Start the downswing

Start the downswing

Joined: May 13th, 2007, 1:30 pm

May 23rd, 2007, 6:38 pm #1

Hello,

Does Mr Haddix (or anyone for that matter) have any suggestions on how to start the downswing in the Stack and Tilt swing?

I am toying with two swing thoughts on starting the downswing; step down with your lead foot or a basic core turn which is turning by feeling your belt buckle moving towards the target. Or perhaps a little bit of both?

Thanks
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Joined: May 20th, 2007, 6:27 am

May 23rd, 2007, 8:54 pm #2

I try to think of the swing centers (i.e. dots between my shoulder and hips) rotating in front of the ball. Along with that I think about starting my tailbone release. I've found that I fight the pulls a little bit since I changed my swing 6 months ago, and I've found that by thinking about my tailbone release during the first part of my downswing helps shallow me out a little earlier and avoid a pull. Hope that helps.
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Joined: May 4th, 2007, 3:33 pm

May 24th, 2007, 3:24 am #3

Hello,

Does Mr Haddix (or anyone for that matter) have any suggestions on how to start the downswing in the Stack and Tilt swing?

I am toying with two swing thoughts on starting the downswing; step down with your lead foot or a basic core turn which is turning by feeling your belt buckle moving towards the target. Or perhaps a little bit of both?

Thanks
I'm Joe Norwood's Grandson and teach his swing. His swing is horizontal back and vertical down. The hips are held and rotate only after the arms move through the impact area. That being said. The start of my downswing is the unfolding of the right arm from the right shoulder to the direction of the back of the right heel. The start is a 1-2 inch move and as my grandfather used to say " then hold on " Joe taught golf from 1910 to 1990, his swing is based on 5 great players, Harry Vardon, Sam Snead, Ben Hogan, Bruce Crampton and the putting technique of Mr. Walter J. Travis who taught Joe how to put in 1913. Thanks for listening.
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Joined: April 5th, 2007, 8:11 am

May 27th, 2007, 5:37 am #4

Hello,

Does Mr Haddix (or anyone for that matter) have any suggestions on how to start the downswing in the Stack and Tilt swing?

I am toying with two swing thoughts on starting the downswing; step down with your lead foot or a basic core turn which is turning by feeling your belt buckle moving towards the target. Or perhaps a little bit of both?

Thanks
Obviously there is a slight lateral motion of the upper and lower COGs to initiate the downswing, and feeling like you are "steppin with the left foot" should be sufficient to produce this shift. Unless you are planning on starting all of your shots to the left of the target, you don't want your downswing to consist of simply keeping the hips where they are and rotating. The more the COGs move forward, the farther back you are effectively moving the ball on the circle of the swing, and the easier it should be to get the ball starting straight or slightly right, assuming that's what you are after.
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Joined: May 13th, 2007, 1:30 pm

May 28th, 2007, 8:46 pm #5

I'm Joe Norwood's Grandson and teach his swing. His swing is horizontal back and vertical down. The hips are held and rotate only after the arms move through the impact area. That being said. The start of my downswing is the unfolding of the right arm from the right shoulder to the direction of the back of the right heel. The start is a 1-2 inch move and as my grandfather used to say " then hold on " Joe taught golf from 1910 to 1990, his swing is based on 5 great players, Harry Vardon, Sam Snead, Ben Hogan, Bruce Crampton and the putting technique of Mr. Walter J. Travis who taught Joe how to put in 1913. Thanks for listening.
Lever Power Golf that used to play last year, has the same down motion type swing. So I am very familiar with this move.

Do you think you can generate enough power with this move? For me, works great with the irons but never worked well with the driver.

Thanks for the response.

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Joined: May 4th, 2007, 3:33 pm

May 29th, 2007, 2:52 am #6


Thanks for your question:

The answer to your question is yes but that doesn’t tell you how. Joe’s book is available, here’s a direct quote relating to your question. Page 114, paragraph 3

Speed plus mass are what move the golf ball. Do not swing harder; merely swing faster. The faster the chuck is made out of the elbow (right), the more speed is developed. Everything else remains the same except for the added speed out the elbow. A swing out of the elbow will take a two-hundred-pounder through the shot, but when the two –hundred – pounder tries to overpower a twelve ounce club, the ball doesn’t get very much flying time. End quote.

