question (Mike V?) on academy 1/32 sufa

question (Mike V?) on academy 1/32 sufa

Joined: October 25th, 2007, 2:59 pm

May 28th, 2011, 11:36 am #1

I want to build a Sufa and ordered an Academy 1/32 kit, which will be delivered next week. I read that it has a lot of inaccuracies/errors, shape wise.

As i was given a Tamiya 1/32 F16 (thunderbirds issue)that is missing some parts (cockpit, wheels, tanks), I am figuring kitbashing both to get a more accurate Sufa.

I am not familiar to f16, so I would appreciate any help on deciding if it is possible to do so, and what parts to use on each kit?

Many thanks in advance,

Dan
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Joined: February 27th, 2005, 2:02 am

May 28th, 2011, 7:28 pm #2

It would have been better to have the Tamiya F-16CJ kit to kit bash, as it would have been mostly be a matter of grafting the upper forward fuselage and canopy of the Academy kit to the Tamiya upper fuselage.

The problem with using the Tamiya F-16C kit is that it only has the light weight gear parts; LWG, non-bulged gear doors, and wheels. The corresponding Academy Heavy Weight Gear kit parts are either quite inaccurate or over scaled. You can still graft the upper forward fuselage and canopy of the Academy kit to the Tamiya upper fuselage, but youll be left with the LWG parts and trying to graft the Academy HWG parts would not be practical, not to mention the part inaccuracies.

The other possible, but much harder option would be to use some of the Tamiya parts on the Academy kit to make it more accurate; like the NSI Intake and Pratt Exhaust. It would not end as accurate or better looking as the Tamiya kit but its an option. While the Tamiya Exhaust is not too hard to adapt to the Academy fuselage, the Tamiya intake will take a lot of effort and modification to graft in.

I know this wasnt the answer you wanted to hear, but you can also try out another option by posting a want add to swap the Tamiya F-16C LWG parts with the F-16CJ HWG parts, for someone who is looking to build an MCID Block 30. Last resort, you can order the HWG Sprues from HLJ.

Good luck and if you have any more questions, just ask.

Mike V

"I am a "Realist". I see and call things as they are, not how I want them to be."

Some people just don't get it - "apologist
Last edited by ViperEnforcer on May 28th, 2011, 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: October 25th, 2007, 2:59 pm

May 28th, 2011, 10:51 pm #3

I want my sufa!!!

I googled pics of heavy and light weight MLG for a better understanding. Seems that something can be done, but I have not seen the academy kit parts yet.

So, what is your F16 expert opinion:

Is the kitbash a MUCH better option than the OOB Academy ? In other words, would the end result be worth the extra work?

Many thanks for your help, Mike

Dan

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Joined: February 27th, 2005, 2:02 am

May 29th, 2011, 1:28 am #4

If you want the best, most accurate Sufa, then a Tamiya kit bash would be the best option. That wpuld be my approach.

I did forget to mention that the Tamiya F-16CJ only has the GE Exhaust and MCID intake, which will is NOT a SUFA configuration. So as it turns out, you're actually better off uisng the Tamiya F-16C (Thunderbirds kit) than the CJ. You should be able to source the HWG parts more practically than the Pratt Exhaust and NSI Intake sprues if you went with the Tamiya F-16CJ Kit.

The Academy Sufa can be built into a fairly accurate F-16 model if the intake, gear, and bulged MLG doors are addressed. We have corrected NSI and MCID intakes planned (one is in work)for the Academy F-16, but it's going to be a while before they are availible.

There's always the Isra route:
http://www.fpkclub.com/Reviews/SUFA.htm

Part shapes are more accurate than Academy's, but they are not as clean or precise as Aires or Black Box.

Mike V

"I am a "Realist". I see and call things as they are, not how I want them to be."

Some people just don't get it - "apologist
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Joined: October 25th, 2007, 2:59 pm

May 29th, 2011, 6:37 am #5

I confess I was afraid by the conversion work and 'surgery' implied, but I guess building a kit OOB (especially if innacurate as is)is just...boring.(yes, AMS).

