Chris Craft Sea V

Chris Craft Sea V

Glenn
Glenn

December 26th, 2009, 10:07 pm #1

Paul and all;

I'm looking for help identifying the out drive on my CC 20 Sea V boat.

It has a tag that reads Marine Chrysler. I've been told it may be a Volvo.







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Mike W
Mike W

December 26th, 2009, 10:39 pm #2

Wow this took me back in time. I worked for Chrysler Marine fresh out of college. It appears to be a Volvo. Chrysler used outdrives for their boats from Dana and Volvo prior to coming out with their own in the late 70's just prior to closing up in the first Chrysler government bailout.

Marysville Marine used to be a big parts supplier so they may be able to help. Marine Parts Source is their retail arm.


Here is some history.

http://www.hurrikain.com/Chryslercrew-new.htm

Mike
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Didier
Didier

December 26th, 2009, 11:06 pm #3

Paul and all;

I'm looking for help identifying the out drive on my CC 20 Sea V boat.

It has a tag that reads Marine Chrysler. I've been told it may be a Volvo.






it's a VOLVO 270
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Paul
Paul

December 27th, 2009, 3:57 am #4

Paul and all;

I'm looking for help identifying the out drive on my CC 20 Sea V boat.

It has a tag that reads Marine Chrysler. I've been told it may be a Volvo.






Hi Glenn, Hi guys,

I see the Sea V is getting some attention, and rightly so. It's a rare bird and there simply are NOT a lot of these left. If you drive around the countryside you'll see boats in back yards, boats in pastures open to the elements, boats in junk yards, boats out behind barns, etc., and I would dare say that most of them will never float again. The Sea V series is so old now, that most of them have long ago been lost behind barns and in pastures, so the ones that still exist in restorable condition are going to fit the definition of "rare", because there just were not all that many of them made 40+ years ago in the first place.

Looking at the Essential Guide, I see 130 of the 18' Sea V outdrive boats were built, with power options including the Buic 225B, Eaton 140, or OMC HUE 150. Guys, these things belong in the Smithsonian. Now I see 220 of the 20' inboard versions were built with 283 power, very similar to my 20' Sea Skiff design, and then another 425 of the Transdrive units were built during model years 1964 - 1968 and all of these Transdrive boats were offered with the same power as the 18' Sea V. Even with a production of 425, which is considered a lot of boats in Chris Craft lore back in this era, the attrition rate starting immediately has certainly taken a toll and it probably peaked many years ago. Now the remaining boats are being lost at a slower rate simply due to the fact that there are less out there to lose now.

So now Glenn, you are digging into the rare of the rare, which is the outdrive system used by CC back then, which I guess is a Volvo system as noted by some of the others. This is not the most complicated device ever built, but quite honestly, it intimidates the heck out of me. I know you are in the machine shop business so this sort of device is probably childs-play for you, and if you are able to fix this thing or adapt it, whatever, my hat is off to you. From my Volvo experience, most all good during the 7 of them I've owned, expecially the solid lifter B18 versions, I would think the drivetrain may well be good for another 40 years, as they had (and have) the reputation for durability for sure.

And now for the "question of the day", with the outdrive (Transdrive) system like that, I am wondering if CC took the power from the front or rear of the crankshaft, and whether or not the motor had to be a RH or LH rotatioin. I see from the photos that the prop, itself, is a RH rotation, but did the motor spin LH on that application or was it spinning RH? I ask the question for general awareness and also to get you thinking in the event you are going after the power too, or going to swap out the whole thing.

Regards, best,

Paul






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Joined: June 7th, 2006, 2:28 am

December 27th, 2009, 4:35 am #5

Paul and all,

The Volvo outdrive shifts from forward, nuetral, and reverse in the top half or upper section of the drive. They designed it with straight cut gears so that it can turn either direction, under full load, without gear whine, You can change from a left hand to a right hand prop rotation simply by switching the linkage connection under the rear/ top cover. They use a cone clutch mounted on the top of the vertical shaft to accomplish this. More than likely the engine is a left/ standard rotation and the drive coupler pulls off the flywheel end. They are a fairly tough outdrive and simple in design. There is a splined shaft coupler that connects the 2 section vertical shafts together. That coupler is prone to failure if the prop strikes something hard or the drive is shifted with at high engine RPM. Hope this helps.

Greg Mason
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Glenn
Glenn

December 27th, 2009, 4:39 am #6

Hi Glenn, Hi guys,

I see the Sea V is getting some attention, and rightly so. It's a rare bird and there simply are NOT a lot of these left. If you drive around the countryside you'll see boats in back yards, boats in pastures open to the elements, boats in junk yards, boats out behind barns, etc., and I would dare say that most of them will never float again. The Sea V series is so old now, that most of them have long ago been lost behind barns and in pastures, so the ones that still exist in restorable condition are going to fit the definition of "rare", because there just were not all that many of them made 40+ years ago in the first place.

