLES: I have no re-examination.
23 MR JUSTICE HENRIQUES: Thank you very much. That is as far
24 as we will go today.
25 MR KNOWLES: My Lord, yes.
In some ways she was far more acute than Winston, and far less susceptible to Party propaganda. Once when he happened in some connection to mention the war against Eurasia, she startled him by saying casually that in her opinion the war was not happening. The rocket bombs which fell daily on London were probably fired by the Government of Oceania itself, "just to keep the people frightened." -- George Orwell, 1984

Joined: Jan 24 2006, 10:57 PM

Nov 4 2008, 05:36 PM #5

Driver Statement read at the Inquest of 4th November 2008:
Page 2
4 Statement of QUINCY OJI (read)
5 MR HOUGH: The first statement is Quincy Akpesiri Oji.
6 SIR MICHAEL WRIGHT: As I remember, he is the train driver.
7 MR HOUGH: He is the train driver.
8 SIR MICHAEL WRIGHT: Page number, please?
9 MR HOUGH: Page 473. This is a statement dated 22 July 2005
10 and Mr Oji says that:
11 "This statement refers to a shooting incident that
12 I was present at."
13 He then refers to the time he started duty. He then
14 says:
15 "I am a tube train driver and I work for the
16 London Underground. I got to Stockwell tube station
17 just before 10 am... When I got there the light was red,
18 this is unusual for Stockwell tube station at this time
19 of day
. We were stopped there for about four or five
20 minutes. [Was Kennington Station closed because of the 'Fumes in Carriage incident?] I called over the station assistant, who was
21 on the platform. I asked him if he knew what was going
22 on and why we were stuck at Stockwell. He said, 'No',
23 but told me that Kennington tube station was closed.
24 I tried to call the controller using the train radio and
25 the automatic telephone on the platform. He wasn't

Page 3
1 answering and the signal went to green. I was still on
2 the platform. Normally I would then have gone, but
3 because Kennington was closed, I was concerned that the
4 passengers would need to change at Stockwell for the
5 Charing Cross train. I then heard people screaming, but
6 I could not make out what they were saying. I could
7 also hear feet stamping, as in people running. I looked
8 at the monitor in the front cab of the train. I was on
9 the tube when I heard all of this noise and the platform
10 assistant... was at the door to the train talking to me.
11 On the monitor I could see people running everywhere
12 towards the front of the train and towards the stairs
13 for the exit. I heard gunshots, there were about 15
14 shots. On the monitor I saw lots of people, I did not
15 recognise any of them. They were in mufti, this means
16 plain clothes. I could see about six to ten people with
17 guns outside the carriage. I think there were two of
18 them shooting. I saw one of the men with a big gun
19 shooting. The man with the big gun was shooting direct
20 into the carriage, his aim was straight, not up or down
21 I have then turned the train off which has switched the
22 monitor off. I could still see people running out
23 towards the exit near the front of the train. People
24 were still screaming and there was panic. Initially
25 I thought that they were fanatics and that they were

Page 4
1 shooting people in the carriage. I have then opened my
2 door, this is the front door. It is right at the front
3 of the train and leads on to the track. I have then run
4 into the dark tunnel, it was black and I was unable to
5 see. I was scared because it is a live track and there
6 are oncoming trains on the next track. I stepped
7 shortly into the tunnel and put myself up against the
8 wall to keep safe. This whole incident took place over
9 about a minute. I then stood with my back to the wall
10 for about 20 seconds. The noise had quietened down and
11 somebody flashed a light [into] the tunnel. The person
12 saw me and said, 'Freeze'. I had my hands in the air
13 and the train keys in my right hand. I said, 'Please
14 don't shoot, I am the driver'. He then said, 'Move
15 slowly'. He had his gun and the light pointed at me.
16 I saw that there were two other men with him, and they
17 had their guns pointed at me as well. The guy that was
18 talking to me had a small gun, which I think was in his
19 right hand and the flashlight in the other. The other
20 two guys had large guns. The same guy said, 'We're the
21 police'. I was walking slowly on the ballast. I was
22 unable to see because the light was in my eyes. He said
23 a few times, 'Move slowly' or 'move slowly forward'.
24 When I reached them, they patted me down and said, 'Get
25 out of the station'

Page 5
1 Then he describes leaving the station and, unless
2 anybody wishes, I won't read any more of his statement

Code: Select all

In some ways she was far more acute than Winston, and far less susceptible to Party propaganda. Once when he happened in some connection to mention the war against Eurasia, she startled him by saying casually that in her opinion the war was not happening. The rocket bombs which fell daily on London were probably fired by the Government of Oceania itself, "just to keep the people frightened." -- George Orwell, 1984

Joined: Jan 19 2006, 09:24 PM

Jun 3 2009, 03:18 PM #6

The driver has finally been compensated, but curiously this report does not mention that he had a gun pointed at his head:
Compensation for Jean Charles de Menezes tube driver

The driver of the Tube train on which Jean Charles de Menezes was shot has received compensation for suffering trauma.

