Good news, our members don't relapse anymore...

Joined: 19 Dec 2008, 01:47

10 Dec 2003, 22:22 #31

Joel, I fully understand! Right On. jery

Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:58

10 Dec 2003, 22:47 #32

I too want to say that I support the policy. It has more than once deterred me from slipping, cheating, or what ever else we want to call a relapse. Freedom is not for everyone, neither is cold turkey, but it's working for me. There are plenty of other sites out there with more lenient relapse policies that also support alternative methods of quitting. I must admit I've looked at some of them. They were not for me.

What has made this quit possible for me is the realization that I am ADDICTED to nicotine. That really is what it's all about here. For an addict to reintroduce an addictive substance into his or her body is just not acceptable. There IS no excuse for relapse.

Wilson - Free and Healing for Two Months, 11 Hours and 47 Minutes, while extending my life expectancy 8 Days and 12 Hours, by avoiding the use of 2460 nicotine delivery devices that would have cost me $219.46.

Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:58

10 Dec 2003, 23:55 #33

Yes indeed.
Current member.
A year and a half of surprising myself. NTAP, Ni una calada más.

GrumpyOMrsS (Gold)
Joined: 19 Dec 2008, 00:00

01 Jan 2004, 00:21 #34

We apologize for pulling a string today with numerous responses because we just realized that it was a person whose membership had been accepted last January, relapsed and had just begun a new quit .

That person is now 7 days into a new quit. For that we are very happy and we hope that the person continues to read here and at and continues to find us a valuable resource.

Everyone made an agreement when applying to Freedom that they were going to quit cold turkey and were dedicated to never take another puff! That is the price of staying a member now. Again, post a relapse or begin a new quit and your membership is permanently pulled.


John (Gold)
Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:57

01 Jan 2004, 01:17 #35

To the new arrival our relapse policy may seem harsh but please know that we do work behind the boards with a number of relapsed members, that each of them are still just as free as Image you to read, learn and grow from all happening here at Freedom, and that each and everyone of them now fully understands the law of addiction and what it takes to remain free today.

Yes we take recovery by every member very seriously but if you think that we play hardball then you need to stop and think about just how hard smoking plays. If it takes depriving a nicotine addict of posting privileges to help briefly focus them on smoking's potential to deprive them of life itself then that's a pretty solid trade. With expectations conditioning playing such an important part of recovery we can not allow this forum to serve as a revolving door to relapse.

The next few minutes are entirely doable and there is only one rule, no nicotine today! John

Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:57

06 Jan 2004, 08:19 #36

The following text lifted from the old thread discusses the advantages of our no relapse policy, both for a group as a whole as well as each individual member. Saying that if you relapse that we want you to come back again is taking away a major incentive not to relapse. Everyone reading such a message will think that we don't take relapsing too seriously so why should they? Read the text below, I think you will get the idea of how the relapse policy protects everybody.


I saw where a member wrote tonight that because of a tragic situation she was thinking she should just smoke and quit again once she got through the bad time period. We have designed Freedom to take care of such logic. You cannot relapse with the intention that you will just come back and quit again. Relapsing is a commitment to smoke and forever forgo participating at Freedom again. Harsh you may say. Well yes it is, but it is because you have to be harsh with yourself if you are going to keep on top of this addiction. Give cigarettes and inch and they will take your life. If you want to stay smoke free always remember why you first committed and are still committed to never take another puff!


Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:57

08 Jan 2004, 07:02 #37

We've had a flood of new members over the past few days. I know from an email I got from one member that the person relapsed and was hoping that he or she could become a member again in the future when he or she was ready to quit. As you can see from our policy membership at Freedom needs to be viewed as a chance of a lifetime.

Just for the record I am going to reiterate the closing comments of this post here:
This policy offers up two big advantages. The first is to the group as a whole. Every person coming here is now guaranteed that the board is always going to be focused on people who are successfully off smoking. There will be no need to spend time consoling relapses or trying to help a person rationalize a relapse. Again we had the advantages of that principle already covered in our There is no legitimate reason to relapse thread.

But the primary benefactor of this policy is each and every member himself or herself. We have made it very easy for each and every member to have a clearly defined spelled out battle line. No longer does a person have the luxury of thinking, "Well if I relapse, I'll go to Freedom and quit again." We have in effect destroyed what to some people can be a very persuasive argument supporting a kind of junkie thinking.

Again, for the majority of people here this policy poses no threat and makes the each and every members mission here that much more clearly defined. It was what their intent was the day they first signed up to Freedom. To stay a member of Freedom, and more important, to keep the health and life saving benefits of staying a successful ex-smoker is as simple now as just remembering to stay totally committed to never take another puff!