Looking at the Essential Guide, I see 130 of the 18' Sea V outdrive boats were built, with power options including the Buic 225B, Eaton 140, or OMC HUE 150. Guys, these things belong in the Smithsonian. Now I see 220 of the 20' inboard versions were built with 283 power, very similar to my 20' Sea Skiff design, and then another 425 of the Transdrive units were built during model years 1964 - 1968 and all of these Transdrive boats were offered with the same power as the 18' Sea V. Even with a production of 425, which is considered a lot of boats in Chris Craft lore back in this era, the attrition rate starting immediately has certainly taken a toll and it probably peaked many years ago. Now the remaining boats are being lost at a slower rate simply due to the fact that there are less out there to lose now.

So now Glenn, you are digging into the rare of the rare, which is the outdrive system used by CC back then, which I guess is a Volvo system as noted by some of the others. This is not the most complicated device ever built, but quite honestly, it intimidates the heck out of me. I know you are in the machine shop business so this sort of device is probably childs-play for you, and if you are able to fix this thing or adapt it, whatever, my hat is off to you. From my Volvo experience, most all good during the 7 of them I've owned, expecially the solid lifter B18 versions, I would think the drivetrain may well be good for another 40 years, as they had (and have) the reputation for durability for sure.

And now for the "question of the day", with the outdrive (Transdrive) system like that, I am wondering if CC took the power from the front or rear of the crankshaft, and whether or not the motor had to be a RH or LH rotatioin. I see from the photos that the prop, itself, is a RH rotation, but did the motor spin LH on that application or was it spinning RH? I ask the question for general awareness and also to get you thinking in the event you are going after the power too, or going to swap out the whole thing.

Regards, best,

Paul





You got a love this forum, everyone is the best. Thanks
I have heard the rotation could be changed in some of the older Volvo's by changing something in the drive? I will deffently look into that when I dig into it. What did they power them with, other than Volvo's?
Volvo did/does build well build stuff.



Glenn
FDA-36-039
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Paul
Paul

December 27th, 2009, 4:43 am #7

Hi Glenn, Hi guys,

I see the Sea V is getting some attention, and rightly so. It's a rare bird and there simply are NOT a lot of these left. If you drive around the countryside you'll see boats in back yards, boats in pastures open to the elements, boats in junk yards, boats out behind barns, etc., and I would dare say that most of them will never float again. The Sea V series is so old now, that most of them have long ago been lost behind barns and in pastures, so the ones that still exist in restorable condition are going to fit the definition of "rare", because there just were not all that many of them made 40+ years ago in the first place.

Looking at the Essential Guide, I see 130 of the 18' Sea V outdrive boats were built, with power options including the Buic 225B, Eaton 140, or OMC HUE 150. Guys, these things belong in the Smithsonian. Now I see 220 of the 20' inboard versions were built with 283 power, very similar to my 20' Sea Skiff design, and then another 425 of the Transdrive units were built during model years 1964 - 1968 and all of these Transdrive boats were offered with the same power as the 18' Sea V. Even with a production of 425, which is considered a lot of boats in Chris Craft lore back in this era, the attrition rate starting immediately has certainly taken a toll and it probably peaked many years ago. Now the remaining boats are being lost at a slower rate simply due to the fact that there are less out there to lose now.

So now Glenn, you are digging into the rare of the rare, which is the outdrive system used by CC back then, which I guess is a Volvo system as noted by some of the others. This is not the most complicated device ever built, but quite honestly, it intimidates the heck out of me. I know you are in the machine shop business so this sort of device is probably childs-play for you, and if you are able to fix this thing or adapt it, whatever, my hat is off to you. From my Volvo experience, most all good during the 7 of them I've owned, expecially the solid lifter B18 versions, I would think the drivetrain may well be good for another 40 years, as they had (and have) the reputation for durability for sure.

And now for the "question of the day", with the outdrive (Transdrive) system like that, I am wondering if CC took the power from the front or rear of the crankshaft, and whether or not the motor had to be a RH or LH rotatioin. I see from the photos that the prop, itself, is a RH rotation, but did the motor spin LH on that application or was it spinning RH? I ask the question for general awareness and also to get you thinking in the event you are going after the power too, or going to swap out the whole thing.

Regards, best,

Paul





When Chris Craft took over Thompson Boat Company of New York, they bought the rights to the Thompson R&D program with Volvo, which was actually quite developed at the time. The CC acquisition allowed the relationship with the manufacturer and parts suppliers to continue (as I imagine it now, 40+ years later) due to some pretty obscure products coming out with the CC name attached.

For instance, in 1964 a wood lapstrake boat that looked almost IDENTICAL to the later fiberglass versions, came out with a transdrive power system.

From a 1964 brochure, here are some interesting statements.


