So is there a "trick" to get Moly rings to seat?

So is there a "trick" to get Moly rings to seat?

Joined: December 19th, 2008, 2:01 pm

June 15th, 2012, 12:59 pm #1

I should have known better and stuck with good old cast, but since it was a fresh .030" overbore with a nice cylinder finish I put the first type of Moly Sealed Power rings in my engine (there is more than one grade as I recall/discovered after I bought them). The other day I noticed my oil pressure was not as high as it usually is. Then I noticed my noisy valvetrain (B302 valve covers seem to amplify valvetrain noise) was a little noiser than usual.

Checked the oil and was horrified (and mad at myself for not checking it sooner, checked a couple of weeks ago before Carlisle and it was fine) to find the oil was down over 2 quarts! Barely reading on the stick! And dirty! Can't be more than 1500 miles on it since changed, 20W-50 with ZDDP Plus.

Changed the oil and all is well but I am pissed that I can't seem to get these rings to seat.

Valve covers have the correct baffles in them.

Anyone have any tricks/advice or just live and learn to stick with cast rings?

Bob
Last edited by rentwist on June 15th, 2012, 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: February 28th, 2008, 4:15 pm

June 15th, 2012, 5:06 pm #2

How many miles total on motor? Most ring sets have a cast second ring so it should seat pretty fast. Try a thicker oil and see what that does. I have heard of old timers mixing up some Bon Ami and water and putting it in a squirt bottle and spary it in the carb with motor running to seat chrome rings.
Andy
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Joined: June 12th, 2009, 1:31 pm

June 15th, 2012, 5:14 pm #3

I should have known better and stuck with good old cast, but since it was a fresh .030" overbore with a nice cylinder finish I put the first type of Moly Sealed Power rings in my engine (there is more than one grade as I recall/discovered after I bought them). The other day I noticed my oil pressure was not as high as it usually is. Then I noticed my noisy valvetrain (B302 valve covers seem to amplify valvetrain noise) was a little noiser than usual.

Checked the oil and was horrified (and mad at myself for not checking it sooner, checked a couple of weeks ago before Carlisle and it was fine) to find the oil was down over 2 quarts! Barely reading on the stick! And dirty! Can't be more than 1500 miles on it since changed, 20W-50 with ZDDP Plus.

Changed the oil and all is well but I am pissed that I can't seem to get these rings to seat.

Valve covers have the correct baffles in them.

Anyone have any tricks/advice or just live and learn to stick with cast rings?

Bob
Find a long hill and run the s**t out of it, really pull a long hill in a gear that will keep the motor working hard and give it all she has, no lugging or high reving, just make it work hard.
Last edited by 62highboy393c on June 16th, 2012, 1:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: December 17th, 2003, 4:14 pm

June 15th, 2012, 5:15 pm #4

I should have known better and stuck with good old cast, but since it was a fresh .030" overbore with a nice cylinder finish I put the first type of Moly Sealed Power rings in my engine (there is more than one grade as I recall/discovered after I bought them). The other day I noticed my oil pressure was not as high as it usually is. Then I noticed my noisy valvetrain (B302 valve covers seem to amplify valvetrain noise) was a little noiser than usual.

Checked the oil and was horrified (and mad at myself for not checking it sooner, checked a couple of weeks ago before Carlisle and it was fine) to find the oil was down over 2 quarts! Barely reading on the stick! And dirty! Can't be more than 1500 miles on it since changed, 20W-50 with ZDDP Plus.

Changed the oil and all is well but I am pissed that I can't seem to get these rings to seat.

Valve covers have the correct baffles in them.

Anyone have any tricks/advice or just live and learn to stick with cast rings?