Joe is saying distance is relative to speed or at least that’s what I’m saying. Lack of distance with this swing will be caused by rotation, wrist break, lunging or lifting up with the knees during impact. The shoulders are pistons. The faster you move the pistons in an automobile the faster the automobile travels.

Thanks for the question and good luck.

Dan

P.S. I've got a post on the Norwood swing on Single Axis Forum. It gives you a better idea as to what Joe's swing is all about.

I've got a couple of pages on my site dedicated to Joe: Here's one:
http://www.dan-norwood.com/the-anatomy- ... rwood.html
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Joined: April 5th, 2007, 8:11 am

May 29th, 2007, 3:18 am #7

So let me get this straight... my clubhead speed is around 115-120 mph. So if I could fasten a golf club to a car that would travel 200 mph, and have the golf ball positioned on a tee so that the ball would contact the club in the sweet spot, you are telling me that ball would go farther when the car-driven club hits it versus me hitting it?
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Joined: May 4th, 2007, 3:33 pm

May 29th, 2007, 3:56 am #8

You could certainly increase your club speed to 125 mph, with Joe's swing by swinging faster with the forearm out of the shoulder. It has nothing to do with tying a golf club to the side of an automobile. Shoulders act as pistons and as pistons they accelerate by muscle exertion, therefore more controlled exertion must lead to more speed. Rotation will decelerate the piston action of the shoulders. Can't move both the waist horizontal and the shoulders vertical to their maximum at the same time, the physics of it just won't work.

The pistons have nothing to do with an automobile. It can be a two stroke weed eater. The more gas you give the motor the faster the pistons move therefore the faster the engine runs.

Anyway the average golfer probably only has a swing speed of 90 MPH or less. This analogy is not for the seasoned professional for which he-she or I will disagree, it has to do with the 30 handicap golfer being able to hit a straight shot and therefore using a piston scenario to assist a high handicap golfer moving from idle to medium speed is the issue as someone with a 120 mph speed will probably not desire additional distance anyway.

Thanks

Dan
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Joined: November 11th, 2005, 11:32 pm

May 30th, 2007, 3:40 am #9

So let me get this straight... my clubhead speed is around 115-120 mph. So if I could fasten a golf club to a car that would travel 200 mph, and have the golf ball positioned on a tee so that the ball would contact the club in the sweet spot, you are telling me that ball would go farther when the car-driven club hits it versus me hitting it?
Denver,

Of course the 200 mph clubhead speed will hit the ball farther than your 120 mph clubhead speed. I don't get what you are trying to say with your question. Please elaborate.

Tom
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Joined: May 13th, 2007, 1:30 pm

May 30th, 2007, 1:43 pm #10

Thanks for your question:

The answer to your question is yes but that doesn’t tell you how. Joe’s book is available, here’s a direct quote relating to your question. Page 114, paragraph 3

Speed plus mass are what move the golf ball. Do not swing harder; merely swing faster. The faster the chuck is made out of the elbow (right), the more speed is developed. Everything else remains the same except for the added speed out the elbow. A swing out of the elbow will take a two-hundred-pounder through the shot, but when the two –hundred – pounder tries to overpower a twelve ounce club, the ball doesn’t get very much flying time. End quote.

Joe is saying distance is relative to speed or at least that’s what I’m saying. Lack of distance with this swing will be caused by rotation, wrist break, lunging or lifting up with the knees during impact. The shoulders are pistons. The faster you move the pistons in an automobile the faster the automobile travels.

Thanks for the question and good luck.

Dan

P.S. I've got a post on the Norwood swing on Single Axis Forum. It gives you a better idea as to what Joe's swing is all about.

I've got a couple of pages on my site dedicated to Joe: Here's one:
http://www.dan-norwood.com/the-anatomy- ... rwood.html
Using the trail arm tricep to bring the hands down the plane moving in clock fashion (top- 12:00 to 11:00 to 10:00...) is a LPG type move. I found this works great for shorter clubs. However, for the driver or fairway club, it could get tricky. You have to make an effort to roll your trail forearm over your lead arm or your club face will be wide open.

Someone made a reference once that you can generate club head speed by swinging the club using certain muscles in a certain sequence, like a snapping a bullwhip. You can't muscle a bullwhip to generate that snap. But, a flick of the wrist will make the whip pop. I feel this is similiar with the LPG type of move. If I can overcome the driver flaw with this type of downswing, then, game over. I would make this swing mine and own it.

Of course, that is the tricky part. Having a swing that is consistent and works for ALL the clubs.
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