One other point I want to make. The person had written to a number of other new members making the offer to support them in succeeding at keeping their quits. This kind of overture is an attempt at making a classic kind of buddy system. Hopefully all will realize the limitation of this system for if any member's quit was in any way contingent on this member's success, those people would be in real trouble now. Hopefully this is not the case and all of our newer members here know not to lock in their quits with other newer members. Because of the importance of this concept I am going to copy the whole text from our Buddy Systems thread:

Buddy Systems

You often hear about buddy systems in substance abuse programs. AA and NA and CA heavily utilize this highly effective and supportive technique. But it is important to understand something about the term "buddy system" These programs are generally "buddying" the newbie with a sponsor more than a buddy.

The sponsor is not a person quitting the same day; it is a person who has likely been quit for a significant time period. Someone who is more stable in their own quit because they have a myriad of time and experiences already under their belt. They are not cured but they are more secure and probably have a deeper understanding of not only what quitting is like, but more important what it is like not to be using after an extended time period. This is the message that the person in the middle of a quit needs to hear. Not just what today is like, they know that already. Talking with people only in this stage of the game is just sharing misery. What is more important for the person in withdrawal is to understand the importance of overcoming this time period. To hang in to see what next week, next month or even next year will be like, if they just don't smoke for these time periods. Who better to deliver this message than people off these amounts of time?

Smokers who never quit smoking know what it is like to smoke. Smokers who are in the middle of their first week of quitting know what it is like to smoke and what it is like to be in withdrawal. But smokers who are off for longer time periods know what it is like to smoke, quit, and stay off. They know there is life after smoking, life after withdrawal. The people who even know more are those who have smoked, quit, went through withdrawal, stayed off months or maybe years, relapsed, quit again, and are now off a long time. They have more experience than anyone does and likely a deeper appreciation of the addiction and recognition of how precious and fragile their quit actually is. They still have to work at it, but it is among the most worthwhile work that they do any given day.

These people are here, and for you newbies. I am using "newbie" here as people in the first few days of their quit, even if they have been here in the past, this is a new quit for them. If you want real support, turn to the longer-term ex-smokers. They will help you in ways that you may not yet be able to help each other. But take heart here, this is not saying that you won't be able to help others too. But your primary focus needs to be on your own quit now.

Keep in mind, you will only be a smoker in the middle of a quit for a short time period. Pretty soon you will be the seasoned veteran. When this happens, remember how past seasoned veterans helped you and pass along the support. This community should only grow larger over time. Staying to help others will help secure your own quit too. Many programs use the phrase, "To keep it, you have to give it away." No where is this more true than dealing with addictions. And never lose sight that smoking is an addiction. Whether today is your first day, your hundredth day or your thousandth day, the trick to beating your addiction for today is the same, never take another puff!


Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:57

08 Feb 2004, 08:08 #38

A member just put up a post asking if any member who has quit since the beginning of the year have lost their quits. The answer is no current member has relapsed since the beginning of the year. There may have been some ex-members who relapsed but since they can't answer it really serves no purpose to post the question here. Again, as it says in the title of this string--our members don't relapse here at Freedom. Only our ex-members do because they forgot to stick with the commitment that they made to themselves to never take another puff!


Joined: 07 Jan 2009, 19:01

08 Feb 2004, 08:47 #39

The question was asked for two reasons. I am sort of getting tired of reading about all the previous quits people have had. Obviously, when they talk about previous quits, it is a contradiction in terms. A quit is permanent. They either quit or they didn't. If they didn't, then we should not be hearing about the previous failures. We don't need to hear from people who are expert at failing. It is not encouraging and makes one thing that the majority of people are quitting over and over again. I was seeking some statistics from this website vs others methods and websites.....someone had ask me about your success rate....sorry....

BillW Gold.ffn
Joined: 18 Dec 2008, 23:59

08 Feb 2004, 08:59 #40

Hi Plover:

Freedom is at about 45% still quit at one year.... if my memory serves me right. You can pretty much verify that by going back into the
1st Post & Diary
message board, and going backwards in time over a year. You will see that many (not all) of the posters have advanced colors against their names.
For comparison, the patch and gum are about 5% still quit at six months. This compares to less than 3% for "uneducated" cold turkey quitting. The lesson of Freedom.... of Joel and the managers, is that educated, supported cold turkey quitting approaches 50%......
We sometimes bring up "previous" quits, since that is how we (now) recognize that one puff is too much. We are usually affirming the truth of Never Take Another Puff, from our own experience.
YQB BillW 2 years.