Bob
It doesn't take much oil in the cylinders to fog for mosquitoes. What do the plugs look like?
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Joined: December 19th, 2008, 2:01 pm

June 15th, 2012, 5:54 pm #5

How many miles total on motor? Most ring sets have a cast second ring so it should seat pretty fast. Try a thicker oil and see what that does. I have heard of old timers mixing up some Bon Ami and water and putting it in a squirt bottle and spary it in the carb with motor running to seat chrome rings.
Andy
And am already running 20W-50. I don't think I should or need to run thicker than that.
Last edited by rentwist on June 15th, 2012, 6:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: December 16th, 2003, 1:59 am

June 15th, 2012, 5:54 pm #6

Find a long hill and run the s**t out of it, really pull a long hill in a gear that will keep the motor working hard and give it all she has, no lugging or high reving, just make it work hard.
the 'trick' i've always heard is that you don't let the engine coast down, you use engine braking like on the downhill side in 2nd gear so the engine builds high vacuum

i have a feeling that if it is a ring seat issue, and they're not seated by now there's a problem...

what grit hone did you finish with?

there'll be phantoms, there'll be fires on the road... and the white man dancing
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Joined: December 19th, 2008, 2:01 pm

June 15th, 2012, 5:54 pm #7

Find a long hill and run the s**t out of it, really pull a long hill in a gear that will keep the motor working hard and give it all she has, no lugging or high reving, just make it work hard.
I can do that! Thanks Dan n/m
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Joined: December 19th, 2008, 2:01 pm

June 15th, 2012, 6:05 pm #8

the 'trick' i've always heard is that you don't let the engine coast down, you use engine braking like on the downhill side in 2nd gear so the engine builds high vacuum

i have a feeling that if it is a ring seat issue, and they're not seated by now there's a problem...

what grit hone did you finish with?

there'll be phantoms, there'll be fires on the road... and the white man dancing
320 grit n/m
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Joined: December 19th, 2008, 2:01 pm

June 15th, 2012, 6:20 pm #9

It doesn't take much oil in the cylinders to fog for mosquitoes. What do the plugs look like?
I haven't checked the plugs, will do. No noticeable smoke except when I took a little video of behind the car when the engine was brand new it was puffing some on decel when goosed sitting in the driveway. Not sure if it is still doing that or not. Certainly no visible smoke evident (but there wasn't in the beginning either, the camera caught what I couldn't see/notice).

My buddy that owns the machine shop (where we did the engine) says to check the plugs for signs (as you've suggested) and then do a dry followed by wet compression test. Don't think I will find anything wrong with the rings, but worth a test to see at least. He also says that sometimes teflon valve seals (Sealed Power in my case) can mysteriously cause/have oil consumption problems.

Thanks everyone.
Last edited by rentwist on June 15th, 2012, 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: January 10th, 2002, 5:53 pm

June 15th, 2012, 6:48 pm #10

I should have known better and stuck with good old cast, but since it was a fresh .030" overbore with a nice cylinder finish I put the first type of Moly Sealed Power rings in my engine (there is more than one grade as I recall/discovered after I bought them). The other day I noticed my oil pressure was not as high as it usually is. Then I noticed my noisy valvetrain (B302 valve covers seem to amplify valvetrain noise) was a little noiser than usual.

Checked the oil and was horrified (and mad at myself for not checking it sooner, checked a couple of weeks ago before Carlisle and it was fine) to find the oil was down over 2 quarts! Barely reading on the stick! And dirty! Can't be more than 1500 miles on it since changed, 20W-50 with ZDDP Plus.

Changed the oil and all is well but I am pissed that I can't seem to get these rings to seat.

Valve covers have the correct baffles in them.

Anyone have any tricks/advice or just live and learn to stick with cast rings?

Bob
With proper bore finish, a quality ring set and clean assembly, moly faced rings should seat before the cam is finished breaking in. Or, pretty much right away. On my motors that I've raced, after the cam break in is done I load the engine against the converter a few times, take the car to the track and beat the hell out of it. Yet to have any ring seal issues. If you are not trailing clouds of blue smoke running down the road, maybe your oil loss problem is elsewhere.

1967 Falcon 4 door 351C-4V
1970 Mustang 351C-2V
http://raceabilene.com/kelly/hotrod
Owner built, owner abused.
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