"The more you know about boats, the more you'll appreciate the Sea-V hull development in wood lapstrake. You get a deep comfort ride with unmatched steady speed and stability....more usable space, finely appointed with custom seating. Exciting charcoal gray hull with easy-care vinyl deck and flaired aluminum windshield. Six Sea-V models, from a sporty 18' Skiff to the elegantly outfitted 23' cruiser."

This wood lapstrake boat carried the "Thompson" name on the aft side panels. Wow, I'll bet there are darn few (if any) of these still out there. Painted up and side by side with my 1966 fiberglass version of this hull shape, it would be hard to tell which one was wood and which one was glass. The wood version had some higher level of detail, and I think it would be one heck of a collectible these days, if you could find one!

At this very moment, CC was also touting their first engtry into fiberglass runabouts, with a foam filled Corsair hull showing a scuba diver coming through a plug cut in the bottom of one of the hulls, and the new 20' XL-200, which was the first of the 20' hulls like my 1966 20' fiberglass Sea Skiff, all built under the same roof in Cortland, NY. This sure gives creedence that the fiberglass hull was actually pulled from a wood hull.

The XL-200 Corsair of 1964, had a small block Ford V8 from Eaton, with 140 hp. The renderings show an operable front hatch and raised nose rail around the bow. Glenn's boat has the raised nose rail, but I am not sure if any of these boats actually got the operable front hatch, as virtually all of them I have seen has a vestige of this, showing a hint of a hatch there in fiberglass, but it is a cast in piece and not something that can be actually used for access. The shape actually probably helps give strength.

This acquisition, transition from wood to fiberglass, and the onset of sport boat manufacturing in Cortland, NY, are reasons I like the early boats from Cortland so much. Of course, great lines and performance have something to do with it too. Any Commander owners out there who are looking for a runabout, and you know we ALL need at least one, could do worse than consider one of the early boats from Cortland, New York, to compliment your Commander. There are some very nice Corsair and Lancer models out there to pick from, and even a few fiberglass Sea Skiffs too.

Regards,

Paul



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Glenn
Glenn

December 27th, 2009, 4:55 am #8

Paul and all,

The Volvo outdrive shifts from forward, nuetral, and reverse in the top half or upper section of the drive. They designed it with straight cut gears so that it can turn either direction, under full load, without gear whine, You can change from a left hand to a right hand prop rotation simply by switching the linkage connection under the rear/ top cover. They use a cone clutch mounted on the top of the vertical shaft to accomplish this. More than likely the engine is a left/ standard rotation and the drive coupler pulls off the flywheel end. They are a fairly tough outdrive and simple in design. There is a splined shaft coupler that connects the 2 section vertical shafts together. That coupler is prone to failure if the prop strikes something hard or the drive is shifted with at high engine RPM. Hope this helps.

Greg Mason
Thanks

Glenn
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Paul
Paul

December 27th, 2009, 5:04 am #9

You got a love this forum, everyone is the best. Thanks
I have heard the rotation could be changed in some of the older Volvo's by changing something in the drive? I will deffently look into that when I dig into it. What did they power them with, other than Volvo's?
Volvo did/does build well build stuff.



Glenn
FDA-36-039
The CC 225 was a Buick V6, and Eaton had a variety of options including the B-18 volvo derived 4 cylinder bruiser with 80-hp, and they also had a six cylinder version not sure if this was V6 or I6, and also a small Ford V8 of 221 cubic inches, and then 260, including a 272 and 312 V8 version, finally onward to the big blocks with 352 and 390 cubes, the latter with 300-hp.

Eaton Dearborn Marine (Interceptor) motors were used in Century boats, as well as a few early Chris Crafts. As noted earlier, the 18' and 20' version of the early Corsair hulls used the same power offerings, which were a choice of 225B (Guess the B designation stood for Buick), Eaton 140 or OMC HUE 150. The inboard 20' versions of the hull got a 283 or 327 V8.

Regards,

Paul
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Didier
Didier

December 27th, 2009, 11:56 am #10

Paul and all,

The Volvo outdrive shifts from forward, nuetral, and reverse in the top half or upper section of the drive. They designed it with straight cut gears so that it can turn either direction, under full load, without gear whine, You can change from a left hand to a right hand prop rotation simply by switching the linkage connection under the rear/ top cover. They use a cone clutch mounted on the top of the vertical shaft to accomplish this. More than likely the engine is a left/ standard rotation and the drive coupler pulls off the flywheel end. They are a fairly tough outdrive and simple in design. There is a splined shaft coupler that connects the 2 section vertical shafts together. That coupler is prone to failure if the prop strikes something hard or the drive is shifted with at high engine RPM. Hope this helps.

Greg Mason
absolutly right explanation,the black box you see on the second photo is the electric motor to lift the z drive, and there is a security lever with springs which release the drive if you hurt something under water
excuse my language !
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