Published: 8:58AM BST 03 Jun 2009

Quincy Oji had to take time off work after being caught up in the drama at Stockwell Tube station in South London in July 2005.

He was driving the train on which Mr de Menezes was shot after being mistaken for a suicide bomber.

Mr Oji ran through a tunnel after the shooting and fell to the ground as he was followed by armed police.

His claim for compensation for Post Traumatic Stress Disorder was initially turned down by the Criminal Injuries Compensation Authority (CICA), but he appealed and has now been awarded £1,000.

Keith Norman, leader of the train drivers' union Aslef, which supported the claim, said compensation was initially resisted because it was argued Mr Oji was some distance from the shooting.

"I have never come across such spurious arguments to avoid paying compensation to someone who clearly deserves recompense," he said.

"I'm delighted that we finally have recognition of the trauma suffered, even if £1,000 hardly reflects what driver Oji has endured."

Andrew Hutson from Thompsons solicitors, who worked on the case, added: "To my mind it would have been a grave injustice if the CICA had got away with refusing to offer any compensation.

"At least this successful appeal acknowledges the stresses endured by driver Oji since the terrible events five years ago."
Source: Telegraph

Edit: all the other news media reports are the same. They say he was chased by armed police, but fail to mention that weapons were aimed at him.
Innocent until proven guilty

Joined: Nov 26 2005, 01:46 AM

Jun 3 2009, 03:26 PM #7

^ £1000 is a derisory award, if the police had to pay compensation to all those that they terrorise I expect it would run into a 6 figure sum! This article goes into a bit more detail:
Driver of Charles de Menezes Tube awarded £1,000

Dick Murray

The Tube train driver who fled in terror into the tunnel after police shot dead Jean Charles de Menezes at Stockwell station in July 2005 has been awarded £1,000 compensation.

Quincy Oji was convinced the police were terrorists opening fire on passengers.

The driver was pursued by police who waved guns in his face as he lay on the ground.

As someone shone a flashlight into his face, Mr Oji screamed: "Please do not shoot, I am the train driver."

His case for compensation was originally turned down by the Criminal Injuries Compensation Authority on the grounds he had not been a victim of violent crime. This has now been overturned on appeal.

But the size of the compensation was condemned by Aslef, Mr Oji's union, who said it "hardly reflects" his suffering.

Mr de Menezes, 27, had been followed by armed police who believed he was failed 21/7 bomber Hussain Osman.

He boarded the train at Stockwell station and sat down in the carriage. Armed officers rushed onto the train and Mr de Menezes was shot dead.

A marksman told an inquest that he shouted "armed police" and opened fire because he had no alternative when Mr de Menezes came towards him. Other witnesses insist the victim was sitting when he was shot.

Mr Oji said: "I heard people screaming and I looked at the (television) monitor at the front of the train.

"I heard gunshots, there were about 15 of them. I saw one of the men with a large gun shooting and I thought they were fanatics and they were people shooting at people in the carriage. I have (to) run into the dark tunnel."

He jumped across live tracks and was "scared" because other trains were approaching.

Thompsons Solicitors, acting for Mr Oji on behalf of Aslef, argued at the compensation claim appeal that he had suffered post traumatic stress disorder.

Keith Norman, Aslef general secretary, said: "I have never come across such spurious arguments to avoid paying compensation to someone who clearly deserves compensation.

"I'm delighted that we finally have recognition of the trauma our member suffered, even if the £1,000 we have secured hardly reflects what Driver Oji suffered."
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�To those who are afraid of the truth, I wish to offer a few scary truths; and to those who are not afraid of the truth, I wish to offer proof that the terrorism of truth is the only one that can be of benefit to the proletariat.� -- On Terrorism and the State, Gianfranco Sanguinetti