Joined: December 16th, 2003, 11:56 pm

August 15th, 2013, 6:06 pm #21

AMEN.
He has broken this down to the most basic fudamentals of Engineering. There are many factors in a dynamic system like an engine. But the most important thing to be gleened from what he just said is that when a given load is applied to an area, in this case the cylinder wall, the thinner the wall the more focused the forces become.

I will conceed that my knowledge of block fillers may be incomplete. There may be more advantage there than I give credit for.

Clevelands are, in MOST cases, too thin to begin with. Windsors are, in MOST cases, thicker than clevelands. Therefore my best bet, given the facts that I have, and within my budget, is to build a clevor. Virtually all the imput that I have seen thus far confirm that with my set of requirements, the best bet is a W block.
build what you believe in. Nobody has a crystal ball here or anywhere.
Take full ownership and responsibility for what you decide and what you build. If it breaks, don't despair, don't look to blame others, build another and move on.
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Joined: February 13th, 2006, 4:59 am

August 15th, 2013, 6:09 pm #22

AMEN.
He has broken this down to the most basic fudamentals of Engineering. There are many factors in a dynamic system like an engine. But the most important thing to be gleened from what he just said is that when a given load is applied to an area, in this case the cylinder wall, the thinner the wall the more focused the forces become.

I will conceed that my knowledge of block fillers may be incomplete. There may be more advantage there than I give credit for.

Clevelands are, in MOST cases, too thin to begin with. Windsors are, in MOST cases, thicker than clevelands. Therefore my best bet, given the facts that I have, and within my budget, is to build a clevor. Virtually all the imput that I have seen thus far confirm that with my set of requirements, the best bet is a W block.
Pat you have your mind set on the Windsor and that is fine you have to have peace of mind on any engine build or you will be on edge all the time. Here's what I get out of this whole conversation ! First off it seems that the consensus would be in mild perf use both engines fairly reliable with the edge maybe towards Windsor. One thing that is interesting is that the Windsor never had a head capable of producing big power unless it used the c-heads. So really there is not much data out on it once the hp goes up, and like I mentioned before most guys fed up with c-motors splitting went to the aftermarket(stronger Windsor ). I have a couple Windsors and I'm going to sonic check them one day to see where they sit. If the Windsor truly was stronger I'm sure we would see them more at the tracks, but that simply is not the case! I have ran the Cleveland's to just under the 500hp thresh hold with no problems non grouted! I recently sonic checked this block and it was about the same as yours on the non thrust measurement! I have a feeling the Windsor wouldve followed the same fate had the engines ran the power levels the Cleveland did. This is my gut feeling so maybe I could be off. It was interesting to say the least to get this info out and see where we stand. I'm currently bolting together another 436 prepped by Tim Meyer, once bolted together I hope to crest the 700 hp mark with dual 1050's and the ur19 manifold. That last engine made 650 and split the deck,and after talking to others on this site it seems the cause likely faulty installed sleeves. I will keep you posted on the lifespan of this engine. It will be interesting to say the least. It would've been cheaper for me to buy the aftermarket Windsor but I'm a bit of a hard head!
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Joined: December 16th, 2003, 11:56 pm

August 15th, 2013, 7:20 pm #23

AMEN.
He has broken this down to the most basic fudamentals of Engineering. There are many factors in a dynamic system like an engine. But the most important thing to be gleened from what he just said is that when a given load is applied to an area, in this case the cylinder wall, the thinner the wall the more focused the forces become.

I will conceed that my knowledge of block fillers may be incomplete. There may be more advantage there than I give credit for.

Clevelands are, in MOST cases, too thin to begin with. Windsors are, in MOST cases, thicker than clevelands. Therefore my best bet, given the facts that I have, and within my budget, is to build a clevor. Virtually all the imput that I have seen thus far confirm that with my set of requirements, the best bet is a W block.
produced with a thicker cylinder wall? They both used so called thin wall casting methods. Did the Windsor benefit from better quality control in the casting plant? So many questions and no answers. The horse that breaks down will generally be the one that is ridden hardest.
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Joined: August 10th, 2008, 11:10 pm

August 15th, 2013, 7:37 pm #24

would this be considered a failure or a catastrophy?

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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

August 15th, 2013, 7:45 pm #25

Yikes!

small children and easily offended folks may be terrified!

-blizz

351C.net, Just say no to multi groove keepers..
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Joined: August 10th, 2008, 11:10 pm

August 15th, 2013, 7:48 pm #26

I hear ya. Imagine the feeling in my guts when I focused in on that for the first time. I did this last week still trying to figure out exactly what happened
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Joined: December 16th, 2003, 11:56 pm

August 15th, 2013, 7:50 pm #27

would this be considered a failure or a catastrophy?

Nice clean exit, what were the circumstances? n/m
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Joined: February 13th, 2006, 4:59 am

August 15th, 2013, 8:10 pm #28

Yup no fooling around here! We know (sorta) what side that one goes! Ouch! Let me ask us there a blue jug in trunk?
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Joined: August 10th, 2008, 11:10 pm

August 15th, 2013, 8:27 pm #29

Nope no jug in the trunk. I was on my way to a car show thought I would run the gears a bit. My rev limiter is set at 6000 so It didnt get too wound up ran out first hit second got to about 4500 sounded sick, big bang,parts bouncing off the road and a big cloud of smoke followed by a sinking feeling. It seems it dropped an intake valve on #8 found three cracked valve spring retainers as well. My guess is this retainer cracked let loose and the rest as they say....
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Joined: February 13th, 2006, 4:59 am

August 15th, 2013, 8:32 pm #30

I did sorta the same on first Cleveland but you did a way better window!!Do you think the Chevy guys talk about this stuff??
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