After all it's just a hobby!

Thanks again for your precious help Mike!

Dan
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Joined: August 16th, 2010, 11:10 pm

May 29th, 2011, 8:12 am #6

I want to build a Sufa and ordered an Academy 1/32 kit, which will be delivered next week. I read that it has a lot of inaccuracies/errors, shape wise.

As i was given a Tamiya 1/32 F16 (thunderbirds issue)that is missing some parts (cockpit, wheels, tanks), I am figuring kitbashing both to get a more accurate Sufa.

I am not familiar to f16, so I would appreciate any help on deciding if it is possible to do so, and what parts to use on each kit?

Many thanks in advance,

Dan

I used the small mouth intake and Pratt exhaust from the Tamiya T-birds kit on my Sufa, and its not that hard, just fiddly to get it just right. I also used the wheel well and MLG doors from the Tamiya CJ kit. The Tamiya Pratt T-birds exhaust mates to the Academy adapter ring very nicely, and although Academys part isn't as nice as the Tamiya equivalent, it looks OK and is an exact fit, the Tamiya adapter ring being slightly to small as I recall. To use the Tamiya intake, I had to carve out the opening in the Academy lower fuselage a bit so that the Tamiya intake part would fit inside slightly and and sit level. After opening up the hole and fiddling a bit, it lined up fairly easily.Trim carefully and theres very little filling required. I was not careful...
Because I used the Tamiya wheel well, I also used the Tamiya metal MLG and wheels. The front and rear bulkheads for the landing gear matched to the Academy fuselage contours surprising well, jsut a slight amount of trimming required.Because its the small mouth intake, the front gear well bulkhead is from the T-birds kit (necessary to match the contour of the small mouth intake), the rear one from the CJ kit. Since all the Tamiya parts are interchangeable, that was not problem at all. Having struggled with the Isra Sufa conversion and not finished it (and hence, the available CJ parts for this conversion)I thought this route was better due to the iffy quality and fit of the Isra stuff (and having thrown the Isra conversion attempt across the room). Couple other things I did to mine was to use the Tamiya bird cutter IFF antennas in front of the canopy, they are more accurate than the Academy parts, used the Tamiya gun muzzle port, Wolfpack RWR nose receivers (better shaped and sized tham Academy's), PWMP front wheel,CMK front wheel well (only because I had it laying around) and the Skunkmodels workshop CFT's, which are better shaped than Academys. This gave me as much hassle as anything, since they are contoured for the Tamiya fuselage, which the Academy kit does not match. There was some bending and reshaping with hot water needed to make the fit, along with the use of superglue and accelerator to make them stay. The seals around them are made from plastic rod and are correct in being less than a perfect fit. The real thing is a rubber type seal and is rather hit and miss fit wise, sticking out in one area and tucked under in another. Getting it looking perfect would actually be wrong. The Isra Sufa book was a great reference for this. Unless you are a dedicated F-16 guru, I think you would be happy with the results. But, I only had all the necessary parts because I both ordered the specific T-birds parts that I needed (intake, etc...) and had the parts from my abandoned Isra conversion available. This isn't the cheapest route to go, especially when it involved "test flying" the Isra conversion.

On to the pics. BTW, you will see some blue tack and clear tape in some of these, a lot of the stuff is just test fit in place. I should finish this thing, its been like this for over a year or more, since the Academy kit was released. And I just know Tamiya would finally "bless" us with a 2 seater F-16 if I went ahead and finished this one...















Last edited by eoyguy on May 29th, 2011, 5:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: February 27th, 2005, 2:02 am

May 29th, 2011, 10:49 am #7

I confess I was afraid by the conversion work and 'surgery' implied, but I guess building a kit OOB (especially if innacurate as is)is just...boring.(yes, AMS).

After all it's just a hobby!

Thanks again for your precious help Mike!

Dan
as you can see from what Jason has done on his Sufa. He used some of the WP Sufa parts, which are well cast but not quite as accurate as Isra, though are probably less expensive.

Which ever kit you base your Sufa from, there's going to be a lot of work involved. I've already made the Tamiya NSI intake fit the Academy kit, but it was no easy task especially since I had to make it modular to be an aftermarket set. If you're just doing a one time graft, you can get away with a lot more.

One more note; there really isn't an accurate Block 52+/Block 60 widened NLG wheel assembly out yet. The ones I've seen are based off the kit wheel, which is just as shallow. The real wheel has a notable deeper rim as well as a widened NLG fork; something that has not been done in any scale to date.

Let me know what kit you want to base your Sufa from and we can go from there.

Mike V


"I am a "Realist". I see and call things as they are, not how I want them to be."
Last edited by ViperEnforcer on May 29th, 2011, 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: August 16th, 2010, 11:10 pm

May 29th, 2011, 2:00 pm #8

The Isra nose RWR antennas are better size-wise and perhaps shape, but have no detail, a decal being used for that. The casting on mine were a litle funky as well, but that was par for the course with their Sufa conversion. The WP parts are somewhere between the kit parts and the Isra parts sizewise, and are better cast with engraved details.

Have you seen the PWMP wheel, or is the pic clear enough to determine is accuracy? Just wondering, 'cause I got it and a new Blk 52 NLG door (forgot to mention that) from PWMP at the same time. PWMP's door is a little better than Isra's. I forgot to add the indentation in the roof of the nose wheel bay for the bigger wheel, but did remember to add the bump inside the intake. I also added the WP cockpit. The intake you see in my pics is the actual one from my aborted Isra conversion. When I test flew it, the intake came off cleanly, so I just used it again. All the antennas and resin on the intake are Isra parts. I glued 'em good. The Tamiya fuselage did not fare so well...

Have you seen the CE NSI intake that they did for their Wild Hare "XL" kit? If it weren't for a little shrinkage, it would be nice. They just assembled the kits parts, made it seemless and cast it all as one piece. The shrinkage isn't so much as to be unusable...I think. I'm gonna try to use it on a long suffering F-16A conversion if I ever get back to it.

Well thats about it, its been so long that I probably forgot how much fiddling I did to get this one where it is now. But I figure it couldn't have been too much 'cause its still in one piece.
Last edited by eoyguy on May 29th, 2011, 2:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: February 27th, 2005, 2:02 am

May 30th, 2011, 4:27 am #9

Yes, I have both the WP and Isra 32nd Sufa sets and Ive been saying about the same as you; here and other forums. The Isra parts are a more accurate shape, but are not as sharply mastered or detailed; being rough and sparse in some areas. I wasn't too impressed with the Isra Vacu-form canopy either.


Ive seen the PWMP wheel from another modeler and could tell right away that the wheel was too shallow, the tire is not proportionally wide enough, and the tread cap is too square. I have not seen the door (other than your pics), but from I can tell, it looks pretty good accuracy wise.
Compare with the real NLG wheel:

[/IMG]

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If you could post or provide some higher res photos of the PWMP NLG door and wheel, that would be nice to see at that level. Have you painted them yet?

Yes, Ive seen the CE NSI Intake from the XL kit, as I did my friend a favor and took it off his hands after he bought it and realized how terribly inaccurate it was. Shrink in that scale is a major issue, especially with cross sectional fitting. I also tries fitting it to may Tamiya F-16CJ, but just as you found, it has too much shrinkage. Ill just have to master my own, though making up for the shrink factor when the time comes.
Nice work BTW on your Sufa build.

Cheers
Mike V


"I am a "Realist". I see and call things as they are, not how I want them to be."

Some people just don't get it - "apologist
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Joined: August 16th, 2010, 11:10 pm

May 30th, 2011, 7:08 pm #10

Here is the door, the lighter areas are glossy areas in the resin and are much more obvious here than to the mk. 1 eyeball. No painting done to anythhing at this point except in the 'pit. Another thing I added were the wingtip winders rails from the Tamiya CJ. The Isra canopy that came in mine was unusable, and not providing rails for it wasn't real cool either. I did notice that the canopy is available as a separate replacement..for $10. I wonder why???

[/IMG]
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